Weekend Numbers | 19.4 M FATE OF THE FURIOUS | 12 M HOW TO BE LATIN LOVER | 10.1 M BAAHUBALI II | 9.3 M THE CIRCLE

[Barnack]

19 minutes ago, WrathOfHan said:

The Judge had a 50M budget though, so it barely made any money once you factor in the home market.

 

Budget is not that good indication to calculate a person draw, specially if a large part of that budget is the person salary (bottom the line budget could be, those help to have nicer trailer).

 

Firstly, it is rare that we known the movie budget, but moreso people do not go see that type of movie knowing is budget or caring about it, if tomorrow there is a leak that The Judge net budget was in fact of $27m and that it made a nice little profit, that change absolutely nothing about RDJ star powers.

 

How much the very same movie frame by frame and trailers would have made with unknown actor relative to how much it made is more what determine the star power, not profitability (that why people will say that X that had the lead role in the last Harry Potter movie is not necessarily a draw even thought the movie made 200 million in profit).

Edited April 28, 2017 by Barnack

[Barnack]

12 minutes ago, TalismanRing said:

 

It made more than it would have with an actor who was not a draw - even if the budget was $30m less - that's the point.

 

It made twice as much as Joy in (US) home release.. and did a little more WW. 

 

 

 

You are probably looking at first weekend instead of the movies totals or something like that ?

 

Joy

Domestic: $56m

WW: $101m

 

The Judge

Domestic: $47m

WW: $84m

Edited April 28, 2017 by Barnack

[Alli]

1 minute ago, Barnack said:

 

You are probably looking at first weekend instead ot eh movie totall ?

 

Joy

Domestic: $56m

WW: $101m

 

The Judge

Domestic: $47m

WW: $84m

Keep in mind that RDJ is in his 50s. His drawing power is beginning to diminish. Youth is the primary target of box office. It will be interesting to see how long these A list stars can keep up with the new crop of actors.

[TalismanRing]

2 minutes ago, Barnack said:

 

You are probably looking at first weekend instead ot eh movie totall ?

 

Joy

Domestic: $56m

WW: $101m

 

The Judge

Domestic: $47m

WW: $84m

 

Thanks, I meant Joy made more WW (I lost a pivotal word or two there) , though I thought it was $90m and not $101.

[AniNate]

Starpower still exists, but people make the mistake of thinking it means any movie with a certain actor in it will be profitable. It just means they'll draw more people in than a no-name would.

 

I'd compare it to the sabermetric WAR statistic. A single player can make the team better, but they can't make them a pennant contender

[The Panda]

10 minutes ago, Barnack said:

 

 

Has for being type casted and only be a draw in a thin margin that you cannot get out of, it is certainly true, one other aspect is your fanbase movie going habit.

 

When you became a star in a large blockbuster franchise type of movie, there is a chance that a vast part of your audience are the type of audience that go 4 time or less a year in theater and only for the biggest event movie. You can still be a draw in an other event blockbuster, but not necessarily outside that type of release.

 

When you achieve a couple of success in something that are seen among people that are more the type to often go to theater and watch say every movies The Coens will do, without having any rules about not watching X type of movie in theater, they will follow you more easily and their need of an spectacular trailer threshold that make them go to theater is much lower.

 

Id argue from a profit standpoint, you're better off as an actor if you are typecasted.  That way when people see your name, they have an idea what they're getting and will go.

 

Being able to draw consistent audiences like Rogen, DiCaprio or McCarthy is better than having a few smashes.

[franfar]

2 minutes ago, The Panda said:

 

Id argue from a profit standpoint, you're better off as an actor if you are typecasted.  That way when people see your name, they have an idea what they're getting and will go.

 

Being able to draw consistent audiences like Rogen, DiCaprio or McCarthy is better than having a few smashes.

But if people start to get tired of your role/shtick/genre, then you're screwed.

[ACSlater]

DiCaprio is in a league by himself right now

[TalismanRing]

Just now, Alli said:

Keep in mind that RDJ is in his 50s. His drawing power is beginning to diminish. Youth is the primary target of box office. It will be interesting to see how long these A list stars can keep up with the new crop of actors.

