Thor: Love and Thunder | July 8, 2022 | Directed by Oscar Winner Taika Waititi | Ninth most profitable movie of 2022

[Rebeccas]

35 minutes ago, ThomasNicole said:

Agreed, i also notice pretty much all the mixed reactions are from more "serious" critics. 

 

Is kinda normal, that's why movies always open higher on RT and then drops a bit, but yeah with Thor seems like a harder dissonance than usual.

 

I'm not sure about a yellow on metacritic, because most critics that counts on metacritic usually don't post reactions on social media when they're writing the full review. But something like 65 on metacritic but a way better RT average that counts a much bigger sample wouldn't surprise me at all.

Yeah it’s hard to say cause we don’t actually know who’s writing the reviews for what publication. But the fact that people like Gregory Ellwood, Anne Thompson, Erik Anderson, etc (aka pretty middle of the road and in tune with overall critics and audience taste) really like it seems like it will do fine with the middle aged establishment critics who aren’t terminally online and engaging in film twitter discourse 24-7. 

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

19 hours ago, Ryan Reynolds said:

this movie was destined to be rotten the moment Taika was hired for Star Wars

It was doomed after he wont he Oscar for Jojo Rabbit. Since then, he's been on the verge of overexposure with Free Guy as well as a half dozen new shows. It was bound to happen. I know his reasoning for working, but it's best to lay low for a little bit. In addition to overexposure, his ego is probably huge and the scrappy, heartfelt crowdpleasers he was good at making which people liked won't come as natural anymore with any rooting factor. 

 

It's just hard to continue replicating what he made fresh with Ragnarok, Wilderpeople, What We Do In Shadows

[ThomasNicole]

8 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

It was doomed after he wont he Oscar for Jojo Rabbit. Since then, he's been on the verge of overexposure with Free Guy as well as a half dozen new shows. It was bound to happen. I know his reasoning for working, but it's best to lay low for a little bit. In addition to overexposure, his ego is probably huge and the scrappy, heartfelt crowdpleasers he was good at making which people liked won't come as natural anymore with any rooting factor. 

 

It's just hard to continue replicating what he made fresh with Ragnarok, Wilderpeople, What We Do In Shadows

I agreed a lot with this. 

 

Too many people complain these days about his humor, but honestly it's not very different from James Gunn and nobody keeps hating James. I'm nearly 100% sure is simply because James is low profile and Taika is promoting something every month. 

 

He have another movie coming in a few months, but after that he really should disappear a bit before Star Wars to avoid these feelings on social media. 

 

I don't think it will have any significant bad effect on this movie other than tweets overreacting, but it's definitely something to be careful, overexposing is always bad.

[Menor the Destroyer]

If it affects the quality of his work then he should slow down. Otherwise, who cares what a few people on Twitter say if he's putting out well-received work? 

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

1 minute ago, Menor Reborn said:

If it affects the quality of his work then he should slow down. Otherwise, who cares what a few people on Twitter say if he's putting out well-received work? 

Love and Thunder isn't going to be as well-received as Ragnarok and Jojo Rabbit was very divisive critically. that's my point. It's not just "Twitter". It's hard to make a good follow-up to a surprise. I really like Guardians 2 but it objectively had weaker reception than the first. 

[Menor the Destroyer]

1 minute ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

Love and Thunder isn't going to be as well-received as Ragnarok and Jojo Rabbit was very divisive critically. that's my point. It's not just "Twitter". It's hard to make a good follow-up to a surprise. I really like Guardians 2 but it objectively had weaker reception than the first. 

To the first point, Jojo Rabbit was well-received and got him an Oscar despite being divisive critically, so I would call that a success. And I think your second point holds true regardless of his volume of work. 

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

6 minutes ago, ThomasNicole said:

I agreed a lot with this. 

 

Too many people complain these days about his humor, but honestly it's not very different from James Gunn and nobody keeps hating James. I'm nearly 100% sure is simply because James is low profile and Taika is promoting something every month. 

 

He have another movie coming in a few months, but after that he really should disappear a bit before Star Wars to avoid these feelings on social media. 

 

I don't think it will have any significant bad effect on this movie other than tweets overreacting, but it's definitely something to be careful, overexposing is always bad.

Yeah. Every director or star once they hit a career peak, are threatened with overexposure and inflated expectations. It's just the way it goes. I think Gunn had some benefit of doubt after vol 2 when he was fired while nobody really anticipated TSS being good. But Taika has so many projects that it's just likely not all of them will land the same way as his films have before.

