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Star Wars The Force Awakens (2015)

Star Wars The Force Awakens (2015)  

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  1. 1. Star Wars The Force Awakens



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4 minutes ago, Darth Water Bottle said:

 

I think Kylo Ren worked for me as a villain. I mean come on he stopped a blaster shot in mid-air for MINUTES before changing it's course to hit something else. He was able to extract information and he took as little shit from his underlings as Darth Vader did.

 Yet he struggled against a normal storm trooper in a one on one fight, made no sense 

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4 minutes ago, Darth Water Bottle said:

 

I think Kylo Ren worked for me as a villain. I mean come on he stopped a blaster shot in mid-air for MINUTES before changing it's course to hit something else. He was able to extract information and he took as little shit from his underlings as Darth Vader did.

 Yet he struggled against a normal storm trooper in a one on one fight, made no sense 

Lol right?

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6 minutes ago, Darth Water Bottle said:

1) If they had given Adam Driver a scar across his face, nobody would be saying anything. He just looked so....normal. Which is fine and I understand why they did this. Not

every Sith has to be horribly and yet awesomely disfigured.

 

 

I still would be, its far more cinematic to have him take off his mask in front of Han.

 

Its awkward when he just takes it off. Imagine, the build up if Han asks him to take it off and thats the first time we see his face, the audience would go silent in anticipation for that moment, plus Han's reaction would have meaning since the first time the audience sees Kylo is the first time his Father in the film see's him. This bugged me more than anything in the whole film. 

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20 minutes ago, Jay Salahi said:

 

I still would be, its far more cinematic to have him take off his mask in front of Han.

 

Its awkward when he just takes it off. Imagine, the build up if Han asks him to take it off and thats the first time we see his face, the audience would go silent in anticipation for that moment, plus Han's reaction would have meaning since the first time the audience sees Kylo is the first time his Father in the film see's him. This bugged me more than anything in the whole film. 

 

That's not really why people are complaining but sure.

 

23 minutes ago, Jessie said:

 Yet he struggled against a normal storm trooper in a one on one fight, made no sense 

 

I think the storm trooper is force sensitive as well. There's nothing to say Finn can't use the force. In fact, why would Maz Kanata tell Finn to use a lightsaber when to use one effectively you need the force?

 

25 minutes ago, Jay Salahi said:

The first Star Wars is 100000% a Stand alone movie if you think other wise you are just wrong. 

 

 

Not 10000%. I mean Darth Vader flies off to the sunset to be beaten in a potential sequel. The empire is still out there, the rebellion wages on. It's like 98% stand alone but it does work to set up a potential sequel.

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2 minutes ago, Darth Water Bottle said:

 

That's not really why people are complaining but sure.

 

 

 

My point is, I don't think those complaints would even exist had they done that.

 

Film is strange and something a lot of people who haven't told stories themselves sometimes don't understand that lets say I have 5 notes for the film. Well if one of those notes is taken and works it *might erase 1,2, or all other notes I had. 

 

- And yes Vader flies off, but that doesn't mean the movie isn't a Stand alone film. It ends with our hereos saving the world and getting medals. If they never made a sequel it would have been fine. People could have lived happy and wondered what happened to Darth Vader. Batman Begins is a STAND alone film too. Showing the joker card is a fun Coda.

 

Had they shown Darth Vader fly away and land on another planet and proclaim to hunt down Luke then its different. If Batman confronts the joker he says Hey and he turns around and the screen goes black that different. 

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3 minutes ago, Jay Salahi said:

 

My point is, I don't think those complaints would even exist had they done that.

 

Film is strange and something a lot of people who haven't told stories themselves sometimes don't understand that lets say I have 5 notes for the film. Well if one of those notes is taken and works it *might erase 1,2, or all other notes I had. 

 

- And yes Vader flies off, but that doesn't mean the movie isn't a Stand alone film. It ends with our hereos saving the world and getting medals. If they never made a sequel it would have been fine. People could have lived happy and wondered what happened to Darth Vader. Batman Begins is a STAND alone film too. Showing the joker card is a fun Coda.

