Weekend Estimates (Page 92): Pets 103.2M (biggest OW ever for an original movie) | Tarzan 20.6M | Dory 20.3M | M&D 16.6M

[baumer]

1 minute ago, Sal said:

 

It's a good premise but Illumination is absolutely a company that plays it safe in every way. They don't take risks.  There's not much they produce that steps outside the realm of being just general appeal to have much lasting effect.  They're taking a middle of the road product and making it big with marketing. I agree you can't generally take a piece of shit and effectively use marketing to make it a gold brick, but you very much can with a good-but-not-great movie (especially one where they can appeal to kids).

 

But in two or three years, will people even remember this movie existed or will it be another Hop or Lorax?

 

What's the big deal about taking risks?  When you are spending 100's of millions of dollars on a film, you want your audience to enjoy it and appeal to as many people as possible.  You sound like a typical Pixar loonie when you say that no one will remember Illumination movies in two or three years.  Did you feel that way about Despicable Me and Minions?  Because those films are about as iconic as they come now.  They have permeated into pop culture and kids love them.  You can like Pixar more, hell you can not like the films yourself, but to say that they will be forgotten is pure myopia.

[Rman823]

So it seems like Tarzan is a hit in my area. I have seen so many posts on Facebook this weekend about how great it is and how everyone would highly recommend it. Even my mom (who rarely goes to the movies) wants to see it tomorrow due to her friend telling her it has a great story. The only post I've seen about SLOP is that it was disappointing and they wished it was more like Zootopia.

[Sal]

45 minutes ago, Baumer said:

 

What's the big deal about taking risks?  When you are spending 100's of millions of dollars on a film, you want your audience to enjoy it and appeal to as many people as possible.  You sound like a typical Pixar loonie when you say that no one will remember Illumination movies in two or three years.  Did you feel that way about Despicable Me and Minions?  Because those films are about as iconic as they come now.  They have permeated into pop culture and kids love them.  You can like Pixar more, hell you can not like the films yourself, but to say that they will be forgotten is pure myopia.

 

I'm actually not a Pixar fan at all.  I think Pixar rests on its laurels too much and it really fails when it comes to the subject if anything approaching diversity (I think The Iron Giant is the only Brad Bird movie I've even remotely liked and it wasn't released through Pixar, and I hate The Incredibles.  Most of the rest of their work, save a few of their early hits are popularized by the public goodwill they're built up over the years, and even a lot of their early works are pretty forgettable (A Bug's Life, anyone?).  I haven't bothered to see Dory at all.

 

I hesitate to classify myself as a wholesale fan of any animation studio because they all have a lot of faults.  It's just a matter of whether or not an individual movie is good.  But they have their individual pluses too and Illumination's MO is basically good but not great movies that are powerfully marketed.  

 

Pixar's got good basic storytelling but also tries so hard to appeal to a multi-front market that they'll churn out some pretty low-quality stuff if they need to.  The nonsense about Pixar's name being an automatic indicator of quality seems to be faltering, which is for the better.  They've been coasting for years.  

 

Disney's current stuff is doing better because they've remembered that their stories need to make sense and actually not contain subject matter that will drive away your audience (or be utterly incomprehensible like "Home on the Range" or "Chicken Little").   But they're using a woefully small team for it so far and with the announced sequel for Wreck-It Ralph and the upcoming announcement for Zootopia two, I suspect they'll soon be dipping in to the same small pool of people and ideas and it'll get old fast.

 

Dreamworks needs to figure out that throwing in 10 big celebrities and trying to say f-you to Disney never got anyone anywhere (also if they're going to take materials, they need to at least try to have some semblance of care or liking for the source, because a lot of what they do now seems to be basically 'here's something based on a popular thing right now.  WATCH IT.'.  They are very capable of producing some really nice stuff, but I can't even begin to fathom what goes on in their idea room.

 

I'm trying to think of a Blue Sky movie that's not an Ice Age sequel and that's not a good sign.  They did Rio, didn't they?  Ice Age had a good idea and execution and they're just churning out sequels.  If Rio 2 did well, I'm expecting Rio 3-22 over the next 15 years or so.  Ice Age has pretty much gone the way of the dinosaurs.  And by that, I mean Land Before Time and it's endless sequels.

 

Laika's a great concept, tonally unique and has a lot of potential but they spent so much time making The Box Trolls so detailed that I found I didn't care much about any of the characters or their situation.  I would have been just as happy watching it on mute and just seeing the pretty animation.  Hopefully they improve on this with Kubo.

