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Skipper Eric

Weekend Thread: SW 26.2/25.3/21 72.5M | Jumanji 11.7/12.4/11 35.1M | Frozen 6/5.85/5.3 17.15M

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11 minutes ago, Zakiyyah6 said:

I don't think spending 300mil per picture in the future will be a smart idea until they right the ship. Mandalorian is a television thing and I don't think has much barring on the theatrical films unless they use those same people to make the films. FB3 is a guarantee flop. WB better lower the budget a lot.

Yeah, better to make the next mainline Star Wars below $200M and don't commit to a full trilogy.

Edited by stealthyfrog
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6 minutes ago, RockyMountain said:

Sure. Problem is is that people often don't really express their feelings very well and they often come off as just trying to poke fun at something instead of having a discussion about a topic. Forums like this in general has pretty much just become an extension of twitter though where many people just use it as an avenue to react instead of to discuss.

I often avoid this thread because people freak out too much. I get the frustration with the "everything is a flop including movies that in no way under performed" crowd. But sometimes films really are flops and sometimes they really are under performers. Of course TROS is not a flop in anyway shape or form and no Star Wars is not anywhere near dead. But the franchise is having trouble right now and TROS is under performing. 

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32 minutes ago, JohnnyGossamer said:

To me, people are way overreacting. I definitely agree. This is already being proven with Mandalorian's popularity. And, with Disney+, they can work to cultivate off shoots and new characters and corners of the galaxy, etc. I couldn't agree more.

People maybe overreact a little bit. But there's no denying that this brand now is little damaged and not in the condition where franchise like Star Wars should be. Yess , Disney already proved they can make a great orginal series with Mandalorian . Hope that translates to new Trilogy too.

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1 minute ago, Zakiyyah6 said:

I often avoid this thread because people freak out too much. I get the frustration with the "everything is a flop including movies that in no way under performed" crowd. But sometimes films really are flops and sometimes they really are under performers. Of course TROS is not a flop in anyway shape or form and no Star Wars is not anywhere near dead. But the franchise is having trouble right now and TROS is under performing. 

That's true. However they are moving on from this trilogy and these characters anyways and quite frankly it really wasn't that good of movie anyhow so it just making a billion would be fine in most people's eyes. None of us can really speak for Disney but while they wouldn't necessarily be extremely happy about it they also wouldn't be having the mindset that all plans need to be altered and everyone needs to get fired. The concern would be somewhere in the middle and they really just need to plan things out better than they did for the ST and things will likely be fine then.

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1 hour ago, cedec0 said:

 

 

Mandalorian is doing well because it is focusing on the half of the star wars brand that is relatively undamaged:  the Western sci-fi side.  The other half of the star wars brand, which has been horribly damaged, will be much harder to salvage.

 

To understand the part of star wars that lies in ruins, you have to understand the two elements that turned star wars into a multi-billion dollar franchise.  One part was western science fiction, and the other part was Chinese martial arts fiction (referred to as wuxia)

 

Below is a description of elements found in nearly every wuxia novel:  (it should seem familiar.)

 

 

The best way to describe the first six star wars film is a beautiful mixture of Easter martial art fiction and Western sci-fi fiction.  Problem is, lucasfilm has been managed by people who think of star wars as "wizards with laser swords".  These people didn't understand that star wars was the world's most valuable martial arts franchise, with horrifying results.

 

 

How do you break a martial arts franchise?  Here is how.   You have a nobody from nowhere, who has never trained a single day in martial arts, pick up a sword for the first time and defeat one the galaxy's strongest martial artists, who has trained for decades on how use the force and the sword.  That is how you turn a martial arts franchise into a joke.  How you turn star wars into "wizards with laser swords".

 

In both wuxia and the OT/PT, being force/qi sensative means nothing without training in the martial arts.  You don't become a master martial artist without training, period, this is common sense.  TFA badly damage the wuxia side of star wars.  TLJ finished it off.

 

In TLJ, Rey is able to lift ten times more stuff than Yoda, with essentially zero training.  This completely breaks the martial arts side of star wars.  Not only can someone with zero training do the same things as martial artists who have trained centuries, they can do it ten times better.  Sigh...

 

In the first six movies, the force/jedi were based on chinese martial arts lore (talented individuals gain strength through training).  In the last three movies, the force/jedi was based on a bad version of Harry Potter (sense the force, poof  >> jedi master).

 

A four billion dollar martial arts franchise was put in the hands of people who think martial artists are wizards...

 

------------------------------------

 

EDIT:  It should also be clear from this why TROS is bombing in China.  They see the corruption of the wuxia side of star wars far clearer there.

 

 

Eloquently stated and a significantly underappreciated element, of the many problems that have been identified with these Disney  SW movies. Nicely done. I signed up just to say that.

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3 minutes ago, redfirebird2008 said:

 

Second game was headed for blowout city in the first half, but turned out very solid in the end. 

Yep. Clemson just needed to gain a little momentum and then they were fine. They had too good of skill position guys for them to be shut down for the entire game.

