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3 hours ago, Lordmandeep said:

this is about the 4th or 5th time the WHO has backtracked after making a questionable declaration ? 

Maybe if you learn about WHO announcements through right-wing twitter.

13 minutes ago, elcaballero said:

I do think restrictions akin to another shutdown would be a disaster both socially and economically so soon after "reopening" in a lot of places, and am curious as to where everyone thinks we're heading in the shorter term (this summer?).

The plateau in new cases remains puzzling but as long as daily deaths continue to decline (as they have for six weeks), it is reasonable to be slightly optimistic.

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1 minute ago, MrGlass2 said:

Maybe if you learn about WHO announcements through right-wing twitter.

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/who-covid-19-asymptomatic-spread-1.5604353

WHO backtracks on claim that asymptomatic spread of COVID-19 is 'very rare'
 

 

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-who-clarification-of-their-statement-on-26-04-20-about-immunity-passports/

 

 

I am curious about others case ? It is different to change position over time (human to human, no mask for asymptomatic in crowded interior space) and the announcement correction because of miscommunication issues.

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22 minutes ago, elcaballero said:

There's now a lot of talk about transmission picking up again in the US, but I'm not familiar with the evidence for or against that claim. It seems like nationally, we are still trending down, but I guess I don't know what the picture looks like regionally. I do think restrictions akin to another shutdown would be a disaster both socially and economically so soon after "reopening" in a lot of places, and am curious as to where everyone thinks we're heading in the shorter term (this summer?).

 

In the next few weeks, I think we're heading for as rapid an open as we had for closure.  I think by July 4th, 95% of all activities in all states will be open and in use.  

 

Is this a great idea?  Opinions differ.  But, looking at Georgia, it seems like the "best of all current options."  When people don't want to stay home anymore, better to get them back to work and back to their daily lives vs continuing to force them to stew at home and then lash out in multiple different, and many times, hurtful ways...

 

And, we have rule of law in the country.  Now that the "emergency" part of covid is over, states would have to actually make laws to keep folks home and things closed.  Not one state legislature seems to want to take up this task...and if they don't, we can't just have 1 person diktat continuing into perpetuity...again, that's how we start to have folks lash out in different, and many times hurtful ways...

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10 minutes ago, Barnack said:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/who-covid-19-asymptomatic-spread-1.5604353

WHO backtracks on claim that asymptomatic spread of COVID-19 is 'very rare'

In this case, for example, she was making a more subtle point that was misunderstood by some journalists then immediately used by the Bolsonaros of the world to claim there was no need for any lockdown.

Quote

 

Same thing for the immunity announcement: it may have been poorly worded for non-specialists, but claiming they had to "backtrack" a mistake is just bad faith - often done by people who don't like the WHO because Trump and similar leaders now blame the WHO for their own incompetence.

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43 minutes ago, elcaballero said:

There's now a lot of talk about transmission picking up again in the US, but I'm not familiar with the evidence for or against that claim. It seems like nationally, we are still trending down, but I guess I don't know what the picture looks like regionally. I do think restrictions akin to another shutdown would be a disaster both socially and economically so soon after "reopening" in a lot of places, and am curious as to where everyone thinks we're heading in the shorter term (this summer?).

https://covid19-projections.com/#view-projections

there's curves and trends for each state; while the situation in past hotspots like NY or Louisiana is improving, there are other states where infections are on the rise, so there's no "overall" picture, rather a mix - and I'd guess, restrictions will be the same - lenient in some regions, strict in others.

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2 minutes ago, MrGlass2 said:

In this case, for example, she was making a more subtle point that was misunderstood by some journalists then immediately used by the Bolsonaros of the world to claim there was no need for any lockdown.

 

Tweet after the press conference is error correction we are talking about, if during the press conference asymptomatic was not defined to be different than pre-symptomatic and that was important as a distinction, that where you have your communication error.

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1 minute ago, IndustriousAngel said:

 

there's curves and trends for each state; while the situation in past hotspots like NY or Louisiana is improving, there are other states where infections are on the rise, so there's no "overall" picture, rather a mix - and I'd guess, restrictions will be the same - lenient in some regions, strict in others.

Most important for the reopening will be contact tracing (at the very least at a basic level, for local outbreaks, and hopefully better than that) and strict regulation for workplaces, shops, transport... It is hard to predict how it will look in a couple of months: it is all happening at the state level, since the federal government doesn't appear to do much in this respect (except try to grant immunity to employers and business owners, which would hurt the effort).

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6 minutes ago, MrGlass2 said:

Same thing for the immunity announcement: it may have been poorly worded for non-specialists

The annoucement you are right is just poorly worded for first paragaph readers:

https://www.who.int/news-room/commentaries/detail/immunity-passports-in-the-context-of-covid-19

 

But the tweet was quite the phrasing and was after immunity was well demonstrated for monkey, SARS, and study like those https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0819-2 where out, making the althought we expect to be the case... in the public messaging perfectly reasonable to be put there (or even question the idea of that messaging at all).

 

8 minutes ago, MrGlass2 said:

often done by people who don't like the WHO because Trump and similar leaders now blame the WHO for their own incompetence.

In the USA but almost all the world college educated healthcare are not from there, do not care for Trump and many talk the same about the WHO

 

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6 minutes ago, Barnack said:

Tweet after the press conference is error correction we are talking about, if during the press conference asymptomatic was not defined to be different than pre-symptomatic and that was important as a distinction, that where you have your communication error.

