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Coronavirus | COVID-19 | Global Pandemic | PLEASE KEEP DISCUSSION TO THIS THREAD

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1 minute ago, cdsacken said:

Lmao sure sure. Georgia businesses are gonna go even further into debt then bankrupt because of this but yeah they needed to reopen right away. Totally makes sense.

Think of Georgia giant movie/tv production business, agricultural business, mining business, Kia car making business, military jobs if it re-openned would that sector would go further in debt ?

 

Yes spending a lot on their tourist/airport related business could be a waste, one would assume that those business would not necessarily open even if they had the right to do so.

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So I'm sure folks are stating to see those viral pictures coming out of Sacto.

 

Looks like a decent amount of them were anti-vaxxers.  Which makes a fair amount of sense given how virulently anti-authority they've been becoming:

 

 

Going to see more and more of this, I think.  Especially as while various aspects of this protesting of the stay-at-home orders might really feel strongly about this, this strikes right at the core of the anti-vaxx movement.  They see what's on the horizon and they don't like it.  Not one bit.

 

Speaking just for California. add in losing battle after battle and i can see the siege mentality start to harden.  It might explain why some of them were so out of control in that vid circulating on Twitter.

 

=======

 

Now make no mistake, these folks are still the fringe minority.  Especially in California.  But I do think we should take note of the rising tenor of the anti-vaxx movement in all of this as I really doubt it's going away any time soon.

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5 hours ago, TwoMisfits said:

I'm finding it's the fall learning year planning that's killing me...and trying to make parents who have wildly divergent desires happy...and yet, also give them plans b/c they all want to know what's gonna happen now, not in August...

 

I have parents with asthmatic and allergy kids who both want no risk in an onsite class, but who are dying to ship their kids to an onsite class b/c their kids need the in person socializing...and they even told me they couldn't decide day by day what they wanted...

 

So, I split the difference...our once a month MS/HS debate club that relies on public library meeting rooms is going to stay totally online for next year (like we are now), and we picked a yearly plan that works with that...

 

Our weekly HS Lit class will be onsite b/c we meet at a private institution that charges us nothing...but I put in place illness-free standards for kids (they have to be 48 hours illness free to come) and set up a skype call in per class when we are onsite (so anyone who is sick can call in and not miss), and kept our online google we are using now for when we ourselves or our kids might be sick, (or if they won't let us start in Sept, or I think it's dumb to start in Sept)...and for Dec/Jan, we'll be online, b/c I figure when everyone goes to visit family at Thanskgiving/Xmas/Hannukah/New Years/etc, they will all get sick with something b/c of the mixing of germs, and I'm not gonna figure out with what, or have parents second-guessing me.

 

And my monthly movie club is on hiatus til our county starts deciding anything...and even then, if I hate their standards, we'll stay on hiatus for awhile.

 

The plans kept all the parents and their kids in and happy for next year...but I felt like I was walking a tightrope making them...and even then, I'm not sure I made the right ones...but really, who can be right now.

 

I don't envy colleges right now...(my oldest is taking a pre-designated all online dual enrollment class for the fall, so we don't have what happened this spring happen again...and I figure we are trying to lower our out-of-the-home commitments to keep our social circle smaller to start, so if we open in full in Sept, we'll be out for something on 3 days of the week vs the 6 days/week we were this year)...

It is an interesting dynamic. Thank you for this insightful post. We all have different situations and different risk tolerance levels.

 

I think that at some point in terms of group size it comes down to erring on the side of caution. This is why I think most colleges are going to begin next year with remote learning. It makes a lot of sense on a couple different levels. First, that's a known and proven method of college instruction. Secondly, we're talking about thousands of students at most of these institutions. 

 

If I'm being honest, I think the big push for most colleges to hold in-person classes is so they can resume their cash cow athletics programs. If those are likely to be ruled out then I don't see any resistance to remote learning. I expect basically all of the public universities in Michigan to start next fall remotely.

 

As for me and my family, our 2020 travel plans have been cancelled. It's too early for me to say if we'll be doing any travel in 2021, but if pushed I'd say it is unlikely as of now. The majority of my coworkers have also cancelled their travel plans for this year, as has much of my extended family. Based on Airbnb numbers it sure looks like the vast majority plans on staying put until they feel it is safe to resume moving around.

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12 minutes ago, Porthos said:

 

Now make no mistake, these folks are still the fringe minority.  Especially in California.  But I do think we should take note of the rising tenor of the anti-vaxx movement in all of this as I really doubt it's going away any time soon.

 

Until a disease that everyone else is vaccinated against wipes them out. I don't know if that'll be soon, though.

 

There's a very active, I'd even say militant, anti-vaxx movement in Michigan. I have a cousin that got drawn into it. Here at least it seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, 2A rights and several other fringe interest groups. There's a lot of overlap with Q, flat earth, etc.