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1 hour ago, cedec0 said:

 

 

Mandalorian is doing well because it is focusing on the half of the star wars brand that is relatively undamaged:  the Western sci-fi side.  The other half of the star wars brand, which has been horribly damaged, will be much harder to salvage.

 

To understand the part of star wars that lies in ruins, you have to understand the two elements that turned star wars into a multi-billion dollar franchise.  One part was western science fiction, and the other part was Chinese martial arts fiction (referred to as wuxia)

 

Below is a description of elements found in nearly every wuxia novel:  (it should seem familiar.)

 

 

The best way to describe the first six star wars film is a beautiful mixture of Easter martial art fiction and Western sci-fi fiction.  Problem is, lucasfilm has been managed by people who think of star wars as "wizards with laser swords".  These people didn't understand that star wars was the world's most valuable martial arts franchise, with horrifying results.

 

 

How do you break a martial arts franchise?  Here is how.   You have a nobody from nowhere, who has never trained a single day in martial arts, pick up a sword for the first time and defeat one the galaxy's strongest martial artists, who has trained for decades on how use the force and the sword.  That is how you turn a martial arts franchise into a joke.  How you turn star wars into "wizards with laser swords".

 

In both wuxia and the OT/PT, being force/qi sensative means nothing without training in the martial arts.  You don't become a master martial artist without training, period, this is common sense.  TFA badly damage the wuxia side of star wars.  TLJ finished it off.

 

In TLJ, Rey is able to lift ten times more stuff than Yoda, with essentially zero training.  This completely breaks the martial arts side of star wars.  Not only can someone with zero training do the same things as martial artists who have trained centuries, they can do it ten times better.  Sigh...

 

In the first six movies, the force/jedi were based on chinese martial arts lore (talented individuals gain strength through training).  In the last three movies, the force/jedi was based on a bad version of Harry Potter (sense the force, poof  >> jedi master).

 

A four billion dollar martial arts franchise was put in the hands of people who think martial artists are wizards...

 

------------------------------------

 

EDIT:  It should also be clear from this why TROS is bombing in China.  They see the corruption of the wuxia side of star wars far clearer there.

 

 

That was well stated. 
 

Another thing to add about Star Wars’s appeal (or lack thereof) in China is the actual quality of those lightsabers fights/duels. I mean, they’re all kinds of bad when compare to even the standard staged sword fights you normally see in wuxia movies.

 

I have always admired Star Wars for its cultural impact, and I enjoy it greatly for the space opera aspect, but growing up as a big wuxia fan, I have always found those action scenes in Star Wars pretty...laughable? (no offense to the fans, just personal preference and experience) 

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11 minutes ago, Sam said:

That was well stated. 
 

Another thing to add about Star Wars’s appeal (or lack thereof) in China is the actual quality of those lightsabers fights/duels. I mean, they’re all kinds of bad when compare to even the standard staged sword fights you normally see in wuxia movies.

 

I have always admired Star Wars for its cultural impact, and I enjoy it greatly for the space opera aspect, but growing up as a big wuxia fan, I have always found those action scenes in Star Wars pretty...laughable? (no offense to the fans, just personal preference and experience) 

When you compare this 

 

 

VS

 

 

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The updated number from JediJat are much better. 

Frozen 2 and Jumanji 3 are cutting into Tros buissness. 

I wouldn't be surprised with 320m+ for J3.

20% drop from previous movie is no way bad. Jumanji has become solid franchise. 

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Quote

I have always admired Star Wars for its cultural impact, and I enjoy it greatly for the space opera aspect, but growing up as a big wuxia fan, I have always found those action scenes in Star Wars pretty...laughable? (no offense to the fans, just personal preference and experience) 

There are a few exceptions to this which show what the potential could be:

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Daniel Vasquez said:

Wow! Frozen II got a drop from Friday, I thought it will have a increase but guess not 😔

That pattern has held for the past three years (Moana, Coco, Ralph Breaks the Internet), and 2015/16 only breaks the pattern due to Saturday being the day after Christmas/New Years.

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37 minutes ago, Zakiyyah6 said:

I hope Jumanji hits 300mil and I hope Little Women hits the 100mil mark.

I want J2 to hit $300m if only because of all the doom & gloom that happened after the China numbers dropped, lol

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21 minutes ago, TMP said:

I want J2 to hit $300m if only because of all the doom & gloom that happened after the China numbers dropped, lol

The first film, which did great overseas, didn't exactly blow up in China to begin with so I didn't get the panic over that. It's like panicking about Star Wars numbers in China.

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3 hours ago, cedec0 said:

How do you break a martial arts franchise?  Here is how.   You have a nobody from nowhere, who has never trained a single day in martial arts, pick up a sword for the first time and defeat one the galaxy's strongest martial artists, who has trained for decades on how use the force and the sword.  That is how you turn a martial arts franchise into a joke.  How you turn star wars into "wizards with laser swords".

Which it always has been. Calling Star Wars a martial arts franchise is absolutely hilarious. Star Wars isn't even about the training that martial arts movies always emphasise on. The guy that got the most training in this franchise is the one that became evil.

Edited by lorddemaxus
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