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Coronavirus | COVID-19 | Global Pandemic | PLEASE KEEP DISCUSSION TO THIS THREAD

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1 hour ago, dudalb said:

Sadly it is the fall of America.

The right has gone totally insane. They are rejecting science. They never much liked it because it clashes with that book of fairy tales so many beleive in.

I am afraid we are headed for domestic violence on a level unseen since the Civil War.

Time for those on the left to reconsider their pacifism, and start arming up. It is going to come that.

For mainstream Christians (at least here in Europe) science doesn't contradict the Bible, it's mostly an American thing. Also would you consider to stop calling it a "book of fairy tales" repeatedly? There might be a number of Christians on this forum who find it annoying/insulting (myself included).

Edited by misafeco
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How Sweden bungled coronavirus response (link)

Quote

But the core of the Swedish strategy lay in the 'herd immunity' approach -- that is, the thinking that it would be good for the population to gain immunity to the disease, though it is not the stated official policy that Swedes should purposely seek 'herd immunity'.

 

Today, Sweden finds itself in very big trouble.

 

As of April 9, Sweden's rate per capita of confirmed deaths from coronavirus is higher than the rate of its fellow Scandinavian countries -- or the US.

 

Hospitals are overcrowded and staff members are overworked, and the military has begun setting up field hospitals in major cities, including Stockholm.

 

The Swedish government is now seeking extraordinary powers (external link) to impose further restrictions, as the number of deaths steadily approaches 1,000 (external link).

 

The move will pave the way for new laws that could lead to nationwide lockdown.

 

Sweden's social democratic political culture is swinging to the other extreme.

 

The proposed legislation would empower the government to act even without consulting parliament.

 

The paradox is that when a notion prevails that lockdown harms the business and economy, even without a lockdown, the Swedish economy is already seeing significant effects from the coronavirus outbreak.

 

Lay-offs of workers are taking place at a level dwarfing that of the 2008 financial crisis and the economic crisis of the 1990s.

 

According to the National Institute of Economic Research, the Swedish agency that reports to the finance ministry, its baseline scenario has real GDP growth declining by 3.4 percent this year (worse than the 2.9 percent forecast for the US).

 

Clearly, there is extreme uncertainty about future developments and despite the government's light-touch approach, severe economic hardship is on cards.

 

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21 minutes ago, misafeco said:

How is it disgusting? Worldometer uses official statistics for every country.

 

Also:

 

 

It's disgusting because it misleads people into thinking 761 people died from coronavirus today in France and that's not true: only 418 did!

The UK does not report deaths in nursing homes for example, Spain is confirmed to have thousands of people who died in nursing homes and not reported in national statistics, let's not even talk about US states like Texas where a disaster is apparently underway in nursing homes.

It makes international comparison completely useless, even between European countries!

 

If you don't have a clear indication telling you WHEN someone died then don't include this person in the statistics of the current day!

Edited by Fullbuster

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3 minutes ago, Fullbuster said:

 

It's disgusting because it misleads people into thinking 761 people died from coronavirus today in France and that's not true: only 418 did!

The UK does not report deaths in nursing homes for example, Spain is confirmed to have thousands of people who died in nursing homes and not reported in national statistics, let's not even talk about US states like Texas where a disaster is apparently underway in nursing homes.

It makes international comparison completely useless, even between European countries!

 

If you don't have a clear indication telling you WHEN someone died then don't include this person in the statistics of the current day!

I agree. Only France as far I'm concerned provides the most accurate data.

 

The fact that countries do not include deaths in nursing homes (and cases btw not only deaths) in their official statistics is beyond pathetic.

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10 minutes ago, a2k said:

The Swedish government is now seeking extraordinary powers (external link) to impose further restrictions, as the number of deaths steadily approaches 1,000 (external link).

 

The move will pave the way for new laws that could lead to nationwide lockdown.

:hahaha::hahaha::hahaha:

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22 minutes ago, misafeco said:

For mainstream Christians (at least here in Europe) science doesn't contradict the Bible, it's mostly an American thing. Also would you consider to stop calling it a "book of fairy tales" repeatedly? There might be a number of Christians on this forum who find it annoying/insulting (myself included).

Except it literally is a book of fairy tales, and science irrefutably contradicts it. (Belief in said book is also completely voluntary.) Reality doesn't care about personal sensibilities.

Edited by PDC1987
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Preliminary results from the Santa Clara antibody test:

 

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.14.20062463v1.full.pdf

 

Going straight to the source as opposed to media filters that may or may not be misinterpreting data.

 

From the abstract:

 

Quote

Methods

On 4/3-4/4, 2020, we tested county residents for antibodies to SARS-CoV-2 using a lateral flow immunoassay. Participants were recruited using Facebook ads targeting a representative sample of the county by demographic and geographic characteristics. We report the prevalence of antibodies to SARSCoV-2 in a sample of 3,330 people, adjusting for zip code, sex, and race/ethnicity. We also adjust for test performance characteristics using 3 different estimates: (i) the test manufacturer’s data, (ii) a sample of 37 positive and 30 negative controls tested at Stanford, and (iii) a combination of both.