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2 hours ago, Barnack said:

Think of Georgia giant movie/tv production business, agricultural business, mining business, Kia car making business, military jobs if it re-openned would that sector would go further in debt ?

 

Yes spending a lot on their tourist/airport related business could be a waste, one would assume that those business would not necessarily open even if they had the right to do so.

Then open areas that are necessary and can operate with little risk. Georgia just said leeroy Jenkins let's do this. And of course they failed on day 1

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The front-runner in the race for "Worst Covid Crisis Leader":

 

Quote

 

BRASILIA/RIO DE JANEIRO (Reuters) - Brazil’s President Jair Bolsonaro attacked Congress and the courts in a speech to hundreds of supporters on Sunday, underlining the former army captain’s increasing isolation as he downplays the impacts of the novel coronavirus on Latin America’s largest nation.

 

Right-wing Bolsonaro has drawn widespread criticism from across the political spectrum for dismissing the threat of the virus in Brazil, which had registered 95,559 confirmed cases and 6,750 deaths as of Saturday evening.

 

On Sunday, dozens of public figures signed an open letter to the Brazilian government calling on officials to protect the nation’s indigenous people, who often live in remote locations with limited access to healthcare.

 

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1 hour ago, Porthos said:

So I'm sure folks are stating to see those viral pictures coming out of Sacto.

 

Looks like a decent amount of them were anti-vaxxers.  Which makes a fair amount of sense given how virulently anti-authority they've been becoming:

 

 

Going to see more and more of this, I think.  Especially as while various aspects of this protesting of the stay-at-home orders might really feel strongly about this, this strikes right at the core of the anti-vaxx movement.  They see what's on the horizon and they don't like it.  Not one bit.

 

Speaking just for California. add in losing battle after battle and i can see the siege mentality start to harden.  It might explain why some of them were so out of control in that vid circulating on Twitter.

 

=======

 

Now make no mistake, these folks are still the fringe minority.  Especially in California.  But I do think we should take note of the rising tenor of the anti-vaxx movement in all of this as I really doubt it's going away any time soon.

Anti Vaxxers, Tea Party, Q, Militia and Sovereign Citizens all in the same place at the same time. All that is needed was for 9/11 truthers and Doomsday preppers to join in.

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3 hours ago, doublejack said:

It is an interesting dynamic. Thank you for this insightful post. We all have different situations and different risk tolerance levels.

 

I think that at some point in terms of group size it comes down to erring on the side of caution. This is why I think most colleges are going to begin next year with remote learning. It makes a lot of sense on a couple different levels. First, that's a known and proven method of college instruction. Secondly, we're talking about thousands of students at most of these institutions. 

 

If I'm being honest, I think the big push for most colleges to hold in-person classes is so they can resume their cash cow athletics programs. If those are likely to be ruled out then I don't see any resistance to remote learning. I expect basically all of the public universities in Michigan to start next fall remotely.

 

As for me and my family, our 2020 travel plans have been cancelled. It's too early for me to say if we'll be doing any travel in 2021, but if pushed I'd say it is unlikely as of now. The majority of my coworkers have also cancelled their travel plans for this year, as has much of my extended family. Based on Airbnb numbers it sure looks like the vast majority plans on staying put until they feel it is safe to resume moving around.

A number of University systems in the South have already said they are planning on opening on campus in the fall (though they did put some caveats on it - including it wouldn't necessarily be the same as last year). That includes the University System of Georgia. The University System of Alabama, The University System of North Carolina. A number of the Universities in Texas and Oklahoma have said the same. A number of them also said as of right now they believe they will have football season in the fall.

Frankly I think it is just too early to make any definitive statements. But they really want to have students on campus and have football. The University System of Georgia is saying just being totally online for the summer will potentially cost them $350M in revenue.

 

If we stay in a scenario where the numbers drop some in the summer - let's say to 800 deaths a day nationally. That is going to make for some really tough decisions for University Presidents. Just on the academic side the loss of all the room and board, fees, etc is a huge hole for their budgets. For the athletic associations, loss of football would flat out mean cutting the number of athletic programs and fewer student-athlete scholarships. But they are going to have to weigh that against the potential for lawsuits if students are on campus and you have a breakout and students get very sick and/or die.

 

I will say probably 75% of Southerners can't even contemplate the idea right now of not having college football this fall. They look at you if you say that like you are literally crazy.(obviously that is my anecdotal take, not based on any science.)

 

 

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3 hours ago, doublejack said:

 

Until a disease that everyone else is vaccinated against wipes them out. I don't know if that'll be soon, though.

 

There's a very active, I'd even say militant, anti-vaxx movement in Michigan. I have a cousin that got drawn into it. Here at least it seems to go hand in hand with homeschooling, 2A rights and several other fringe interest groups. There's a lot of overlap with Q, flat earth, etc.

I'm no anti-vaxxer - our son has all of his, but I understand to an extent where they come from.

