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CJohn

Terminator: Genisys (2015)

Terminator Genisys  

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If you create an alternate timeline from a point in the past, all remnants of the original timeline in the future cease to be. John Connor cannot exist without Kyle and Sarah fornicating therefore he is unavailable to be turned by Skynet.

 

Explained in Back to the Future 2: You try travelling to the future to prevent something from the future from going to the past that created an alternate timeline, you end up travelling to the future of that alternate timeline.

LOL when did Back to the Future make all the rules of time travel. Considering the John we see in 2017 is a machine and not human. Who's more a computer copy version of a man that once existed in a previous timeline. We don't know the rules of alternative time travel.When it comes to a machine and the data they created in previous timelines.

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LOL when did Back to the Future make all the rules of time travel. Considering the John we see in 2017 is a machine and not human. Who's more a computer copy version of a man that once existed in a previous timeline. We don't know the rules of alternative time travel.When it comes to a machine and the data they created in previous timelines.

You're acting like Skynet is somehow a cross between the Omega hive mind and Ultron, like it's somehow capable of recording data from multiple timelines. You're gonna tell me that Skynet has alien origins?

The Terminator series now just seems to be changing its own time travel rules for its own convenience.

Star Trek '09 made it clear it was inter-dimensional time travel and that Nimoy Spock was clearly from another dimension as he had no memory of a feud between his younger self and Kirk. The Terminator series can't figure out its own rules and it raises questions it can't answer, or won't answer now because it's pretentious and assumes it'll have a sequel.

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You're acting like Skynet is somehow a cross between the Omega hive mind and Ultron, like it's somehow capable of recording data from multiple timelines. You're gonna tell me that Skynet has alien origins?

The Terminator series now just seems to be changing its own time travel rules for its own convenience.

Star Trek '09 made it clear it was inter-dimensional time travel and that Nimoy Spock was clearly from another dimension as he had no memory of a feud between his younger self and Kirk. The Terminator series can't figure out its own rules and it raises questions it can't answer, or won't answer now because it's pretentious and assumes it'll have a sequel.

We don't know what Skynet has become. This movie leaves some questions open to be answered. I don't see why it couldn't have evolved to being as advanced as Alien type technology. What makes alien technology so special is it's so many years of anything man could create. But why couldn't something like Skynet grow into something like that over the years? Especially considering everything they've created already. Star Trek is very simple with time travel since there going back through worm holes. You don't have super machine around trying to rig there fate like Skynet. What I believe the new writers are doing here and trying to grow the franchise. Cameron had a very simple set of rules and he based his two movies off that. The problem is even Cameron had issues developing new stories off the rules he created. So there trying to add to the story. Through evolution of the machines over time.

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If you create an alternate timeline from a point in the past, all remnants of the original timeline in the future cease to be. John Connor cannot exist without Kyle and Sarah fornicating therefore he is unavailable to be turned by Skynet.

 

Explained in Back to the Future 2: You try travelling to the future to prevent something from the future from going to the past that created an alternate timeline, you end up travelling to the future of that alternate timeline.

 

You do realize that you are citing "Back To the Future 2" as if its something you read out of your College Science Textbook right?

 

There are a myriad of interpretations of time travel both in fictional works and in scientific theory.  That's like complaining about Interstellar because they handled space time mechanics differently than they do in Star Trek.

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Explained in Back to the Future 2: You try travelling to the future to prevent something from the future from going to the past that created an alternate timeline, you end up travelling to the future of that alternate timeline.

 

Except Back to the Future 2 breaks this rule by having Old Biff travel back to Original 2015 after changing the past in Original 1955. By the rules he should have ended up in New 2015, but since Marty and Doc had to have their time machine to travel back to New 1985, the film ignores the rules it later establishes.

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We don't know what Skynet has become. This movie leaves some questions open to be answered. I don't see why it couldn't have evolved to being as advanced as Alien type technology. What makes alien technology so special is it's so many years of anything man could create. But why couldn't something like Skynet grow into something like that over the years? Especially considering everything they've created already. Star Trek is very simple with time travel since there going back through worm holes. You don't have super machine around trying to rig there fate like Skynet. What I believe the new writers are doing here and trying to grow the franchise. Cameron had a very simple set of rules and he based his two movies off that. The problem is even Cameron had issues developing new stories off the rules he created. So there trying to add to the story. Through evolution of the machines over time.

Cameron was smart enough to know to keep it simple. This is jumping the shark. Nuking the fridge. The new writers think they're smart, but in creating what they have here, they come off as pretentious. This is why it should have ended at 2.

 

Skynet was man made, therefore would have limitations. I don't buy that it can be like some fantasy alien time jumper, and if it somehow can be like that, or it is revealed to have alien origins, then it is nuking the fridge just to have it compete with today's more popular franchises. Ultron was a far superior artificial intelligence compared to what they're making out Skynet to be now, and at least they were upfront with him being part alien in origin.

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Except Back to the Future 2 breaks this rule by having Old Biff travel back to Original 2015 after changing the past in Original 1955. By the rules he should have ended up in New 2015, but since Marty and Doc had to have their time machine to travel back to New 1985, the film ignores the rules it later establishes.

