Film Piracy (opinions and box office effect)

[rukaio101]

1 minute ago, Jay Hollywood said:

 

What this reply has anything to do with what I said Im not sure. I feel like my reply you're replying too could be used again here haha. 

 

Of course its about access,  duh its a generation thing mostly. My roommate pirated 3 movies last week because HE WANTED To watch them and they weren't on Netflix. My Dad, your dad probably, My boss, my Mom, My little sister, My Aunt and so on all would have sought it out a different way, But HE KNOWS how to pirate, so why pay? He works in the industry even. 

 

You asked "why would anyone pay anything to see something if everyone knows how to do it?" I answered that pirating's not always about 'because it's for free' and that if studios provided a good equivalent for a fair price most people would probably go for that instead. Hell, in the example you just gave, your roommate only pirated because the movies he wanted weren't on Netflix. Yet he's still willing to pay for Netflix rather than just pirate all the movies on that. See my point?

 

 

[RobinHood26]

Just now, redfirebird2008 said:

 

At $6 it feels like a ripoff even for a good movie. I rented Hell or High Water the other day at that price. Great movie. But I'm probably going to see Fences next Tuesday in a movie theater for less than $6 due to the Discount Tuesday price. Now on what planet is $6 for a home video rental a reasonable price, especially when their cost to deliver it digitally is next to nothing? They need to come up with a better system.

 

 

Yeah, $6 is ridiculous. When the "average" ticket price is $9. 

 

I have NEVER rented a movie on iTunes or my Roku box for that reason. If rentals where 2/3 bucks, I'd rent movies every week. 

[RobinHood26]

2 minutes ago, rukaio101 said:

 

You asked "why would anyone pay anything to see something if everyone knows how to do it?" I answered that pirating's not always about 'because it's for free' and that if studios provided a good equivalent for a fair price most people would probably go for that instead. Hell, in the example you just gave, your roommate only pirated because the movies he wanted weren't on Netflix. Yet he's still willing to pay for Netflix rather than just pirate all the movies on that. See my point?

 

 

 

I have no idea why you keep quoting me.  Are you reading my posts? We are not saying different things. 

 

I AGREE, I'm just also stating that he is YOUNG. The same situation with a 55 year old and he doesn't pirate. Thats it. Thats all I was saying. 

[Daxtreme]

I think if you want to give the most money possible to the content creators, theater is the way to go.

 

Since studios keep a significant cut of the ticket sold, that's money going directly to them, and indirectly, to all the employees working in the industry under that studio since they will be able to maintain their contracts / hire new workers.

 

That's also why I go to the theater whenever I can  

[Plain Old Tele]

Not that every movie rip comes from them, but pirates movies are a huge cash cow for international crime organizations. That's a really skeezy area to step into just to scratch a movie itch.

 

Downloading torrents inevitably starts from a semi-reasonable consumer standpoint (i.e., it's not available in my country, on my streaming service, I pay for other movies, etc) but it tends to go downhill in ways that cause harm to content creators -- whether unintentionally or not. I've worked on short films that were intended for festival entries, only to find them turn up on torrents and illegal streaming sites. There was legitimately no reason either to rip them and put them up for public consumption, or any inherent demand, since they're entirely unknown. They were put up (presumably) just to satisfy some upload quota for membership. But the result is the film was effectively dead as any sort of potential festival entry. Even worse, the only way it could've been ripped was from one of the festival applications -- meaning someone actually associated with a film festival had such little respect for the medium and the people who create movies that they ripped it anyway.

 

People like to imagine that the studios aren't particularly hurt by this, or that the financial loss is minor compared to their overall profits, but the fact remains that piracy -- as a whole -- hurts people on the bottom rung; and on an intellectual level, shows an ignorance or callousness about the actual process of literally making the shit that the torrenteers claim to care about.

 

I'm now entering "old man yells at cloud" territory, but there's a whole generation that presumes and expects that content should be free, and doesn't have the faintest realization how that will affect them. The concept of resisting instant self-gratification seems completely alien to them, and I want to shout to the heavens: "Free content is not a right and should not be an expectation."

 

edit: incidentally, for those who care, renting or buying a streaming or digital movie actually returns the most to the content creators -- given the current contracts.

[Daxtreme]

Great post Tele, as usual your knowledge of the insides of the system is very insightful

 

6 minutes ago, Grand Moff Tele said:

incidentally, for those who care, renting or buying a streaming or digital movie actually returns the most to the content creators -- given the current contracts.