 

Had they shown Darth Vader fly away and land on another planet and proclaim to hunt down Luke then its different. If Batman confronts the joker he says Hey and he turns around and the screen goes black that different. 

 

It would have been fine sure but it did leave room for a sequel which was my initial point. Not everything was resolved with a clean little bow: Darth Vader and the Empire was still out there. If there were no sequels, people would have lived happy but if there were sequels, there was natural territory for ESB and then ROTJ to tackle. ESB would have been a very different movie if Darth Vader was killed in the Death Star and the Empire collapsed.

 

I mean it's possible people wouldn't complain as much if they followed your note but then again, I'm not entirely sold on that since he looks normal. It's just not what people expect to see under the helmet. Can you imagine ROTJ if Luke took off Anakin's helmet and the guy looked like a normal Hollywood actor?

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14 minutes ago, Darth Water Bottle said:

 

It would have been fine sure but it did leave room for a sequel which was my initial point. Not everything was resolved with a clean little bow: Darth Vader and the Empire was still out there. If there were no sequels, people would have lived happy but if there were sequels, there was natural territory for ESB and then ROTJ to tackle. ESB would have been a very different movie if Darth Vader was killed in the Death Star and the Empire collapsed.

 

I mean it's possible people wouldn't complain as much if they followed your note but then again, I'm not entirely sold on that since he looks normal. It's just not what people expect to see under the helmet. Can you imagine ROTJ if Luke took off Anakin's helmet and the guy looked like a normal Hollywood actor?

 

I feel you but we just disagree on the problem. The character is normal, I'm fine with that.  the thing is when he is talking to Rey, NO ONE expects him or is prepared for him to take off his mask so the moment is instantly up for judgement because its an unwanted surprise. Oh wait thats, what he looked like? They didn't even have enough build up to want to see his face.  That scene is just the one where he takes his mask off. 

 

but if  he takes off the helmet with Han, the audience is IN the scene, Han is there, the plot is moving forward, we are prepared to see him with his mask off (by this point we have been waiting for it). And in that moment the film isn't about Kylo taking off his mask, its about HANS death and only moment with his Son. There is an actual reason the character would want to take off his mask and it just makes the moment bigger. 

 

Whats better motivation for the character of Kylo? Rey asking or Han? Thats how I look at it. More motivation to me, means more meaning, which means more investment, which means less likely to nit pick.

 

 

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Kylo also instantly makes himself less of a threat or force in Rey's mind when she sees his face too. Im sure the First Order would feel slightly less scared if the dude didn't have a helmet on. if you were a Storm Trooper you'd be more scared of Kylo Ren rather than and anger powerful Adam Driver walking around. 

 

Its why the dark is scarier than the light, its unknown, you can't see whats ahead. 

 

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I like that he took his mask off.  Kylo isn't Vader, he's a kid desperately trying to be like Vader.  The mask is a show and I think it helps add humanity to show that early on.  He isnt a Sith Lord, he's a guy with an internal struggle going down the wrong path.

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2 minutes ago, The Panda Menace said:

I like that he took his mask off.  Kylo isn't Vader, he's a kid desperately trying to be like Vader.  The mask is a show and I think it helps add humanity to show that early on.  He isnt a Sith Lord, he's a guy with an internal struggle going down the wrong path.

 

I get that what they were going for. But does having him take off his mask for 90 seconds earlier in the film really add that much depth? All of those character traits would still be there, the dialogue wouldn't have to change in any scenes or his motivations. You'd still see he is a kid wannabe Vader.  

 

All I know is both times I saw the movie the sold out audience laughed when they weren't supposed too when he took his mask off. They were not ready for it. 

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On 20/12/2015, 14:12:59, rukaio101 said:

The enemies she was up against? You mean two mook Tie Fighter pilots (that are usually shot down in the dozens)? Yes, truly she must be an amazing pilot to barely triumph over them. Hell, Poe shoots down about 6 in one tracking shot.

 

And, as I pointed out, the Tie Fighter chasing her was able to follow most of her stunts with relative ease. If she's supposed to be a 'great pilot even by SW standards' what does that make that guy? Honestly, they barely only took him out with a risky maneuver that I, at least, got the impression was helped along by a little Force-induced luck.

