The Last Duel - Ridley Scott, Matt Damon & Adam Driver | October 15, 2021

[filmlover]

9 minutes ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

It's not so much "requirement" or "obligation". Just a question of why interest died down for non-MCU/disney, etc movies? Is it the oversaturation of those action movies? Was it streaming? A cultural shift? Is it the movies themselves? Then again, a lot of them have decent reviews and still fail to catch on. 

The "adult" movie becoming an endangered species is a direct result of individual starpower dying more than anything else tbh. People like Tom Cruise would still pull $20M+ openings easily on their own even when the movies had mediocre reviews. Said people aged out of the types of roles that made them famous and no one replaced them. In this day and age you need to have a whole bunch of talented people together in one movie ala a Knives Out for anyone to get excited for a star vehicle.

 

Entertainment Weekly did a big cover story in 2004 called "Why Hollywood Can't Find The Next Julia Roberts." Here we are, 17 years later, and it's become pretty much accepted that there never was a "next Julia Roberts."

Edited October 16, 2021 by filmlover

[AJG]

This movie could’ve been big on Netflix. It could’ve seen 2 or maybe even 3 weeks of relevance.

[Pinacolada]

3 hours ago, Ozymandias said:

 

The trick to Kingdom of Heaven is just accepting that Orlando Bloom was miscast and take in the top notch movie all around him.

 

Its also ridiculous how many beautiful shots are in that movie that you could frame on a wall.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Such a great, beautiful film (the director's cut)

 

Anyway, I will see this on Monday. Hoping for not "under $5M OW" numbers tomorrow

Edited October 16, 2021 by Pinacolada

[dudalb]

4 hours ago, wildphantom said:

1917. With no stars. 
 

Exodus did fine. Noah did really well. 
 

Historical big budget epics should be making half decent money. 

God, you are righT. I forgot about 1917.

Still, for every histoircal film that makes money  two or three don;t. I don't like this either. In fact, the David Lean epics might be my favorite fllms of all time.

[dudalb]

4 hours ago, Ronin46 said:

I actually love Ridley Scott and Kingdom of Heaven (directors 4hr cut and not the first 1 released). Even Orlando can be fine at times but he is a weaker point in KOH. But my god how many projects is Ridley attached to that he has no real ambition to make. 

God, we might agree on somethng.  Scott's Kingdome of Heaven in it's full version is simply a great film.

Only quibble I  have is showing the Battle of Hattin, the desisive battle of the Crusades, happen off screen after a big build up, but the incredible Siege of Jerusalem sort of makes up for it.

Edited October 16, 2021 by dudalb

[Legion Again]

1 hour ago, BestPicturePlutoNash said:

It's not so much "requirement" or "obligation". Just a question of why interest died down for non-MCU/disney, etc movies? Is it the oversaturation of those action movies? Was it streaming? A cultural shift? Is it the movies themselves? Then again, a lot of them have decent reviews and still fail to catch on. 

Even though I’m not surprised by it as much as it seems like many (older) people are, I do think the question of “what changed” is a very interesting one, sociologically. Because it is definitely true that this whole style of adult drama movies could do huge business for decades and decades, and that’s pretty much stopped.    
 

Personally I think a lot has to do with:

increases in visual effects tech making action spectacles more grandiose/affordable

streaming emerging as a convenient alternative for movies without too much spectacle especially

Social media driving a different mode of social engagement and conversation about movies — Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, insta etc are good for driving fandom style engagement which adult dramas aren’t really designed to generate, and I think this is (partly) behind the massive IP/sequel/franchise/reboot/spinoff era which again largely excludes adult dramas

[WrathOfHan]

#BringBackSadffleck

[wildphantom]

4 hours ago, filmlover said:

So because people see some movies they are required to see others even if they have no interest? Watching movies is a choice, not a personal obligation we have to fulfill like paying our taxes.

No, that’s not what I’m saying at all. I don’t need to get into it further. People know exactly what I mean. 

[Firepower]

6 hours ago, filmlover said:

So because people see some movies they are required to see others even if they have no interest? Watching movies is a choice, not a personal obligation we have to fulfill like paying our taxes.

Of course it's a choice, just don't complain about why Hollywood makes mostly IP stuff because many people complain about "originality" in Hollywood, but at the same time they watch only IP stuff (and not even good ones) and ignore non-IP stuff which always amuses me.

