Fanboy Wars Thread: Personal Attacks not allowed | With Digital Fur Technology

[Darth Lehnsherr]

Loving the Watchmen show so far especially whenever Jeremy Irons is onscreen. Also got me to reread the comic again

[TMP]

8 minutes ago, Darth Lehnsherr said:

Loving the Watchmen show so far especially whenever Jeremy Irons is onscreen. Also got me to reread the comic again

I re-read the comic two weeks ago and it was so much sadder than I remembered. Got pretty sad when I finished reading the issue about Laurie's past told by Manhattan

[WittyUsername]

1 hour ago, TMP said:

He's playing around with some incredibly volatile themes pretty insightfully so far, if he pulls this off through the ninth episode I think it's gonna be something really special.

Speaking of Watchmen I checked out some of Doomsday Clock recently and... wow, it makes me appreciate the show even more. I don't know what that thing was trying to do

It’s been three and a half years since the Watchmen characters were integrated into the DC universe and I still can’t decide if I should be absolutely frustrated by that decision or if I should be impressed that it took DC 30 years to do that.

[TMP]

1 minute ago, WittyUsername said:

It’s been three and a half years since the Watchmen characters were integrated into the DC universe and I still can’t decide if I should be absolutely frustrated by that decision or if I should be impressed that it took DC 30 years to do that.

I hate it so much, god damn it why do we need Dr. Manhattan fighting Superman. Nite Owl, an impotent man who can only get his rocks off in furry cosplay, is now a member of the Justice League. Why. 

[WittyUsername]

1 minute ago, TMP said:

I hate it so much, god damn it why do we need Dr. Manhattan fighting Superman. Nite Owl, an impotent man who can only get his rocks off in furry cosplay, is now a member of the Justice League. Why. 

I guess the intention (beyond serving as a marketing stunt) is to essentially call out the role that Watchmen supposedly played in superhero stories becoming more dark and depressing. There’s this belief that people like Alan Moore are to blame for this tendency in the past 30 years of making superhero stories these dark and edgy deconstructions that try too hard to shake off their image as goofy stories for kids. As a result, having Dr. Manhattan be the one responsible for the New 52 being such a cynical and depressing nightmare is meant to serve as meta commentary on the state of comics in the aftermath of Watchmen. 

[TMP]

13 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

I guess the intention (beyond serving as a marketing stunt) is to essentially call out the role that Watchmen supposedly played in superhero stories becoming more dark and depressing. There’s this belief that people like Alan Moore are to blame for this tendency in the past 30 years of making superhero stories these dark and edgy deconstructions that try too hard to shake off their image as goofy stories for kids. As a result, having Dr. Manhattan be the one responsible for the New 52 being such a cynical and depressing nightmare is meant to serve as meta commentary on the state of comics in the aftermath of Watchmen. 

Yeah, but it feels so incredibly antithetical to the themes and reality of the original series. Not to mention that Action Comics exists in the New York of Watchmen, so Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster exist in that world too. If Geoff Johns' thesis was that Watchmen was responsible for dark & gritty DC then he should have just written a monograph or something

[The Futurist]

Finally saw The Joker :

 

 My Review :

 

Great dancing.

[AnDr3s]

100+m budget nice

 

[MattW]

Not sure where else to post this roundtable

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/hollywood-reporter-executive-roundtable-7-major-studio-chiefs-1250718

Quote

Fewer now, though. Unlike for most of Hollywood history, it's really hard to release a bad movie and have it be successful. Do you agree?

DONNA LANGLEY Absolutely.

GIANOPULOS By Thursday evening, you know the verdict. And so does everyone else. Social media lights up. It becomes an audience consensus. Right or wrong.

LANGLEY Five or 10 years ago, if it was a visual effects movie and it had a certain amount of spectacle, then it was anticipated it would do really well in certain parts of the world. That bar is now really high. Comedy could be, "We'll just slap it together, production values don't have to be that high." And I just don't think that's the case anymore.

TOM ROTHMAN Nowadays, good movies aren't good enough. I am not sure you ever really got away with a movie that genuinely was a significant disappointment. But it certainly used to be that if you made a good movie, it was OK [financially]. And I don't think those of us still in the theatrical business can settle for good anymore.