 

Yeah, I didn't deny that she's very capable. I simply pointed out that the mess-up shows she's not a perfect mechanic. She still makes mistakes. And that mechanical ability never gets to the point of ridiculousness. She's fixing ships, not single-handedly hacking the Starkiller base. The most she gets to do with said ability in the climax is to open the doors to the modulator/thing they need to blow up.

 

 

Um... it's really really not. It's certainly made more explicit in said 15 minute window, but it's something that's definitely been there from the very beginning of the film and subtly affects her actions. The chalk numbering on her wall counting days. The longing look at the departing spaceship (but the distinct lack of even trying to save money to get there). Her telling BB-8 that she's waiting for someone as well and they'll 'definitely come back'. Indeed, when she and Finn first leave Jakku, she wants to go back almost immediately. She refuses Han Solo's job offer (despite her obvious wish to go) because she thinks been gone too long anyway. Believe me, there are a lot of scenes where it's there. Just because they're not flashing it in neon lights until the tavern scene doesn't mean it's not there.

 

Also, you have a very odd definition of the word 'resolved'. She ends that 15 minutes by being knocked unconscious by Kylo Ren. Not exactly doing much to resolve her issues there. She doesn't resolve her issues with the force fully until she takes up the lightsaber in the climax to protect Finn. And even then, it's left open enough as to how much she's really over Jakku and how much that may get explored in the sequels.

 

Lol, you got me: I don't have the energy to counter that much text. I respect that you can articulate your points (really, I do) but I think you're taking my 'perfect' description a bit literally - all it meant was that she's really good at seemingly everything she tries. And by 'resolved' I mean that the story doesn't bring it up again and moves swiftly on to bigger things. As I said, I don't view her apprehension to leave as a 'flaw' in the first place. She doesn't know she's the main player in a SW story.

 

If she worked as a character for you then great - you're not alone.

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Jay Salahi said:

 

I still would be, its far more cinematic to have him take off his mask in front of Han.

 

Its awkward when he just takes it off. Imagine, the build up if Han asks him to take it off and thats the first time we see his face, the audience would go silent in anticipation for that moment, plus Han's reaction would have meaning since the first time the audience sees Kylo is the first time his Father in the film see's him. This bugged me more than anything in the whole film. 

Totally agree! It's stuff like this and perhaps us finding out he's hans son for the first time when we hear han say "my son" in response to kylo saying "what do you expect to find beneath this mask" that for me would have taken the movie from good to great/amazing. Some of the reveals were just so random 

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For those who don’t want to read long reviews, It was a good movie, had some great moments, nice dialogs and overall is enjoyed a good bit. Like the the tone of the movie, the visuals were much better than any other SW so far. Also the feeling this movie gave was a real SW movie worthy! First 1h or so was almost flawless for me, great scene, visuals, dialogs, character all right on the spot. After that is went down wards.  Didn’t like a lot of his decisions, and visuals weren’t on point anymore. Didn’t like the way they played out the bad guys.

 

For the guys interested in my long opinion and why I found thing good or bad here’s my long review. First off sorry for my bad English and many grammar errors. Hope you enjoy my review!

 

Positive:

The movie starts off great, from the start the movie hit the tone it needed to hit for me to be a real star wars movie. Not like the hobbit, it really felt like a star wars movie.

The visuals were great, they perfectly gave the old school effect their well-earned spot, while still updating the visuals to modern film making. Like the laser gun  animations and the lightsabres and found the smoke a nice added effect.

In line with my last comment the landscapes were great, made you feel part of the universe. Had my doubts on this before I went in to this movie but J.J Abram did a great job on this one. Like almost every shot of the desert or forest they shot.

The first hour was perfect for me, everything made sense to me, the dialog was great. Like how they introduced the new characters. It was just amazing!

Next up was the acting, in this star wars movie they had great actors in the main role, like both Rey and Finn were on top of their game. Also thought Harrison ford did a good job in this movie.