Edited October 16, 2021 by Firepower

[Valonqar]

5 hours ago, WrathOfHan said:

#BringBackSadffleck

 

BOT emojis never recovered. SadWho just doesn't cut it. 

 

7 hours ago, AJG said:

This movie could’ve been big on Netflix. It could’ve seen 2 or maybe even 3 weeks of relevance.

 

Having seen it last night, I agree. If something much less compelling as King could have done reasonably well on streaming, this would have too. 

 

It's a very good film but I understand why audience isn't rushing to see it. It isn't the kind of formula that you want to see when it comes to historical epics - undisputed hero takes on an undisputed villain and there's a romance with a beautiful maiden/princess/queen. This movie doesn't follow these rules. The hero is Comer. There's no romance cause marriage is arranged and Damon is kind of a dick. The duel is basically a bad man vs a worse man. Cue 1 star audience reviews dismissing the movie as "woke garbage" and "Men Le Bad". Also, as thrilling as the action is, and make no mistake that part is thrilling af, the movie is mostly a procedural told from 3 POV that might strike some viewers as repetitive. Even though each POV reveals something else, and actors aptly adjust their acting to changes in the view, not everyone is down for such subtleties. 

 

So long story short, this isn't what puts butts in cinema seats, but I have to give it to marketing that it didn't try to BS and sell a movie as something it is not (noble Damon and dastardly Driver fighting for Comer). However, I think that this would have been a popular choice on Netflix as AJG suggested, because people are more ready to give a chance to unexpected when it's free and they have an option to change the program and watch something else if they aren't engrossed. 

 

 

Edited October 16, 2021 by Valonqar

[Firepower]

Streaming results matter only when it's financed by a streaming platform. If it's a traditional studio film it doesn't matter at all. When VHS/DVD/Blu-Ray sales died over the years, studios stopped taking post-theatrical revenue seriously, it's actually one of the reasons why we didn't get Hellboy 3.

[Valonqar]

Agree and I think AJG probably meant "made by Netflix" "Netflix original".

[TheDude391]

No one does medieval better than Ridley, loved it and my new favourite of the year. 

[Macleod]

Saw it.  Liked it.  Haven't seen every single one of Scott's recent films from the past ten years or so, but this one to me is more of a 'keeper' than The Martian and obviously in a whole different league than Covenant.  But nothing beats the genius of The Counselor, probably his best film of the last decade.  Haven't seen All the Money, Exodus, or Body of Lies. 

 

I love the way it plays out, and yes, how Damon's character is gradually revealed to be slimier.  Affleck is wild.  Driver is great.  Comer should probably get a nomination.  Also a nom for costumes, set design, possibly editing.  But since the movie's failing, I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't get any...  Also saw the trailer for GUCCI before this -- I hadn't seen this at all, yet.  Looks wild.  Audience was mostly older, like *way* older. No big surprise.  Theatre was around half full on a Saturday afternoon in a major metropolitan area, wondering if this might do just a little better over the weekend than predicted?  

Edited October 17, 2021 by Macleod

[EmmaPeel]

As much as I enjoyed the movie, I'm really vexed why they didn't go streaming with it. 20 Century/Disney had to know months ago that it wasn't going to make money at the BO, especially in this horrible release slot. It would've gotten far more eyeballs and buzz on Hulu, Netflix, Prime, or HBO Max.

 

When I saw it, there were only two of us in the theater. It's a shame considering how much everyone involved clearly put into it. 

[Firepower]

5 hours ago, Macleod said:

Saw it.  Liked it.  Haven't seen every single one of Scott's recent films from the past ten years or so, but this one to me is more of a 'keeper' than The Martian and obviously in a whole different league than Covenant.  But nothing beats the genius of The Counselor, probably his best film of the last decade.  Haven't seen All the Money, Exodus, or Body of Lies. 

 

I love the way it plays out, and yes, how Damon's character is gradually revealed to be slimier.  Affleck is wild.  Driver is great.  Comer should probably get a nomination.  Also a nom for costumes, set design, possibly editing.  But since the movie's failing, I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't get any...  Also saw the trailer for GUCCI before this -- I hadn't seen this at all, yet.  Looks wild.  Audience was mostly older, like *way* older. No big surprise.  Theatre was around half full on a Saturday afternoon in a major metropolitan area, wondering if this might do just a little better over the weekend than predicted?  