Communication "error" is very different from an actual error that the WHO would have to "walk back". It isn't the WHO's fault if some journalist writes an article immediately after a press conference with a misleading headline, or a tweet.

 

Just curious, have you read the actual report?

Quote

 the available evidence from contact tracing reported by Member States suggests that asymptomatically-infected individuals are much less likely to transmit the virus than those who develop symptoms.

...

Furthermore, among two studies which carefully investigated secondary transmission from cases to contacts, one found no secondary transmission among 91 contacts of 9 asymptomatic cases,(33) while the other reported that 6.4% of cases were attributable to pre-symptomatic transmission.(32) The available data, to date, on onward infection from cases without symptoms comes from a limited number of studies with small samples that are subject to possible recall bias and for which fomite transmission cannot be ruled out.

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, MrGlass2 said:

Communication "error" is very different from an actual error that the WHO would have to "walk back".

Communication error is what I thought the person you responded too was talking about, if we talk about walk back (mask, human to human) there would be many but that a different subject.

 

2 minutes ago, MrGlass2 said:

Communication "error" is very different from an actual error that the WHO would have to "walk back".

Not completely but that little section why I pointed out the communication error between asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic, that not something your audience can be expected to know and not that relevant considering how long pre-symptomatic the period is, it is nice when talking about how good a vaccin or a large percentage of people immune will be (i.e. they should not be carier that will be an transmission hasard in the future).

Edited by Barnack
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For the US, it is possible that this week will have the last day with 1K+ deaths.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, MrGlass2 said:

Maybe if you learn about WHO announcements through right-wing twitter.

The plateau in new cases remains puzzling but as long as daily deaths continue to decline (as they have for six weeks), it is reasonable to be slightly optimistic.

 

 

I am unsure of which bizzaro world where the CBC in Canada is right wing Twitter? 😅

 

The issue is the WHO should stop putting complex health guidance  into one liners on twitter.

 

What i am saying is the WHO does not deserve to be a scapegoat but it has done itself no favours in its conduct either.

 

 

Anyone that deals with any sort of communication dealings with the public even something like Toastmasters is taught "know your audience". It is job number 1 to ensure you say things in a manner that cant be misunderstood and identity things people may not understand. 

 

Its now the 5th time they said something and backtracked it the next day. 

Edited by Lordmandeep

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Good article from Mich with 4 infectious disease personnel rating 36 activities from high risk (10) to low risk.

Their 2 highest risk activities are bars and large music concerts. Two least risky activities - playing tennis and getting takeout food.

 

https://www.mlive.com/public-interest/2020/06/from-hair-salons-to-gyms-experts-rank-36-activities-by-coronavirus-risk-level.html

 

FWIW, large sports stadiums were rated an 8 and movie theaters a 6.

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5 hours ago, MrGlass2 said:

For the US, it is possible that this week will have the last day with 1K+ deaths.

Why do you conclude this? There may be a lull, but I see things getting much worse at some point. It is inevitable with so many things opening back up.

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1 hour ago, doublejack said:

Why do you conclude this? There may be a lull, but I see things getting much worse at some point. It is inevitable with so many things opening back up.

MrGlass could be expecting the numbers to grow. In fact, that's exactly what I would expect with the protests and with states gradually reopening things.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, RamblinRed said:

Good article from Mich with 4 infectious disease personnel rating 36 activities from high risk (10) to low risk.

Their 2 highest risk activities are bars and large music concerts. Two least risky activities - playing tennis and getting takeout food.

 

https://www.mlive.com/public-interest/2020/06/from-hair-salons-to-gyms-experts-rank-36-activities-by-coronavirus-risk-level.html

 

FWIW, large sports stadiums were rated an 8 and movie theaters a 6.

 

Eh...it's 4 people's opinions probably based on what they want to do.

 

When pools were a 7, playgrounds were a 6, and bowling was a 5, I ignored it:).  I mean, kids don't get killed by Covid...and kids are the only ones who play on playgrounds, so by definition, that should be a 1 risk (not to mention, we still have no proof kids are passing a disease that doesn't affect them - we are just guessing b/c of how they pass diseases which do affect them)...so, no one's gonna die of Covid on the playground.

 

But, I guess if you're 70+ with pre-existing conditions and need someone to rate activities that should and shouldn't get you out of the house...okay...

Edited by TwoMisfits

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Posted (edited)

I'm SO EXCITED!  I got my neighborhood pool open.  We have an open house this Saturday to get passes and photos, to sign "we won't sue you if we get sick - aka, swim at your total own risk" waivers, and to sign up for time slots so we can all social distance and keep the hourly attendance low (til we move to a further phase).  But I don't care b/c WE GOT A POOL!  I spent a month working with my county's councilman, the pool board, and my neighbors to convince them this was a good idea and how to do it to not get sued (see the waivers - this was the biggest sticking point), and it happened!  So, all the walks seeing the gorgeous pool filled but just sitting there have paid off (it was on those walks that I got some pool board members ears to discuss strategy and plans)...

Edited by TwoMisfits
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13 hours ago, Lordmandeep said:

 

WHO backtracks on claim that asymptomatic spread of COVID-19 is 'very rare'

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/who-covid-19-asymptomatic-spread-1.5604353

 

1mqgfw.jpg

 

 

The Who is its worst enemy right now.

And people gave me sanctimonious scoldings for not taking the WHO seriously. 

 

@Lordmandeep what do you think of the government of Canada maintaining their allegiance to the WHO and not their own internal health authorities?

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