 

I'm still thinking like 80s Rotten Tomatoes (70s at worst) and mid/high 60s Metacritic which is MCU range.

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

2 minutes ago, Menor Reborn said:

To the first point, Jojo Rabbit was well-received and got him an Oscar despite being divisive critically, so I would call that a success. And I think your second point holds true regardless of his volume of work. 

Why did you ignore the part when I said critically divisive? It has a 7.60 Rotten Tomato average and a 58 on Metacritic which is literally classified as "mixed or average reviews". Yes, it won Oscars but it's undeniable the critical reception was polarizing and all over the place.

[RRA]

13 minutes ago, Menor Reborn said:

If it affects the quality of his work then he should slow down. Otherwise, who cares what a few people on Twitter say if he's putting out well-received work? 

Because some people live on social media and confuse that for the real world? 

[Menor the Destroyer]

3 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

Why did you ignore the part when I said critically divisive? It has a 7.60 Rotten Tomato average and a 58 on Metacritic which is literally classified as "mixed or average reviews". Yes, it won Oscars but it's undeniable the critical reception was polarizing and all over the place.

I didn't ignore it. I explicitly acknowledged it in my post, but I don't think critical reception is the most significant bar for success. 

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

Just now, Menor Reborn said:

I didn't ignore it. I explicitly acknowledged it in my post, but I don't think critical reception is the most significant bar for success. 

It's not, but it absolutely is significant. Critically, he had throughout his career. Ragnarok is one of the highest rated MCU films. Wilderpeople is 81 Metacritic, What We Do in the Shadows is 76, and Boy is 70. Jojo Rabbit was his weakest reviewed since Eagle vs Shark, even if audiences liked it. 

[Cooper Legion]

Edit: lol wrong thread

Edited July 2, 2022 by Legion and Thunder

[Menor the Destroyer]

3 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

It's not, but it absolutely is significant. Critically, he had throughout his career. Ragnarok is one of the highest rated MCU films. Wilderpeople is 81 Metacritic, What We Do in the Shadows is 76, and Boy is 70. Jojo Rabbit was his weakest reviewed since Eagle vs Shark, even if audiences liked it. 

I think exchanging a sparser set of critical darlings and audience hits for a more frequent set of critically divisive but well-received movies is a reasonable trade. 

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

Just now, Menor Reborn said:

I think exchanging a sparser set of critical darlings and audience hits for a more frequent set of critically divisive but well-received movies is a reasonable trade. 

Yes, that's what I'm saying is happening

[Menor the Destroyer]

2 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

Yes, that's what I'm saying is happening

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just disagree that it's necessarily a bad thing. 

[ThomasNicole]

To be fair, Jojo Rabbit polarized reception have a lot to do with it's sensitive themes. Kinda like Joker where lots of reviews was more worried about violence then the movie itself.

 

I remember it was very mixed on RT aswell after TIFF but it keeps growing for months after that until reach an actually very solid average on RT (7.6 or so)

 

But metacritic doesn't allow reviews to keep being added so it's consensus stopped right there around the TIFF premiere where people was still discussing the problematics and questioning if it's even right to do a comedy about this. 

 

So i think it would happen anyway, it's a polarizing theme afterall, but it won TIFF, an Oscar, it have 4.0 on Letterboxd so it's fine.

Edited July 2, 2022 by ThomasNicole

[BestPicturePlutoNash]

34 minutes ago, Menor Reborn said:

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just disagree that it's necessarily a bad thing. 

Ok lol

[Rebeccas]

38 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

It's not, but it absolutely is significant. Critically, he had throughout his career. Ragnarok is one of the highest rated MCU films. Wilderpeople is 81 Metacritic, What We Do in the Shadows is 76, and Boy is 70. Jojo Rabbit was his weakest reviewed since Eagle vs Shark, even if audiences liked it. 

 

Jojo Rabbit's reception is basically Life is Beautiful 2.0, some people will simply never see it as okay to make a lighter film about that kind of subject, like the bar to clear for something like that to be universally accepted is unbelievably high. Even things that are now classics like Blazing Saddles had very polarizing reception at the time. To be or not to be (1942) was heavily criticized when it was released and did not do well at all the box office . I'm 100% sure Waititi knew when making the film it would be controversial. Winning the Oscar over film twitter darling Greta Gerwig no doubt meant they were out for blood lol. 