 

His last movie just did $1.15 BILLION  - more than twice as much as JLaw's last SH movie and more than any movie she's ever been in and he's made three movies that have made even more.  Also, he didn't start making $ until his 40s with IM so he was hardly youthful then.    The landscape for actors and actresses is different in regards to age.  On average actresses in their 20s get more leads and meaty roles than actors in their 20s, by their 30s it changes and by their 40s it's completely flipped - because there are new actresses in their 20s taking roles from 30 and 40 yr old actress (like JLaw has built a career on doing)

 

The other aspect is home video - The Judge doubled Joy - probably not just in the US.  Established older draws often do better on Home media - because the older part of their audience still buys it in a greater proportion.   That's why all these low theater grossing or VOD/DTV movies with older stars still get made - knowing they won't make much in theatrical - if anything.

 

 

 

 

[grey ghost]

No early Friday estimates FOR THE BIGGEST WEEKEND OF THE YEAR???? 

[trifle]

19 minutes ago, TalismanRing said:

 by their 30s it changes and by their 40s it's completely flipped - because there are new actresses in their 20s taking roles from 30 and 40 yr old actress (like JLaw has built a career on doing)
 

 

 

 

 

 

FWIW Jen only 'took' one role an older actress might have gotten, SLP.  Her roles in AH and Joy were written for her, specifically.  And in Joy she went from 18 to 30s with only an epilogue at about 40. No one fits all those age groups. She was older IRL than Katniss and Ree Dolly (Winter's Bone), and Mystique is a shapeshifter who can look any age she cares to.  In Red Sparrow, she is the age of the book character, but her love interest is also supposed to be in his mid-20s.  He will be played by Joel Edgarton, so you might be right about few roles for younger actors.

 

Jen will also turn 35 eventually, and she knows it.  Maybe I'm wrong in reading your comment as resenting her for getting jobs, but I think you are looking at the wrong person as being responsible for the situation.

Edited April 28, 2017 by trifle

[Barnack]

45 minutes ago, Alli said:

Keep in mind that RDJ is in his 50s. His drawing power is beginning to diminish. Youth is the primary target of box office. It will be interesting to see how long these A list stars can keep up with the new crop of actors.

 

I don't know, almost every actor that are a draw today are people that were already stars in the 90's (even Dwayne Johnson but in wrestling instead of movies), the new crop of actors do not seem to affect the older one much yet, specially on the male actor side, there is no star male actor below 30, and below 35 they are not common.

 

Youth will normally starting to be smaller and smaller part of the BO in the current demography trend, the over 60 is the biggest growing demography of ticket sold (it went from 122 million ticket in 2005 to 184.8 million ticket in 2015 in that demography), at least domestic and the proportion of above 25 year's old first weekend metric are getting bigger and bigger.

 

Liam Neesson had is best drawing power in is late 50's early 60's, he became for a while an action movie star at 57 when the first Taken movie was released, Keanu Reeve is making somewhat a comeback, the new crop didn't really take the place of the 80s/90s stars yet and maybe will never do, that younger generation of film goer not caring about actor/director has much has the franchise name.

  

Edited April 28, 2017 by Barnack

[babz06]

Why are you comparing Jlaw to rdj anyway? They're at different stages in their careers. Jlaw probably only has a very small window of it girl status. She's a modern day Julia Roberts. 

Meanwhile RDJ will continue working well into retirement age. 

[Barnack]

18 minutes ago, TalismanRing said:

 

Established older draws often do better on Home media 

 

We never know home media numbers, there is some estimate made by the numbers.com about physical sales, but now that they are less than half of home video sales (and even less when it come to rental+streaming) it could be a misleading metric to use (always has been but even more now).

 

Older star probably sales more on physical than younger one, but it does not mean that they sold that more overall on HE or getting better price on Netflix.

[trifle]

9 minutes ago, Barnack said:

 

We never know home media numbers, there is some estimate made by the numbers.com about physical sales, but now that they are less than half of home video sales (and even less when it come to rental+streaming) it could be a misleading metric to use (always has been but even more now).