 

Results

The unadjusted prevalence of antibodies to SARS-CoV-2 in Santa Clara County was 1.5% (exact binomial 95CI 1.11-1.97%), and the population-weighted prevalence was 2.81% (95CI 2.24-3.37%). Under the three scenarios for test performance characteristics, the population prevalence of COVID-19 in Santa Clara ranged from 2.49% (95CI 1.80-3.17%) to 4.16% (2.58-5.70%). These prevalence estimates represent a range between 48,000 and 81,000 people infected in Santa Clara County by early April, 50- 85-fold more than the number of confirmed cases.

 

Conclusions

The population prevalence of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies in Santa Clara County implies that the infection is much more widespread than indicated by the number of confirmed cases. Population prevalence estimates can now be used to calibrate epidemic and mortality projections.

This is just one study that has not been peer-reviewed yet, but it's already making the rounds here in California and I suspect it'll break through into the national conversation soon enough.

 

That does seem to me to suggest good news on the lethality front at the very least.  Probably not nearly as good news on the communicability front (I am very prepared to be wrong on that however and welcome feedback on that stance). 

 

Not sure how many of those people in the study reported any symptoms at any time, as all I've read is the front page abstract and I wouldn't be able to glean much from the actual paper, I suspect.

 

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7 minutes ago, stephanos13 said:

I agree. Only France as far I'm concerned provides the most accurate data.

 

The fact that countries do not include deaths in nursing homes (and cases btw not only deaths) in their official statistics is beyond pathetic.

 

Belgium is also really good and transparent, they really include as many people as they can.

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15 minutes ago, Fullbuster said:

 

It's disgusting because it misleads people into thinking 761 people died from coronavirus today in France and that's not true: only 418 did!

The UK does not report deaths in nursing homes for example, Spain is confirmed to have thousands of people who died in nursing homes and not reported in national statistics, let's not even talk about US states like Texas where a disaster is apparently underway in nursing homes.

It makes international comparison completely useless, even between European countries!

 

If you don't have a clear indication telling you WHEN someone died then don't include this person in the statistics of the current day!

That's how all the figures work, the UK numbers for today include numbers from days or even weeks ago.

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9 minutes ago, stephanos13 said:

I agree. Only France as far I'm concerned provides the most accurate data.

 

The fact that countries do not include deaths in nursing homes (and cases btw not only deaths) in their official statistics is beyond pathetic.

They do though, UK totals come from the government ONS which are adjusted at weekends to include all deaths.

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7 minutes ago, Arendelle Legion said:

:hahaha::hahaha::hahaha:

 

I really hoped, deep down, that Sweden would succeed and show there's another way that lockdowns, that it's possible.

My brain knew it was wrong but my heart wanted to believe.

 

In the end this failed experiment will have killed way more people than necesary while hurting the economy anyway. That's unfortunate.

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Just now, AndyK said:

They do though, UK totals come from the government ONS which are adjusted at weekends to include all deaths.

 

UK doesn't include deaths in nursing homes, there's a polemic about that. It is said at least 4,000 people or more aren't part of the UK stats.

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Also what's up with the New York numbers today?

 

They started the day with 630 deaths, then I later look and they have only 395 cases and deaths went up to 1025?

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8 minutes ago, Ryan Reynolds said:

When is stay at home orders lifted for California ? I know LA county is to middle of May. 

Not any time soon.

Maybe you should consider following the news a bit more....

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7 minutes ago, Fullbuster said:

 

I really hoped, deep down, that Sweden would succeed and show there's another way that lockdowns, that it's possible.

My brain knew it was wrong but my heart wanted to believe.

 

In the end this failed experiment will have killed way more people than necesary while hurting the economy anyway. That's unfortunate.

ALways follow the science and the facts, no matter how much you want to ignore or disbeleive them.

Magical ("If I want somthing badly enough, it will happen") Thinking always makes things worse.

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6 minutes ago, stephanos13 said:

Also what's up with the New York numbers today?

 

They started the day with 630 deaths, then I later look and they have only 395 cases and deaths went up to 1025?

 

They just fixed the cases. 7,753 cases now.

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9 minutes ago, Fullbuster said:

 

UK doesn't include deaths in nursing homes, there's a polemic about that. It is said at least 4,000 people or more aren't part of the UK stats.

ONS data includes all deaths including cares homes and private home deaths.

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19englandandwales/deathsoccurringinmarch2020

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6 minutes ago, Fullbuster said:

 

Well, you Americans have been forgiven for the Great Recession...you guys have ruined the lives of so many people, not just at home but everywhere.

Why should we forgive you Americans but not the Chinese? Because you're racially superior or something? The majority of economic crises last century came from the USA, with such a logic the US would be under international sanctions to this day.

 

If you don't like unicorns then let's do this: do you want international sanctions for your misdeeds of the last 80 years? If you want to be real you'll want that.

To be fair, the US people have to option to vote against the government if they cause global economic crises and elect somebody else. In China they just say "Well #rip" and continue being controlled by the same unelected party for all of time

 

Not that America does a very good job of electing people of late...

Edited by Killimano3

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