 

The fact that the main roles were for a black guy and a woman is awesome. Like this for a change I was especially a fan of Finn, I am fan of his acting J

 

Last but not least, the music. It was great! Love the tone of it, the epic grandeur. Made you feel for the character.

 

 

Negative:

 

Since we had the positive here’s the negative side:

 

They didn’t explain why everyone forgot about the jedi and siths in such a short time. I mean how can it become a legend in 30 years. It’s seems way to be believable.

The design on the inside of the new deathstar (forgot its name) wasn’t fitting, was probably the only real thing that didn’t give me the star wars feeling. Just found the design a bit boring, the bridge were they run over like 10 times was dumb as hell. This and the strange way troopers exploded are the only visual miss fit I had in this movie.

I hated the General Hux, he was so unbelievable. He look like a joke to me, if I was him on the screen is just thought that guy could never lead an army.  He felt really cartoony to me, had no real depth and was dumb as hell.

Snoke, This is probably just me but I hate how he looked, he just didn’t fit his character. Other than that, he didn’t had the impact that palpatine had, he wasn’t frightening, didn’t seem like he knew what he was doing. He didn’t interfere in anything while important sh*t was going down. I don’t know he just didn’t feel like a real villain.

 

You probably guessed it right, my last character complaint is about the last villain…  Kylo Ren. Other than his name there is nothing good about this character. Maybe one thing, love his character development, the struggles he has but that’s all.  First off, he appearance just doesn’t do it, I know it’s stereotyping but he just looked to normal, like really nothing odd about him. Like almost every famous celeb or unique friend I have has a great signature in their face, or there way of acting but this is just hadn’t with Kaylo, he didn’t felt like thread.

His lightsabre was awful, I thought we would finally get to see why it was a crossing sword. Watched the Ligthsaber fights closely and it was just there, didn’t do anything next to that it looked so bad and ugly. I think their design team could have worked on it a bit better and come up with a better idea.

Kylo Ren lost a fight against a Stormtrooper, how is this even possible. First off the Stormtrooper never fought with a sword before and move liked he used it for at least a few years. Kylo struggles so hard to beat him witch is strange cause in the beginning of the movie he was kicking ass. 5 min later he loses in a fight against Rey, I know she’s strong with the force and she will have natural talent. And yeah she has fought with a stick before but still, she was fighting perfectly with the sword, she was better in the force after like 30 min of knowing she has it than Kylo practicing for a whole lot of years from a real master. This is like completely stupid and in no way possible also this drains the credibility of Kylo even further cause at this point he isn’t much stronger than a Stormtrooper and that’s said if you are the main villain in the movie. So yeah I really hated this character the most, just because they made him so a nonfactor.

 

 

This is why I didn’t like the end, it was just the OT story all over again, with a bigger death star. It just felt like a big let-down to me that it was so unoriginal. I mean the last 45 min of this movie just felt like a complete reboot, nothing special to offer. The was the death star goes down is also so anti climatic. So yeah this just made the movie a lot less appealing to me.

This is me just nit-picking, didn’t like the lightsabre fights and the use of the force. Like they didn’t use force-jump and there were no real high skilled lightsabre fights. Probably because none of the 2 good guys has ever fought with one before :D

(The lightsabre fight was realistic in the sense that they did play it rough and dirty, so that was great)

 

Result:

First 1h: A+

Last 1.2h: D+ (maybe a C-)

Overall grade: B-

And yeah as a hole I enjoyed the movie.

Might change my grades after is saw it again this week :D

 

 

 

 

Edited by pepsa
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Being not a hugh Star Wars fan, I came out of this while realizing the film is not perfect loving it.

 

Watched is a 2nd time in a full house at a Cinemark XD and the last 10 minutes of the film the fire alarm went off and every one had to leave the building.

 

That sucked.

 

 

9/10

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12 hours ago, Hatebox said:

Lol, you got me: I don't have the energy to counter that much text.

Fuhahahah! Dogmatic overexplanation wins again!