EMMERICH Also the floor has dropped. If you have a big movie with big stars, you can miss now and open to single digits.

HORN There is a finite amount of leisure time. So when the number of films available increases very dramatically … Scott —

SCOTT STUBER (Laughs.)

EMMERICH Jen …

JENNIFER SALKE Also … Scott …

STUBER And Alan soon …

HORN … That amount of leisure time impacts choices.

GIANOPULOS You are also working without a net. It used to be that you had this ancillary business, particularly in the heyday of [home] video, where you were filling a pipeline. There was always some amount of money that you could look to. And that's not the same anymore.

ROTHMAN I wouldn't even say that the floor is low. I would say there is no floor. On the other hand, the ceiling is higher than it's ever been. Big hits are bigger. And big misses are bigger.

 

Interesting throughout.

 

[MattW]

You recently said that if Netflix spends $60 million on a movie, to be successful it should be watched by 30 million accounts. That's the first time I have heard you talk about the success metric for a Netflix film. Does that formula apply across the board?

STUBER No. Each film, like for all of us, the P&Ls are different. Having been on both sides — the theatrical business and now streaming — there is so much out there for the consumer that we are fighting for time. The assumption is that it's easier [at Netflix] because I don't [have box office pressure]. But we have our own tracking. We have our own anxiety. We have our own opening weekend. That was a rough estimate, but different things take different marketing aspects.

So what do you look at on Monday morning after a big film debuts on the service?

STUBER We value over a month, basically. We look at 28 days and because we can see where things are opportunistic, we can market toward it. We can market in the second and third weeks as well. We greenlight off of X money and how much we are going to spend. And we hope that this many people watch in that 28 days. And that's our success rate metric.

Take a film like The Irishman. That's been gestating for a long time, it was at several different studios, and you took it on for about $150 million. It's three and a half hours long. What is the success metric for that film?

STUBER There are a lot of variables. When I took the job [in 2017], I was building a new studio. We have no IP, we have no library, we can't remake things. We don't have the great cache that Alan has over there. So you have to say, what is your opportunity? And your opportunity is filmmakers. For us to get Marty [Scorsese] at Netflix was a big thing. It was a big win. So that was one thing. And then the economics. We have enough subscribers that we think the movie can deliver on. Thankfully he over-delivered.

 

Jim, you are smiling. You gave that film up.

GIANOPULOS Yeah. Well, before my time, but nevertheless. It was very ambitious for a studio to take on a project like that. There is a different perception of the economics. For us, at that level, for a period drama — or for anyone, I would submit — it was ambitious. And it was perhaps too ambitious.

EMMERICH That's where the consumer wins. I don't think any of the studios could make that movie at that cost at that length and come out alive.

GIANOPULOS Right.

EMMERICH But it works for Netflix for the reason that Scott said.

As people who have spent your careers in the theatrical movie business, doesn't it bum you out that you can't make The Irishman?

LANGLEY You know, it actually doesn't. It would bum me out if no one made the movie.

HORN That's right.

LANGLEY That's what's really exciting about our entire ecosystem right now, even though it is giving us the headaches and sleepless nights. It's never been a better time for filmmakers and storytelling and for things to find their way into the world that were getting squeezed over the last five or six years or even longer.

EMMERICH The only difference for us, and maybe for the average consumer — I'll bet everyone at this table wants to see The Irishman in a theater.

LANGLEY Yeah.

EMMERICH And it will be available, to some extent. Or we'll get invited to Scott's house.

STUBER You're all invited. (Laughs.)

[MattW]

Is there is any movie star that is as important as strong IP?

ROTHMAN Yeah, I think there are lots of movie stars. It's one of the great myths propagated out there that movie stars don't matter. I would say movie stars in the right role with the right property matter more than ever before.

So you would trade the Spider-Man property for every Leo DiCaprio movie for the rest of his career?

ALL (Laughter.)

ROTHMAN I'd love to have both.

EMMERICH Who is he negotiating with?

