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Spider-Man: Far From Home | 2 JUL 2019 | ***ENDGAME SPOILERS ALLOWED***

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40 minutes ago, LawrenceBrolivier said:

like I said, that people don't want cartoons to count as much as live action movies do. I think this thread is a great example of that! That you're continuing to discount how good it is for the sake of being able to use the Venom comparison instead of the Spider-Verse one feeds into that, it doesn't refute it. 

 

 

I want to point out that your argument about animated films is not true. The Incredibles proves that point. The Incredibles was an animated superhero film that did great. It's sequel last year did even better. If an animated film is good enough, it can do just as well at the BO as a live action film. 

 

I would very much like to use Into the Spider-verse instead of Venom for comparison. It's the lowest grossing Spider-Man movie out of all of them. It doesn't stack up to the other animated films that are being released by other studios. It's box office was not that good. Personally, I didn't care for it either, but that's just my opinion. What more can be said about it? It's great that you liked it. However, it doesn't prove that Sony can make a successful Spider-Man film. It just proves that they can make one that you like. The GA likes those 95% of MCU films that you think are inferior to Into the Spider-verse. 

Edited by Walt Disney

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1 hour ago, 35MM-18 said:

Has anyone else suggested we all write to Tom Rothman and suggest he go fuck himself?

No because I’m an adult 

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32 minutes ago, Titan Man said:

Compared to the ones that are still hoping for a nonexistent cut of a nevertheless a bad movie 

Some of those people did raise money for suicide awareness.

 

Still, all these fandoms have bad apples. That’s nothing new. There’s no reason to suggest that Marvel fans are any worse than DC fans or Star Wars fans.

Edited by WittyUsername

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More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

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6 minutes ago, Walt Disney said:

I want to point out that your argument about animated films is not true. The Incredibles proves that point. The Incredibles was an animated superhero film that did great. It's sequel last year did even better. If an animated film is good enough, it can do just as well at the BO as a live action film. 

 

I would very much like to use Into the Spider-verse instead of Venom for comparison. It's the lowest grossing Spider-Man movie out of all of them. It doesn't stack up to the other animated films that are being released by other studios. It's box office was not that good. Personally, I didn't care for it either, but that's just my opinion. What more can be said about it? It's great that you liked it. However, it doesn't prove that Sony can make a successful Spider-Man film. It just proves that they can make one that you like. The GA likes those 95% of MCU films that you think are inferior to Into the Spider-verse. 

Do you think The Incredibles would’ve been as big if say Warner Bros or MGM or Paramount was distributing it? It’s sequel was yes an excellent movie as was the first and ITSV but different expectations for different film. Sony Animation doesn’t have the same drawing power as Pixar/WDAS/Dreamworks/Illumination and Animated CBMs especially those that are popular now such as Batman and Spider-Man won’t do the same numbers as the live action due to the amount of animated media and sadly the very real animation kid stigma whereas the more obscure or original succeed like Incredibles or BH6. Not to mention Lord/Miller are sadly overseas poison. Will ITSV2 have a jump or fall, I don’t know but just because it failed to do the same numbers as the live actions doesn’t make it a failure.

 

 

The GA also like Spider Verse as it quadrupled it’s budget, in fact it did about the same as Captain America: The First Avenger and Shazam. If it wasn’t liked at all, it would’ve fell apart even during the lucrative holiday season and die like Mortal Engines, nor would it have received an A+ CinemaScore. Animation wise it was fourth domestically of the year only $10M behind Ralph 2 and is currently the 8th biggest domestically from 2017-2019 out of the numerous films released during that time period.

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2 minutes ago, Macleod said:

 

More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

Seems like both sides are to blame, and MCU fans are caught in the crosshairs

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2 minutes ago, Macleod said:

 

More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

in the end as the article points , we just dont know yet,but it seems that this is has not ended yet

 

 

ps if thats true then sony is equally to blame as disney

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Lmfao, if Sony's thinking in all this is that they don't need the MCU to hit 1.1b+ grosses with Spidey then they really are delusional. I assumed this decision was made under the calculation that a Spidey movie making 700 or 800m would be more beneficial to them than one making 1.2b that they only have 50% of the profit for. If that's not the case, then they are complete morons. 

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literally 0 chance a spider-man movie is being made in 2021 even if this gets resolved this year (don't see this getting resolved until Venom 2 releases tbh). I'm guessing 2022 or 2023.

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Sounds like Disney PR move.

 

So say the 30% thing is true.  So their counter offer after Sony says no is to go up to 50% later?

 

So something isn't true in the story either timeline wise or just not true at all, or someone doesn't know how to negotiate 😛

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4 minutes ago, Macleod said:

 

More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

This whole thing really sounds like a mess. 

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Just now, 75Live said:

Sounds like Disney PR move.

 

So say the 30% thing is true.  So their counter offer after Sony says no is to go up to 50% later?

 

So something isn't true in the story either timeline wise or just not true at all, or someone doesn't know how to negotiate 😛

No, it likely means that Disney started at a 50/50 attempt...but was not willing to go lower than a 30% stake.