 

As for his overall filmography, I think once he makes a small film again, the critics will be on board and praise him going back to his "roots". I honestly don't take too much stock into MC ratings cause to me there's way too much of an agenda in how critics respond to things, like you can go into any director's filmography, usually their early stuff when they're too unknown is undervalued and then there's usually a huge critical breakout that's overrated and then a critical dropoff when they get tired of them that's kind of extremely harsh (David O. Russell's filmography for example). To me Boy is just as good if not better than Hunt for the Wilderpeople but it didn't get the credit it deserved at the time cause he was simply too obscure. 

 

Also his television projects have all gotten raves like he just won a Peabody, Indie Spirit, Gotham, etc with Reservation Dogs, which is one of the most critically acclaimed shows on TV now. It sounds like the next 6m or so he'll be mostly working in TV anyways so film people can take a break from him, unless Next Goal Wins becomes an Oscar thing, in which case I'm sure there will be loads of complaining but whatever. 

[Rebeccas]

41 minutes ago, ThomasNicole said:

To be fair, Jojo Rabbit polarized reception have a lot to do with it's sensitive themes. Kinda like Joker where lots of reviews was more worried about violence then the movie itself.

 

I remember it was very mixed on RT aswell after TIFF but it keeps growing for months after that until reach an actually very solid average on RT (7.6 or so)

 

But metacritic doesn't allow reviews to keep being added so it's consensus stopped right there around the TIFF premiere where people was still discussing the problematics and questioning if it's even right to do a comedy about this. 

 

So i think it would happen anyway, it's a polarizing theme afterall, but it won TIFF, an Oscar, it have 4.0 on Letterboxd so it's fine.

 

My friend was at the TIFF premiere for Jojo Rabbit and said the crowd went so wild for so long they literally had to tell them to shut up so they could start the Q&A lol. I mean I have it well below his top tier (Boy, WWDITS and Hunt for the Wilderpeople) but it's clearly beloved and will probably be a film lots of younger people grow up watching through school and stuff. 

 

Obvs I haven't seen L&T but I get the feeling it's probably not that far off from Ragnarok, but when Ragnarok came out he was like the cool indie director everyone was in love with since the pineapple outfit photo and everyone wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. Now he's an A-list celebrity who won an Oscar, has a messy personal life, has threeways with famous singers and actresses, and doesn't have the underdog rootability factor anymore. 

[ThomasNicole]

6 minutes ago, Rebeccas said:

 

Jojo Rabbit's reception is basically Life is Beautiful 2.0, some people will simply never see it as okay to make a lighter film about that kind of subject, like the bar to clear for something like that to be universally accepted is unbelievably high. Even things that are now classics like Blazing Saddles had very polarizing reception at the time. To be or not to be (1942) was heavily criticized when it was released and did not do well at all the box office . I'm 100% sure Waititi knew when making the film it would be controversial. Winning the Oscar over film twitter darling Greta Gerwig no doubt meant they were out for blood lol. 

 

As for his overall filmography, I think once he makes a small film again, the critics will be on board and praise him going back to his "roots". I honestly don't take too much stock into MC ratings cause to me there's way too much of an agenda in how critics respond to things, like you can go into any director's filmography, usually their early stuff when they're too unknown is undervalued and then there's usually a huge critical breakout that's overrated and then a critical dropoff when they get tired of them that's kind of extremely harsh (David O. Russell's filmography for example). To me Boy is just as good if not better than Hunt for the Wilderpeople but it didn't get the credit it deserved at the time cause he was simply too obscure. 

 

Also his television projects have all gotten raves like he just won a Peabody, Indie Spirit, Gotham, etc with Reservation Dogs, which is one of the most critically acclaimed shows on TV now. It sounds like the next 6m or so he'll be mostly working in TV anyways so film people can take a break from him, unless Next Goal Wins becomes an Oscar thing, in which case I'm sure there will be loads of complaining but whatever. 

I think Next Goals Wins is coming to try entering award season. 

 

Rumours about premiere at Telluride or TIFF like Jojo.

 

One brazilian critic that i liked a lot read the book and said it have strong potential if well adapted, let's see, since it's a smaller project i think it could enter this "back to his roots" reception if it's good. 

 

But yeah people on film twitter will definitely have a meltdown if he ended up with 2 well received movies this year despite them being tired of him.