 

Wow, didn't know that.

 

I imagine that doesn't include Netflix? I mean, I pay $9 a month for Netflix, but they don't care if I'm watching Star Wars or Narcos or whatever, I imagine they give a fixed amount as rental for the streaming rights?

 

[75Live]

8 minutes ago, Grand Moff Tele said:

Not that every movie rip comes from them, but pirates movies are a huge cash cow for international crime organizations. That's a really skeezy area to step into just to scratch a movie itch.

 

Downloading torrents inevitably starts from a semi-reasonable consumer standpoint (i.e., it's not available in my country, on my streaming service, I pay for other movies, etc) but it tends to go downhill in ways that cause harm to content creators -- whether unintentionally or not. I've worked on short films that were intended for festival entries, only to find them turn up on torrents and illegal streaming sites. There was legitimately no reason either to rip them and put them up for public consumption, or any inherent demand, since they're entirely unknown. They were put up (presumably) just to satisfy some upload quota for membership. But the result is the film was effectively dead as any sort of potential festival entry. Even worse, the only way it could've been ripped was from one of the festival applications -- meaning someone actually associated with a film festival had such little respect for the medium and the people who create movies that they ripped it anyway.

 

People like to imagine that the studios aren't particularly hurt by this, or that the financial loss is minor compared to their overall profits, but the fact remains that piracy -- as a whole -- hurts people on the bottom rung; and on an intellectual level, shows an ignorance or callousness about the actual process of literally making the shit that the torrenteers claim to care about.

 

I'm now entering "old man yells at cloud" territory, but there's a whole generation that presumes and expects that content should be free, and doesn't have the faintest realization how that will affect them. The concept of resisting instant self-gratification seems completely alien to them, and I want to shout to the heavens: "Free content is not a right and should not be an expectation."

 

edit: incidentally, for those who care, renting or buying a streaming or digital movie actually returns the most to the content creators -- given the current contracts.

 

insert any random clapping gif here 

[That One Girl]

.

Edited June 8, 2022 by That One Guy

[Plain Old Tele]

4 minutes ago, Daxtreme said:

Great post Tele, as usual your knowledge of the insides of the system is very insightful

 

 

Wow, didn't know that.

 

I imagine that doesn't include Netflix? I mean, I pay $9 a month for Netflix, but they don't care if I'm watching Star Wars or Narcos or whatever, I imagine they give a fixed amount as rental for the streaming rights?

 

 

Yes, although from what I understand Netflix is really complicated because it doesn't involve a single movie. It's a huge package of all sorts (popular movies and un-popular ones) and somehow the studios and Netflix work out some percentage for each movie and then use that as a basis for residuals.

 

When I said streaming/rental and purchases, I meant stuff like iTunes, Amazon Video, Google Play, etc.

[Lordmandeep]

18 minutes ago, Grand Moff Tele said:

Not that every movie rip comes from them, but pirates movies are a huge cash cow for international crime organizations. That's a really skeezy area to step into just to scratch a movie itch.

 

Downloading torrents inevitably starts from a semi-reasonable consumer standpoint (i.e., it's not available in my country, on my streaming service, I pay for other movies, etc) but it tends to go downhill in ways that cause harm to content creators -- whether unintentionally or not. I've worked on short films that were intended for festival entries, only to find them turn up on torrents and illegal streaming sites. There was legitimately no reason either to rip them and put them up for public consumption, or any inherent demand, since they're entirely unknown. They were put up (presumably) just to satisfy some upload quota for membership. But the result is the film was effectively dead as any sort of potential festival entry. Even worse, the only way it could've been ripped was from one of the festival applications -- meaning someone actually associated with a film festival had such little respect for the medium and the people who create movies that they ripped it anyway.

 

People like to imagine that the studios aren't particularly hurt by this, or that the financial loss is minor compared to their overall profits, but the fact remains that piracy -- as a whole -- hurts people on the bottom rung; and on an intellectual level, shows an ignorance or callousness about the actual process of literally making the shit that the torrenteers claim to care about.

 

I'm now entering "old man yells at cloud" territory, but there's a whole generation that presumes and expects that content should be free, and doesn't have the faintest realization how that will affect them. The concept of resisting instant self-gratification seems completely alien to them, and I want to shout to the heavens: "Free content is not a right and should not be an expectation."