 

Anyway, I get that you don't really want to continue this debate too much, but I'm still going to reply, simply because I have seen the 'Mary Sue' critique around a few times and I want to get my counterargument out in full. Because, personally, that critique kinda peeves me. Not that I think TFA is beyond criticism (I myself have a number of problems with it) but that's not one of them and it kinda annoys me that people think it is.

 

Quote

I respect that you can articulate your points (really, I do) but I think you're taking my 'perfect' description a bit literally - all it meant was that she's really good at seemingly everything she tries.

 

But couldn't you equally make the same argument about Luke Skywalker in the first trilogy? He can fly an X-Wing better than most Rebel pilots, fights past plenty of professionally trained Stormtroopers on the Death Star (even if admittedly said Stormtroopers could probably be knocked over by a stiff breeze), can deflect blaster shots after only a few hours training with Obi-Wan, is implied to have learned Force telekinesis by himself inbetween movies, learns Jedi Knight-level abilities after only a few days training with Yoda, etc etc. Why does he get a free pass while Rey is accused of being a Sue? (Admittedly, neither of them are really Sues, but I'm just pointing out the double standard.) 

 

Honestly though, if you just took the label 'really good at seemingly everything [they] try', you could describe probably quite a few male blockbuster protagonists who never really get accused of being 'too perfect' (despite in many cases being arguably worse than Rey). Again, why do they get a free pass? 

 

Quote

And by 'resolved' I mean that the story doesn't bring it up again and moves swiftly on to bigger things. As I said, I don't view her apprehension to leave as a 'flaw' in the first place. She doesn't know she's the main player in a SW story.

Again, you're mistaking 'doesn't bring it up again' for 'doesn't bring it up again overtly'. It's still there. That's why it's all the more meaningful when she finally takes up the lightsaber. It's symbolic of how she's moving past it and accepting her destiny.

 

And yes it's a flaw, no matter how you swing it. She's practically forcing herself to stay in her fairly terrible and desperate scavenger life rather than go off planet and find a better world entirely because she believes her family will return, something that fairly obviously isn't going to happen. It's not like Luke, who was staying on his farm to help his aunt and uncle keep afloat. She has literally nothing holding her there except her own delusions. She's deliberately choosing to make her own life worse because she doesn't want to accept that she's been abandoned. That's a flaw. 

 

 

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After my 2nd viewing I change my verdict from 7/10 to 8/10:

 

 

Hits:

  • Rey all the way
  • Kylo Ren
  • great use of the old cast
  • great blend of real and CGI
  • amazing sound design
  • great sceneries... especially the snowy forest... but also that spaceship graveyard...
  • generally great casting
  • lightsabers are actually dangerous again and have weight
  • Solo's death
  • great entertainment all around, opening the franchise for old and new fans

 

 

 

Misses:

 

  • poor reactions to the destruction of a whole system (it is a fucking genocide)

  • StarKiller. "There is always a bigger fish." Even in SW size and scale can become ridiculous.

  • Ben shoudln't have taken off the mask until the Solo scene

  • that alien woman in the temple... weak design. Same goes for Ren's boss... however, I think there will be something behind it, like him only being very small or similar...

  • Movie should have ended once Chewie and Rey enter hyperspace... Luke scene wasn't a good last scene IMHO. But I guess the fans would have run berserk without him.

  • Some of the really good jokes and nods to the OT lose their impact because there are too many of them. They are too self-aware.

  • The Nürnberg imagery... come on.

  • Music only great when using the old score.

  • story rather predictable... but maybe that was necessary to go forward.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by ShouldIBeHere
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Set 30 years after the events in Episode VI, The Force Awakens picks the saga up as a resurgence in the dark side has begun, renamed the First Order, which is helmed by young Darth Vader-wannabe Kylo Ren (Adam Driver). Luke Skywalker has been missing the whole time and there’s a map to his whereabouts stored inside a droid, and everyone’s keen to find him, especially the First Order, who are out to destroy every last Jedi in the galaxy. Through a bit of chance the droid ends up tagging along with Rey (Sigourney Weaver), a secret agent suffering dissociative amnesia after being shot twice in the back in a failed assassination attempt on African dictator, Nykwana Wombosi. Meanwhile in the First Order there’s this stormtrooper called Finn (John Boyega), who has an identity crisis after realising killing innocent people isn’t cool. He ends up going AWOL and after some bullshit happens, also ends up tagging along with Rey, with the ensuing sexual tension becoming a painful source of frustration. Still suffering severe amnesia, Rey comes to learn she has an incredible set of skills and combative abilities, being able to masterfully fly the Millennium Falcon with no apparent experience, easily defeating several opponents at once, and showing an immediate command of the force without knowing anything about it. With the uprising of the dark side there’s also a new rebellion—the good guys—which are championed by Danny Zuko (Oscar Isaac), who’s undergone some major self-discovery since high school and traded his ride in for an X-Wing.