Check out Body Of Lies, I thought it was very good.

[ThePrinceIsOnFire]

Saw it last night. 

 

It was FANTASTIC. A timely tale of freedom, pride and misogyny. 

One could perceive the "90's epic" vibes throughout, yet it still felt fresh and actual. The performances were nothing short of spectacular, with Comer being the highlight: it's hard to believe that she could miss the Best actress' nominations cut. 

The last hour or so is pretty much a display on how to build tension and then reward the audience, an impressive feat by Ridley.

I loved how they used real locations in France and cut down on the CGI and fake sets, as it really helps building up that immersive experience.

The costumes looked absolutely great (Comer was stunning in all of her dresses), yet they were not exactly period-appropriate, which I think was a bit of a misstep, because this kind of "Old-timey" medieval fantasy clothing evokes more of a fairy tale setting than the realistic grittyness they were (otherwise) going for.

An other -minor- issue I had with the film was the lack of a recurring music theme, which I think would've greatly helped magnifying the movie resonance and legacy in the future.

 

Still, despite its flaws (it's a bit too long, and the POV narrative style gets tiring at times in Le Gris's segment) I would say that this is all-around (visually, thematically) the best movie of the year.

 

Please go watch it in a theatre if you can, it deserves to be seen on a huge screen!

Edited October 17, 2021 by ThePrinceIsOnFire

[Val357]

4 hours ago, ThePrinceIsOnFire said:

Saw it last night. 

 

It was FANTASTIC. A timely tale of freedom, pride and misogyny. 

One could perceive the "90's epic" vibes throughout, yet it still felt fresh and actual. The performances were nothing short of spectacular, with Comer being the highlight: it's hard to believe that she could miss the Best actress' nominations cut. 

The last hour or so is pretty much a display on how to build tension and then reward the audience, an impressive feat by Ridley.

I loved how they used real locations in France and cut down on the CGI and fake sets, as it really helps building up that immersive experience.

The costumes looked absolutely great (Comer was stunning in all of her dresses), yet they were not exactly period-appropriate, which I think was a bit of a misstep, because this kind of "Old-timey" medieval fantasy clothing evokes more of a fairy tale setting than the realistic grittyness they were (otherwise) going for.

An other -minor- issue I had with the film was the lack of a recurring music theme, which I think would've greatly helped magnifying the movie resonance and legacy in the future.

 

Still, despite its flaws (it's a bit too long, and the POV narrative style gets tiring at times in Le Gris's segment) I would say that this is all-around (visually, thematically) the best movie of the year.

 

Please go watch it in a theatre if you can, it deserves to be seen on a huge screen!

I wish I could! Hopefully it's not long before I can rent it on demand! It looks amazing, regardless of the tough subject matter. I simply adore historical epics!

[Ozymandias]

20 hours ago, Macleod said:

Saw it.  Liked it.  Haven't seen every single one of Scott's recent films from the past ten years or so, but this one to me is more of a 'keeper' than The Martian and obviously in a whole different league than Covenant.  But nothing beats the genius of The Counselor, probably his best film of the last decade.  Haven't seen All the Money, Exodus, or Body of Lies. 

 

I love the way it plays out, and yes, how Damon's character is gradually revealed to be slimier.  Affleck is wild.  Driver is great.  Comer should probably get a nomination.  Also a nom for costumes, set design, possibly editing.  But since the movie's failing, I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't get any...  Also saw the trailer for GUCCI before this -- I hadn't seen this at all, yet.  Looks wild.  Audience was mostly older, like *way* older. No big surprise.  Theatre was around half full on a Saturday afternoon in a major metropolitan area, wondering if this might do just a little better over the weekend than predicted?  

 

Curious why you think The Counselor is so good, I think that one is seen as his worst movie.  I don't outright hate it like most people do... but it is a weird, fascinating, WTF, and occasionally insane failure imo.

 

The biggest thing I got out of The Counselor is that I really, really want to see Ridley Scott do a western.

[lorddemaxus]

On 10/15/2021 at 5:16 PM, Ozymandias said:

 

The trick to Kingdom of Heaven is just accepting that Orlando Bloom was miscast and take in the top notch movie all around him.

 

Its also ridiculous how many beautiful shots are in that movie that you could frame on a wall.

 

 

 

 

 

I just realized this came out in the same year as Munich. Both movies are masterpieces and would make a very good double feature imo.