 

The thing about animation is that people seem to have a narrow idea of what it is, but it needs to be treated like what it REALLY is, which is a medium, not a genre.  Animation =/= kids and/or family entertainment.

 

My ideal would be to see the rise of animation as a medium and a greater expansion on what can be done with it and what is considered acceptable to do with it.  Unfortunately, for that to happen, something outside of the 'safe' and normal realm of animation features would have to really hit it big.  We're not really at that point yet.

 

 

TL;DR: animation is a virtually unlimited medium and I wish companies would invest in expanding what is considered 'acceptable' in the animated medium instead of maintaining the status quo of animation being a 'family genre'.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Sal

[Blankments]

4 hours ago, filmlover said:

FYI I don't know if this is happening at all theaters but at the one I went to yesterday they were selling stuffed animals of all the characters. Those things were selling like hot cakes.

My theater had a bunch of like actual dogs there for you to pet lol

[Olive]

IA5 is gonna drop more than 70% from last one in Germany, one of the bigger markets for  the franchise..

 

[JJ-8]

1 hour ago, Baumer said:

Anyone who thinks IA5 is going to bomb really needs to go to dictionary.com and look up the term.  

 

IA5 is guaranteed to be a massive hit.  Domestic is just one market.  

 

You are right. It won't be bomb since its budget is expected to hover around the 100m mark. But massive hit?  I'm beginning to doubt now we are seeing results. If u want to get a clue to the US performance , let's use the comparative perf to the AUS performance. Ice age 4 - 27m AUD / 161m. Ice age 5 - 8m to date (15m projected AUD) / sub 100m US?

[Jonwo]

I think television has done a better job at showcasing animation as not just for children than film with shows like Robot Chicken or Rick and Morty for example I do think it would cool if we had animated films that were more what like Studio Ghibli have produced like Princess Mononoke or The Wind Rises which have quite mature subject matters but sadly it wouldn't sell to a global audience given how much these films cost to make.

 

 

[Rman823]

44 minutes ago, Blanks McCoy said:

My theater had a bunch of like actual dogs there for you to pet lol

Too bad they weren't giving any of those away. I would have been like this 

Edited July 11, 2016 by Rman823

[Sal]

Just now, Jonwo said:

I think television has done a better job at showcasing animation as not just for children than film with shows like Robot Chicken or Rick and Morty for example I do think it would cool if we had animated films that were more what like Studio Ghibli have produced like Princess Mononoke or The Wind Rises which have quite mature subject matters but sadly it wouldn't sell to a global audience given how much these films cost to make.

 

 

 

Yeah, I was just thinking that when I saw your post. Outside of the USA, Animation is a much more acceptable medium in many respects.  I've seen some positively grisly European animations (Not to mention some flat out trippy ones... as I still have no idea what the teams who created La Planète sauvage/Fantastic Planet were smoking to make them create that film, but damn, they must have enjoyed it!).

 

Animation being used to greater effect on TV is a tremendous thing.  I could also add Archer to that list, since it's actually got a lot of serial style storytelling which is something that a lot of animated shows have been forced to avoid because episodic stuff is still preferred in animation (even though serial storytelling is now the favoured format for live action shows,that has yet to extend to American cartoons.  I hope that as animation also gains on television, movies will reflect the shift.  Though in general, television has been gaining in popularity as something to watch.  It used to be that movies held more esteem (especially for actors, as being an actor on TV had far less prestige than being one in movies), but nowadays television shows are turning out bigger audiences and, frankly, are just easier for a lot of people to watch, especially given the easy access provided by Netflix and similar streaming services.

 

When you can spend less a month on a Netflix subscription than to take a family of four to see one movie, while getting many MANY hours of more content, the appeal of movies isn't as immediate.  I mean some reviewers even have a "wait for it on netflix" rating when they give movie reviews.  Convenience and low cost is an effective one-two punch and given the amount of original content now being produced for various streaming services (including youtube - both through their own 'channel' and via un-sponsored original content by creators) it seems even more important for movies to start keeping their budgets down.  Not that I think movies will ever cease to be a profitable venture, but they need to be approached more wisely.

 

Also as someone with friends in the animation industry - both in studios and in schools or teaching positions - the trend of animation gaining in popularity is good, but the current amount of outsourcing to cheap locations is damaging to our livelihood.  

 

And, I mean, would it really be a big deal to have an animated film every month (or more often) if they weren't all exclusively being marketed to kids?  If there were some hard sci-fi, or horror, or action/adventure movies coming out that happened to be animated, would it really be so bad?  If only it wasn't considered just for family films, it'd help widen that market considerably.