 

A bit inconsistent from previous instalments, director Peter Jackson has taken some huge risks in this latest entry to the series, introducing us to an entirely new world and a whole new set of characters. First of all, it’s set in space, and where once there were dwarves and ents, things are now mostly concerned with an alien race of beings baring striking resemblance to humans.

 

The fact such a similar race exists so far away from us has raised what is possibly the most profound philosophical question out of any film released this year: how can two species existing in different parts of the universe, separated by vast amounts of time and space, end up evolving identically? It’s not just a matter of appearance; their language-use is also the same, right down to different regions yielding the same relative accents to our own, with accents such as English, American and Scottish all making key appearances.

 

Particle accelerators have been able to teleport protons over significant distances, and the mind-bending nature of quantum physics has triggered a lot of speculation about the relationship between matter and energy existing in different parts of the cosmos; could the phenomenon be explained by some kind of quantum duality? Perhaps it’s cross-dimensional, or more likely, a sign that we’re simply spawned from another master race, like in 2001: A Space Odyssey. It’s probably just veiled propaganda from the Church of Scientology. Whatever the case, the creators have succeeded in triggering some of the most eye-popping existential discourse we’ve had in a long time. Hopefully these questions will be answered in later instalments, but for now, we have plenty to think about.

 

Aside from all the abstract intellectual mumbo jumbo, there’s some pretty good filmmaking going on. Hogwart’s looks as spectacular as ever, with scenes showing a David Lean-esque level of majesty and restraint, and there’s an overall sense of refinement, especially in the acting from Macauley Culken. It’s easy to complain over the lacking in a film, but in spite of this not showing a single mango being eaten, it’s well worth a look.

 

4 / 5 stars (B)

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Actually enjoyed it a bit less the second go 'round. Very much anticipating Film Critic Hulk's essay given his recent Tweets fall in line with my problem(s) with Force Awakens. That said, a worthy, improved Episode VIII could go a long way in improving Episode VIII. Ridley, Boyega, Driver and Isaac deserved better and, I assume, they'll get what they deserve in the next chapter.

 

B-

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On 12/16/2015, 10:37:17, CoolioD1 said:

not great. gotta say I loved this for the first act (What a waste of von sydow tho) but it got less and less for me from there. draggy in the middle and the dogfight in the climax never held my interest in the way they did in the originals. in fact aside from that last lightsaber fight a lot of the action felt uninspired. of the new characters I liked rey and kylo ren. finn and poe dameron coast more on charisma of the actors rather than anything interesting on the page but they're fine. would've liked to see the relationship of han and kylo explored more so han's death could've felt BIGGER. but whatever. Snoke design did nothing for me. felt like a template of a gross cgi dude.

 

Overall felt like a table setting movie and now that we've gotten that and all the "HOW ABOUT THOSE OLD MOVIES HUH?" business out of the way hopefully Johnson can give us something real special for 8. I'm bummed I didn't like it more. It's like a C+

Surprisingly, this captured a lot of my thoughts on the film. The movie was incredible for the first half or so, and then slowly started to diminish as time went on. I'd argue the problem was with the old characters being wasted. Han, Leia, and Luke didn't have much of an impact, imo, relative to their status in this saga's history. I'd much rather have had this story just be about Rey and Finn with some allusions to the past. Overall, though, despite agreeing with this post, I liked the film slightly more than you did. 

Grade: B- 

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