 

edit: incidentally, for those who care, renting or buying a streaming or digital movie actually returns the most to the content creators -- given the current contracts.

4

 

I think you are approaching old man yells at cloud because you are right from a moral point of view but impractical from how to deal with the problem.. People will not rent films digitally for 5-20 dollars either to the same level as the DVD days.

 

The idea is why is it that people would watch a film in theaters and then spend 20 bucks on a DVD to watch it again...however today people do not want to pay hardly anything to watch a film? 

 

I think that is a trend that is irreversible because the Hollywood types have put a lot of outdated restrictions on movies and music and with new technology and just a more open-minded viewpoint from younger people, these closed systems are pretty much being imploded.

 

If Hollywood wants to continue making money they need to reform as the music industry has.  

Edited December 30, 2016 by Lordmandeep

[Plain Old Tele]

9 minutes ago, Lordmandeep said:

If Hollywood wants to continue making money they need to reform as the music industry has.  

 

But how does that even look? I mean, yes, I agree that some sort of Spotify-type service would be helpful, especially if all the studios signed on and agreed to license their respective libraries. But would users pay a monthly fee? 99 cents per rental? No fee at all? There has to be either some reasonable way to make money.

 

But that doesn't really address the fact that young consumers now expect to have free content given to them. How is that supposed to work?

[Lordmandeep]

Just now, Grand Moff Tele said:

 

But how does that even look? I mean, yes, I agree that some sort of Spotify-type service would be helpful, especially if all the studios signed on and agreed to license their respective libraries. But would users pay a monthly fee? 99 cents per rental? No fee at all? There has to be either some reasonable way to make money.

 

But that doesn't really address the fact that young consumers now expect to have free content given to them. How is that supposed to work?

 

 

Make more movies like Suicide Squad 

[Plain Old Tele]

Just now, Lordmandeep said:

 

Make more movies like Suicide Squad 

 

That's a cheap dodge, of course.

[elcaballero]

13 minutes ago, Lordmandeep said:

If Hollywood wants to continue making money they need to reform as the music industry has.  

Ask artists that are trying get off the ground what they think about the new music industry. Very little money actually makes its way into their pockets.

[John Marston]

top ten pirated movies of 2016

 

 

Deadpool

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice

Captain America Civil War

Star Wars The Force Awakens

X-Men Apocalypse

Warcraft

Independence Day: Resurgence

Suicide Squad

Finding Dory

The Revenant

 

 

 

[FantasticBeasts]

3 minutes ago, Grand Moff Tele said:

 

But how does that even look? I mean, yes, I agree that some sort of Spotify-type service would be helpful, especially if all the studios signed on and agreed to license their respective libraries. But would users pay a monthly fee? 99 cents per rental? No fee at all? There has to be either some reasonable way to make money.

 

But that doesn't really address the fact that young consumers now expect to have free content given to them. How is that supposed to work?

Spotify though is free and yet artists make money. Isn't that possiblle? I mean I think the ideal thing would be to have a rental for movies that are on theaters or for generally new movies and the other ones to be free. I mean If piracy exists in such a larrge scale why not legalize it and try make a profit out of it. That's what happened in music industry and it worked perfectly!

[That One Girl]

.

Edited June 8, 2022 by That One Guy

[elcaballero]

2 minutes ago, John Marston said:

top ten pirated movies of 2016

 

 

Deadpool

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice

Captain America Civil War

Star Wars The Force Awakens

X-Men Apocalypse

Warcraft

Independence Day: Resurgence

Suicide Squad

Finding Dory

The Revenant

 

 

 

You can't tell me that piracy didn't hurt a movie like Warcraft. Every penny counted for it.

[XO21]

Spotify and the likes aren't profitable at all, You Tube included for musicians,

[Lordmandeep]

8 minutes ago, Grand Moff Tele said:

 

That's a cheap dodge, of course.

 

 

 

 

I was being silly but a massive Netflix like system that requires a monthly fee or a rather cheap rental fee is the only one that will work.

 

Digital rental services for movies are rather small because the prices are ridiculous. 

 

People will continue to watch the Star Wars and Superhero or Animation movies in theaters though. 

 

 

The video game market is strong for the only reason its very difficult and next to impossible to Pirate Video games, however look at PC gaming...it is pretty much dead compared to the past. 

Edited December 30, 2016 by Lordmandeep