[Fancyarcher]

12 minutes ago, Sal said:

Animation being used to greater effect on TV is a tremendous thing.  I could also add Archer to that list, since it's actually got a lot of serial style storytelling which is something that a lot of animated shows have been forced to avoid because episodic stuff is still preferred in animation (even though serial storytelling is now the favoured format for live action shows,that has yet to extend to American cartoons.  I hope that as animation also gains on television, movies will reflect the shift.  Though in general, television has been gaining in popularity as something to watch.  It used to be that movies held more esteem (especially for actors, as being an actor on TV had far less prestige than being one in movies), but nowadays television shows are turning out bigger audiences and, frankly, are just easier for a lot of people to watch, especially given the easy access provided by Netflix and similar streaming services.

 

Actually there are plenty of serialized western cartoons. A lot of action cartoons of the last decade are heavily serialized, having story-arcs that spawn throughout a season or two. It's just that they've been treated more poorly recent, which is largely due to animation cost and comedy cartoons being easier to produce, that they don't tend to end so well. I'm not exactly pleased with that myself.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Daniel Dylan Davis

[Ezen Baklattan]

Just realized Pets is the 40th film to hit a triple digit opening. Huh.

[Jonwo]

Just now, Daniel Dylan Davis said:

 

Actually there are plenty of serialized western cartoons. A lot of action cartoons of the last decade are heavily serialized, having story-arcs that spawn throughout a season or two. It's just that they've been treated more poorly recent, which is largely due to animation cost and comedy cartoons being easier to produce, that they don't tend to end so well. I can tell you, I'm not exactly pleased with the downfall of action cartoons myself.

 

Comedy seems to dominate animation at the moment even in superhero cartoons, probably why Teen Titans Go! is still running and not Young Justice. It'll be interesting if Justice League Action is a comedy in it or if it's more light hearted like Batman: The Brave and the Bold. 

 

 

[cannastop]

35 minutes ago, Jonwo said:

I think television has done a better job at showcasing animation as not just for children than film with shows like Robot Chicken or Rick and Morty for example I do think it would cool if we had animated films that were more what like Studio Ghibli have produced like Princess Mononoke or The Wind Rises which have quite mature subject matters but sadly it wouldn't sell to a global audience given how much these films cost to make.

 

 

I think The Incredibles and Zootopia edge close to having "mature subject matter". Unless you want them to have copious blood like Princess Mononoke. The major studios will probably never allow a PG-13 animated feature to be made, due to financial risks.

 

Of course, if Sausage Party makes $200m dom, maybe they'd consider it.

[Dementeleus]

Oho, are we discussing animation again?

 

/rubs hands together 

[Fancyarcher]

8 minutes ago, Jonwo said:

 

Comedy seems to dominate animation at the moment even in superhero cartoons, probably why Teen Titans Go! is still running and not Young Justice. It'll be interesting if Justice League Action is a comedy in it or if it's more light hearted like Batman: The Brave and the Bold. 

 

 

 

Young Justice was one of the animated shows what I was thinking of, when I wrote that. That cartoon was heavily serialized. Every episode featured something that would be featured into the story as the show progressed.

 

I'd like to think JLA is another BTATB, but that art is giving me Teen Titans Go vibes, which isn't exactly an encouraging sign.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Daniel Dylan Davis

[cannastop]

1 hour ago, Sal said:

Disney's current stuff is doing better because they've remembered that their stories need to make sense and actually not contain subject matter that will drive away your audience (or be utterly incomprehensible like "Home on the Range" or "Chicken Little").   But they're using a woefully small team for it so far and with the announced sequel for Wreck-It Ralph and the upcoming announcement for Zootopia two, I suspect they'll soon be dipping in to the same small pool of people and ideas and it'll get old fast.

"Woefully small team"? How do you come to that judgement?

[Mojoguy]

Instead of whining about Western animated movies, check out Japanese anime for more variety in stories.

[filmlover]

19 minutes ago, Spaghetti said:

Just realized Pets is the 40th film to hit a triple digit opening. Huh.

And the first to do so not based on a previous source material. Insane.

[MovieMan89]

10 minutes ago, filmlover said:

And the first to do so not based on a previous source material. Insane.

Oh wow, didn't even realize this. Kinda crazy its taken this long for a completely original film to break the 100 barrier on OW. 

[Sal]

29 minutes ago, cannastop said:

"Woefully small team"? How do you come to that judgement?

 

I mean their directing teams are tending toward the same individuals.  It was true in the era of Beauty and the Beast/Little Mermaid as well. Once they have a director (or directors) who do well, they tend to go back to them again and again.