Our son has Asperger's and we had to go with a slower vaccination schedule because he had negative reactions to a couple of the vaccines. 

 

The vaccination schedule works perfectly fine for 90-95% of childen. But there are 5-10% that have negative reactions to some vaccinations and you need to allow them to be on a schedule that is not a negative for them. Fortunately after some time we found some excellent doctors who helped us craft a schedule that would allow him to ultimately get all the vaccinations, but not overwhelm with too many at once so we could pay attention to if he was reacting to anything.

 

There are some doctors out there that imo are too militant about the vaccine schedule and are more concerned with that than with the children they are supposed to be taking care of.

 

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5 hours ago, Barnack said:

Think of Georgia giant movie/tv production business, agricultural business, mining business, Kia car making business, military jobs if it re-openned would that sector would go further in debt ?

 

Yes spending a lot on their tourist/airport related business could be a waste, one would assume that those business would not necessarily open even if they had the right to do so.

The governor of Georgia isn't the one who decides when movie&TV production will restart.

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10 minutes ago, MrGlass2 said:

The governor of Georgia isn't the one who decides when movie&TV production will restart.

Like I imagine anything good&service that are not made by the state or compiling by law to do.

 

We are for all of this to make it legal or not for them to operate or not.

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4 hours ago, doublejack said:

I think that at some point in terms of group size it comes down to erring on the side of caution. This is why I think most colleges are going to begin next year with remote learning. It makes a lot of sense on a couple different levels. First, that's a known and proven method of college instruction. Secondly, we're talking about thousands of students at most of these institutions. 

 

 

I heard in a podcast that it was still unproven to be as good than in person (specially for dropout %):

http://mason.gmu.edu/~sprotops/OnlineEd.pdf

 

But online class taker where always a selected and different group than the in-person one in the past, so this will be in a way the first experiment to see how it compare for people that would have otherwise not chosen that road and be really apple to apple.

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43 minutes ago, RamblinRed said:

I'm no anti-vaxxer - our son has all of his, but I understand to an extent where they come from.

Our son has Asperger's and we had to go with a slower vaccination schedule because he had negative reactions to a couple of the vaccines. 

 

The vaccination schedule works perfectly fine for 90-95% of childen. But there are 5-10% that have negative reactions to some vaccinations and you need to allow them to be on a schedule that is not a negative for them. Fortunately after some time we found some excellent doctors who helped us craft a schedule that would allow him to ultimately get all the vaccinations, but not overwhelm with too many at once so we could pay attention to if he was reacting to anything.

 

There are some doctors out there that imo are too militant about the vaccine schedule and are more concerned with that than with the children they are supposed to be taking care of.

 


Personalizing a health plan based on an individual’s needs is smart and entirely appropriate — and IMO very different from the “vaccines will poison your child and cause autism because Big Pharma wants the money” commentary from the anti-vaxxer crowd. 

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1 hour ago, MrGlass2 said:

The US Secretary of State pushing conspiracy theories, because that is easier than actually fighting the pandemic:

 

 

The messaging is terrible. How do they think China is going to be involved in any kind of broad investigation into the outbreak with comments like this? By broad investigation I don’t mean a blame game. 
 

 

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Mother's day is May 10th. Don't forget as likely this year more than ever men need to sack up. Mine is kinda dumb. My wife ever since living in England is obsessed with tea. I bought the fanciest tea subscription possible that curates a special sample of 4 types each month for a year. That way she gets exposed to several different types without having to do anything.

 

Subscriptions are awesome btw. My dad's favorite gift ever was a subscription to ultra ridiculous socks 😅

Edited by cdsacken
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9 hours ago, ElsaRoc said:

How long do people stay at home? As long as is necessary to prevent as many deaths as is possible.

 

Anyone who says the cure is worse than the disease is saying that there is some amount of death that is acceptable for their comfort.

 

For me? No deaths are acceptable. Every single one is a tragedy.

 

Tax billionaires into fucking oblivion and distribute their money to everyone else. That's how they achieve life potential.

 

 

That wont happen with either Joe Biden or Trump in office, so that is a pointless to think about. 

 

It is not that people are not comfortable....making people stay at home for 6 months to a year will have significant long term economic, social and mental consequences that need to be looked at as well and I feel many people here is discounting or ignoring.

 

As I said that there is a great inequality in lock-down measures. Some can sit at home and drink wine and watch Disney Plus, many are having their lives altered negatively for the worse. 

 

Also I will say the longer this lockdown takes place, the less effective it will be. 

 

As I said I have sense a great shift in thinking of fear of the disease to a  fear of what may be after this . 

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1 hour ago, DeeCee said:

The messaging is terrible. How do they think China is going to be involved in any kind of broad investigation into the outbreak with comments like this? By broad investigation I don’t mean a blame game. 
 

 

 

 

China has zero interest of ever being involved in any investigation of the Virus... 

 

As...

 

- It will likely make them look bad

- Western Nations will use it to blame them 

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