It doesn't ignore it at all, but for there to even be a rest of the movie they HAVE to break the rules to tell the story they wanted to tell. You have to do that sometimes.

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Also, consider these two statements you keep relying upon to justify the story making sense:

1. Skynet can gather data across multiple timelines.
2. Skynet turns John Connor because they're tired of failing at erasing his existence.

If Skynet could gather data across multiple timelines, surely it has to know that Kyle Reese is John's biological father. So if Skynet wanted to erase John's existence, it had the *PERFECT* opportunity to do so when that Alpha Terminator was just standing in the *SAME FRICKIN' ROOM* as Kyle. But instead of executing Kyle right there, he just lets Kyle go through the time warp and infects John. They don't *need* John Connor to be their T-3000, also. They can make anyone a T-3000.

Explain to me how that doesn't make Skynet look like the dumbest artificial intelligence in movie history, like they haven't devolved from artificial intelligence to artificial desperation, desperation at the cost of legitimate intelligence.

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Grade: C

 

Like any other child of the 80's Terminator is one of those beloved franchises. Unlike other children of the 80's I could see beyond Arnold and see the saga as being more than just him. His presence was great when the story required it and for many their largest single complaint on Salvation was...no Arnold. Well we got Arnold in T:G and yet where are those folks? The movie opened at #3. I digress.

 

Terminator Genysis suffers from all the wobbly reverse storytelling it does in order to then go down a similar, yet different road. A worse road. Regardless of what one thinks of T3 or T4 the one thing they both did was continue to move the story and mythos forward. Forward towards the Future War and the promise of John Connor as the warrior savior of mankind. 

 

The film feels a bit like Star Trek 11('09") in that it's not ignoring the prior films as there are visuals and referenced bits of history from within. T:G uses it's divergent point as altering when Sarah gets priority treatment for protection...9yr old Sarah in '73 vs '84. However, somehow 2029 John doesn't know this, further more why does 2029 John exist cause Sarah and Kyle don't have the sex that leads to John. Instead they + Pops jump ahead to 2017. John in 2029 just simply should not exist, however, he does and he only still knows about jumping back to '84.

I'm sure that "explanation" lies in the quantum alternate timeline verbiage Pops is spouting, that's what the writers would tell me. It still needs to make sense and it doesn't. If it wasn't trying to tie into the existing mythos it'd be fine, but it is doing that, which leads to the cluster.

 

Also, the random T-1000 that's around. Is it the same one sent back to '73 that 'Pops' stopped? Was he lying in wait for '84 to happen? Again, that being the case the timeline should be changed even more from that point that the '84 entry point wouldn't exist cause the leap to '17 would happen meaning no John in 2029...but all that still exists, somehow. The writers are heavily crutching the story up on this Quantum Timeline stuff. AKA...just go with it. 

 

So what's the game plan now?

In 2017 they destroyed(or did they, see credit sequence) Cyberdyne and Genysis BUT the Dysons are still alive. Yes both Myles and Danny live and I'm to believe that they don't have back up files somewhere off site. I've worked for two large corporations and both stored sensitive data in an offsite facility miles away.

So with no '84 chip for Cyberdyne to use, JD in '97 is delayed...delayed until 2017 but then and only then cause Connor-nator comes back to '17 to ensure that it does. So why '17? Why not jump to '95 and allow JD to still happen in '97? Clearly the early internet still existed to allow it to happen. 

If the Terminator saga is constant on anything it's that sometimes fate can't be stopped. Judgement Day will happen so when is it now? If Sarah and Kyle gave birth to John asap he'd be born in '18 so the "new" Future War in this timeline should be set in the 2040's. 

 

It's a cluster of a film and I'm moderately saddened that the original movement of the story with the Future War and battle with Skynet isn't going to fully be realized. With a final film ending with John sending Kyle back to '84. 

 

Ranking: 

T2 - set the bar for an action sic-fi invasion flick

T1- is really a horror film at it's core, killer unstoppable robot, whose story and acting make it more than it's premise

T4 - moving the story to the foretold Future War, films ending realizing the promise of John as leader of the resistance

T3 - it's odd handling of camp elements still advances thing up till that daring last shot: JD happens

T5 - it's muddled fan service of a story with wooden and unemotional acting makes one wonder...are they all robots?

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Awesome Terminator film, the best since T2. A-

 

For me this was as good as T1. I thought the whole plot with Skynet's human manifestation and the alternate timelines was genius. To me it made sense. With regards to Skynet, this is the FIRST Terminator film in the entire franchise that tackles the so-called elephant in the room, that is Skynet's knowledge of time travel. Knowing how intelligent Skynet is, none of the previous films ever touched upon Skynet's understanding and knowledge of time travel. This film though does it beautifully, and it ends up as a logical progression from T2. Obviously with an A.I. as advanced as Skynet, it would eventually figure out why its time travel plots were failing, and would figure out how to outsmart the humans with regards to time travel and counter plots by the humans. This is probably why Cameron liked it.

 

Also old Arnold lines aside, I thought all of Arnold's new lines were quite fresh, and I thought the comedy was quite good. I think everyone else did a solid acting job too, even Courtney.

 

Initially this looked like a disaster with early marketing, but later marketing saved it I think. With the official Cameron endorsement, and the final trailers really sealing it for me.

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