ROTHMAN Well, I can tell you this. The event nature of having Leo and Brad [Pitt] and Margot [Robbie] in [Sony's] Once Upon a Time in Hollywood was essential. You had to make a great movie … but that movie was not based on any IP at all. That is a pure original. Came out of the imagination and the headspace of one individual. Because even Disney will run out of animated movies to remake. And we have to be careful not to narrow our audience, not to think that there isn't room for originality. I think there is. In the pursuit of that, movie stars are tremendously valuable.

EMMERICH The thing that we all sit around talking about is "theatricality." IP and movie stars are two huge ingredients. You have to have one or the other. It's even better if you have both.

[cdsacken]

On 10/28/2019 at 7:22 PM, Zakiyyah6 said:

I like Man of Steel but I completely get why it has a mixed reception. A couple of key changes and Man of Steel probably would have had okay word of mouth and reached 350mil. WB had a chance to fix what people's issues were with Man of Steel in a Batman/Superman team up film but instead they kept Zack Snyder on and allowed him to thumb his nose at people with legitimate criticisms and Batman v Superman paid the price at the box office after opening weekend. And so did Justice League. He's just a proudly palorizing director. Watchmen, Mos, BvS. All got the same reception to varying degrees.

Having Superman let his dad die no reason. Choppy action scenes. Superman murdering another person. Lots of reasons why. Take out those 3 problems and it goes from C+ to A- for me.

[Darth Lehnsherr]

 

[TMP]

3 hours ago, AnDr3s said:

100+m budget nice

 

Sounds cringe tbh

[dudalb]

On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 7:22 PM, Zakiyyah6 said:

I like Man of Steel but I completely get why it has a mixed reception. A couple of key changes and Man of Steel probably would have had okay word of mouth and reached 350mil. WB had a chance to fix what people's issues were with Man of Steel in a Batman/Superman team up film but instead they kept Zack Snyder on and allowed him to thumb his nose at people with legitimate criticisms and Batman v Superman paid the price at the box office after opening weekend. And so did Justice League. He's just a proudly palorizing director. Watchmen, Mos, BvS. All got the same reception to varying degrees.

This. I overall liked MOS, but hoped that Snyder would cut out the "Supes feeling sorry for himself" angle in the next film. Instead, Snyder doubled down on it and made Superman into basically a clone of Dr.Manhattan from "Watchmen". Snyder great weakness is that he misreads character so much.

[dudalb]

On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 8:38 PM, TMP said:

He's playing around with some incredibly volatile themes pretty insightfully so far, if he pulls this off through the ninth episode I think it's gonna be something really special.

Speaking of Watchmen I checked out some of Doomsday Clock recently and... wow, it makes me appreciate the show even more. I don't know what that thing was trying to do

When Doomsday Clock decided to send the Watchmen into the DC universe, I just gave up on it. That went against everything Moore was trying to do with Watchmen.

I am really surprised onhow much I am liking the Watchmen TV show. Lindlof "gets" the Watchmen in a way that neither Snyder or the people who did 'The Doomsday CLock" did. Now if he can just avoid his tendacy to blow it in the ninth inning....

[dudalb]

On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 10:24 PM, TMP said:

Yeah, but it feels so incredibly antithetical to the themes and reality of the original series. Not to mention that Action Comics exists in the New York of Watchmen, so Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster exist in that world too. If Geoff Johns' thesis was that Watchmen was responsible for dark & gritty DC then he should have just written a monograph or something

Although in the Watchmen universe Superman pretty much flops and Superheros never become popular. 

Instead, Pirates become the most popular genre in comics.

In fact in one of the not comic book chapters of Watchmen , Oanymandius says that the American public have never embraced superheros in the comics in a big way.

[Menor the Destroyer]

Rewatched TDKR for the first time in a while and it's just criminally underrated on the internet.

[dudalb]

7 minutes ago, Menor said:

Rewatched TDKR for the first time in a while and it's just criminally underrated on the internet.

Rewatched TDKR and my opinion remains unchanged; Great first two thrids of a movie but Nolan messes up the last third. 

Just to much WTF stuff I could not buy. 

Edited October 30, 2019 by dudalb

[WittyUsername]

57 minutes ago, Menor said:

Rewatched TDKR for the first time in a while and it's just criminally underrated on the internet.

Maybe I’m wrong, but it seems like the whole “TDKR sucks” sentiment has slowed down as of 2019.