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11 minutes ago, Macleod said:

 

More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives

believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

Hey @Shawn is in this piece

 

Quote

"If the two sides don’t come to a compromise, it’s a lose-lose for everybody," argues Shawn Robbins, chief analyst for industry website Box Office. "Marvel won’t be able to resolve the cliffhanger in future movies, which is saying something when it’s their most popular hero. And for Sony, who has had success, Far From Homedoesn’t get to a billion dollars without Feige and Marvel’s involvement."

Robbins adds, "The other big question is, 'How are fans are going to react to a Tom Holland Spider-Man movie that not set in the MCU?' That is a roll of the dice that no studio should take."

 

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If THR is accurate that Holland only has one more film, that certainly puts this into a new perspective.. 

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21 minutes ago, Walt Disney said:

The Incredibles proves that point. The Incredibles was an animated superhero film that did great. It's sequel last year did even better. If an animated film is good enough, it can do just as well at the BO as a live action film. 

But the distinction that is germane to the point I'm making is that The Incredibles isn't based on a pre-existing comic and part of a tradition that includes live-action movies. The Incredibles is the only Incredibles there is, so it gets to "count" in a way nobody wants to count animated versions of other superheroes like Batman or Superman or Captain America. Once a superhero is adapted to live action, you can basically forget about an animated... and better... version of that superhero succeeding. Why? Because cartoons don't count. They're for kids. Not for grownups, like the movies about people in costumes punching out bad guys based on books written for audiences aged 6-13.... 

That's the power of live-action... it allows grownups to pretend the entertainment they're consuming isn't "for kids" much more easily. It's tied into a larger cultural thing here in America... However, as we all know, and Pixar is also a great example of this... the craft of filmmaking doesn't stop being important even when we're dealing with movies for children. Up, Wall-E, Toy Story, The Incredibles... And the idea that Sony is guaranteed to turn out a sub-par Spider-Man movie on their own when they have access to the same creative teams that made Into the Spider Verse and the Spider-Man game, even... People have to admit they want to believe the worst for whatever reasons they have, and mostly those reasons seem to be that it gives them a sense of satisfaction or superiority they wouldn't otherwise have. They get to act like they know better than the people in the big chairs and the dark suits making six or 7 zeroes at these corporations. There's something to that, and I indulge from time to time as well... it's fun in the same way fantasy sports is fun... 


But the idea that "Into the Spider-Verse" isn't proof Sony can make a successful Spider-Man film is ludicrous, to me. Of course it's proof. It's a successful Spider-Man film. It's existence is the proof. Sony MADE a successful Spider-Man film so recently it's not even a year old yet! 

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6 minutes ago, lorddemaxus said:

literally 0 chance a spider-man movie is being made in 2021 even if this gets resolved this year (don't see this getting resolved until Venom 2 releases tbh). I'm guessing 2022 or 2023.

There’s always the chance that this gets resolved before the end of the year. If that happens, it’s still possible that we could get one in 2021, although Marvel already has three other movies scheduled for that year. 

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16 minutes ago, Macleod said:

 

More nuance added...

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/spider-man-standoff-why-sony-thinks-it-doesnt-need-kevins-playbook-anymore-1233644

 

"Sony’s Tom Rothman and Marvel’s Kevin Feige had plenty of smiles at the Hollywood premiere of Spider-Man: Far From Home in late June, but the pearly whites belied an inner turmoil. While the executives hit the red carpet, talks to extend the unique partnership between Sony and Disney, which owns Marvel Studios, were breaking down over the future use of the character of Spider-Man. 

 

Disney had been seeking a co-financing arrangement on upcoming movies, looking for at least a 30 percent stake. Sony, which counts Spider-Man as one of its only reliable moneymaking franchises, said no. Before both sides walked away, talks had gone to the top level, with Rothman and CEO Tony Vinciquerra on Sony’s side and Disney Studios' co-chairmen Alan Horn and Alan Bergman involved. In the next month and a half, Far From Home would go on to catch $1.109 billion in the box office web, becoming Sony’s biggest movie of all time. The figure reinforced both sides’ thinking. Sony executives believed they didn’t need Disney anymore, and Disney was in no way leaving money, and Peter Parker, behind, sources tell The Hollywood Reporter. "

Both sides are fucking up.

 

 

This whole thing is a confusing mess, first DHD says “There is a lot of webbing here, but it all comes down to money, and it’s easy to understand why both sides refused to give ground. Disney asked that future Spider-Man films be a 50/50 co-financing arrangement between the studios, and there were discussions that this might extend to other films in the Spider-Man universe. Sony turned that offer down flat. Sources said that Sony, led by Tom Rothman and Tony Vinciquerra, came back with other configurations, but Disney didn’t want to do that.”

 

 

Now we’re hearing reports of the opposite, it’s just a mess

Edited by YourMother the Edgelord
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4 minutes ago, 75Live said:

Sounds like Disney PR move.

 

So say the 30% thing is true.  So their counter offer after Sony says no is to go up to 50% later?

 

So something isn't true in the story either timeline wise or just not true at all, or someone doesn't know how to negotiate 😛

Just like yesterday was a Sony PR move. 

 

Sony did have to get ahead because audiences like Disney more. But if the 30% is true (which could've been lowered to at least 25%) it's completely reasonable for both. 

 

 

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Moderation 

 

Not the Fanboy Wars Thread. Anymore and bye bye. 

 

NIRD

 

Regards

BOT Staff

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