 

Older star probably sales more on physical than younger one, but it does not mean that they sold that more overall on HE or getting better price on Netflix.

 

I would think that videos that have been out longer would naturally have sold more than those out a shorter time, as well, particularly given the recent boom in live streaming video.  That didn't used to be an available option.

 

Not to mention, in Joy's case specifically, there was an UHQ screener leak widely available on the internet over a month before the movie first screened to the public.

Edited April 28, 2017 by trifle

[Alli]

7 minutes ago, babz06 said:

Why are you comparing Jlaw to rdj anyway? They're at different stages in their careers. Jlaw probably only has a very small window of it girl status. She's a modern day Julia Roberts. 

Meanwhile RDJ will continue working well into retirement age. 

It depends if she wants more. Julia cooled off because she started a family.   JL could be like Meryl Streep and act at a high level in her 60s. Depends what she wants

[TalismanRing]

13 minutes ago, trifle said:

 

FWIW Jen only 'took' one role an older actress might have gotten, SLP.  Her roles in AH and Joy were written for her, specifically.  And in Joy she went from 18 to 30s with only an epilogue at about 40. No one fits all those age groups. She was older IRL than Katniss, and Mystique is a shapeshifter who can look any age she cares to.  In Red Sparrow, she is the age of the book character, but her love interest is also supposed to be in his mid-20s.  He will be played by Joel Edgarton, so you might be right about few roles for younger actors.

 

Jen will also turn 35 eventually, and she knows it.  Maybe I'm wrong in reading your comment as resenting her for getting jobs, but I think you are looking at the wrong person as being responsible for the situation.

 

Actors and actresses can only take what they are given and it's  a damn competitive business.  I place no blame on them.  It's just the current landscape of film.  As you say Edgerton got a role that should have gone to an actor in their 20s.  Those actors for the most part are stuck playing HS and college kids.   Joy Mangano invented the Miracle Mop in her mid 30s.  AH should have also gone to an actress in her 30s, the character's background and relationships didn't fit her age.  But Russel wanted Jen.  

 

 

[Alli]

1 minute ago, TalismanRing said:

 

Actors and actresses can only take what they are given and it's  a damn competitive business.  I place no blame on them.  It's just the current landscape of film.  As you say Edgerton got a role that should have gone to an actor in their 20s.  Those actors for the most part are stuck playing HS and college kids.   Joy Mangano invented the Miracle Mop in her mid 30s.  AH should have also gone to an actress in her 30s, the character's background and relationships didn't fit her age.  But Russel wanted Jen.  

 

 

And in JL's case it shows on screen. She's miscast in so many roles. I don't understand how she's so highly regarded for roles she shouldn't be playing because she doesn't fit the character. oh well...

[trifle]

2 minutes ago, TalismanRing said:

 

Actors and actresses can only take what they are given and it's  a damn competitive business.  I place no blame on them.  It's just the current landscape of film.  As you say Edgerton got a role that should have gone to an actor in their 20s.  Those actors for the most part are stuck playing HS and college kids.   Joy Mangano invented the Miracle Mop in her mid 30s.  AH should have also gone to an actress in her 30s, the character's background and relationships didn't fit her age.  But Russel wanted Jen.  

 

 

 

Fox wanted Jen too. The movie was greenlit because of Jen.  In those circumstances it is hard to say someone else should have gotten the role. And Russel altered the script so Joy never went to college, whereas the real Joy did and didn't get married etc until after that. It wasn't strictly following Joy's story, including on her age. Regardless, I was just reacting to your consistent use of Jen as your sole example.  It is obvious to anyone that the disparity you are talking about exists.  And every veteran big name actress I know of except Meryl Streep benefited when they were younger (a short window) and suffered from it ever after.  Maybe Helen Mirren.

[trifle]

4 minutes ago, Alli said:

And in JL's case it shows on screen. She's miscast in so many roles. I don't understand how she's so highly regarded for roles she shouldn't be playing because she doesn't fit the character. oh well...

 

When the roles are written for her it is hard to see it as miscasting.  Also, I've never seen her play a character she didn't make her own.  Most of the ones people complain about, she got Academy Award Nominations for.