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Eric Atreides

Weekend Thread (6/11-13) | Friday #s - ln the Flops 5M, Peter Floppit 2 4M

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1 hour ago, filmlover said:

 that if the movie hits a high level in theaters, it hits a high level on the service,

This sound contradictory with their business strategy now. If they agree the correlation between theater gross and home media sales, shouldn't they try to maximize box office gross before handing out to streaming?  

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With any simultaneous release, some of the people who watch at home would have gone to see it at the movies instead, if that had been the only option. Not all, but maybe half or a third. That's money that would have gone to the box office but didn't. So how can you say that streaming makes no difference to the box office?

 

Obviously, with In the Heights, it wouldn't have had some $30 million opening but for HBO Max, but how much did it siphon off? Look at the latest Conjuring movie compared to A Quiet Place 2, their 3-day opening weekends are $23m apart. Does anyone think that would be the case if Conjuring 3 had had the exclusive theatrical window? It shaved off $10m at least, probably more, as the other two movies had $40m OWs and The Nun did $53m (although franchises fall off, the box office isn't totally back, etc).

 

Anyway, that's all to say I think a simultaneous release was bad for In the Heights: musicals are a tricky genre that rely heavily on word of mouth, repeat viewers and older audiences to be leggy box office hits. All of that's gone when it's already on streaming from day one. 

 

Also, it seems like the coastal- heavy nature of ITH should have been something WB picked up on in whatever internal research a studio does before releasing a movie. Maybe put it in 1800 - 2000 theaters instead of 3400? It probably makes the same money more or less.

 

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14 hours ago, charlie Jatinder said:

Aladdin dropped 42.5% in its 3rd weekend and legged 4.9x post that. 

PoTC 5 dropped 51.5% in its 3rd weekend and legged 3.5x post that.

Speaking of Aladdin, are they any further forward on the one they announced in February 2020?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/deadline.com/2020/02/aladdin-live-action-sequel-disney-john-gatins-andrea-berloff-will-smith-mena-massoud-naomi-scott-1202858935/amp/

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15 minutes ago, cax16 said:

 

There you have it. Not so much a “all the people who wanted to see ItH did it at home for free” problem as a “nobody* wanted to see ITH to begin with” problem.
 

*Yes, obviously not literally nobody, it’s hyperbole.

Edited by Lokis Legion
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57 minutes ago, Lokis Legion said:

There you have it. Not so much a “all the people who wanted to see ItH did it at home for free” problem as a “nobody* wanted to see ITH to begin with” problem.
 

*Yes, obviously not literally nobody, it’s hyperbole.

 

I'm almost wondering if Disney's Hamilton and Crazy Rich Asians didn't somewhat affect this open...if people weren't impressed with Lin-Manuel Miranda and his acting/singing in the Hamilton movie (and lots of people in the Broadway demo saw it, looking at Disney+'s numbers and sign ups) and people weren't impressed with Jon Chu's Crazy Rich Asians, was the huge focus on those two names as much a Meh as a draw?  AKA, between advertising no part of the plot and relying on those names, did you give folks no reason to see this?

 

I admit - I fall in this camp...I didn't like Crazy Rich Asians at all and I thought Miranda was the weakest part of Hamilton by far...and when you all posted about the movie's reliance on rap songs again, I went from streaming this movie this weekend to streaming it before it leave in 4 weeks - aka, not a rush...

 

 

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3 hours ago, filmlover said:

 

Quote

The film over-indexed on both Coasts, and particularly on the East Coast, where five of the top 10 theaters on Friday came from New York City alone. It also over-indexed among Latinos, who made up 40 percent of ticket buyers.

 

‘In the Heights’ Box Office: Musical Loses to ‘A Quiet Place 2’ in Surprise Upset – The Hollywood Reporter

 

Looks like lack of crossover appeal and the audience being limited to begin with were the main downfalls here. Oh well.

 

36 minutes ago, grim22 said:

Looks like it even had streaming audiences focused in NYC

 

 

 

Really would be interested in the demographics.  I bet almost all of the over performance was with Puerto Rican Americans and not so much with Mexican Americans.  This is going to happen when you assume all Hispanics are the same with the same culture.

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5 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

I'm almost wondering if Disney's Hamilton and Crazy Rich Asians didn't somewhat affect this open...if people weren't impressed with Lin-Manuel Miranda and his acting/singing in the Hamilton movie (and lots of people in the Broadway demo saw it, looking at Disney+'s numbers and sign ups) and people weren't impressed with Jon Chu's Crazy Rich Asians, was the huge focus on those two names as much a Meh as a draw?  AKA, between advertising no part of the plot and relying on those names, did you give folks no reason to see this?

 

I admit - I fall in this camp...I didn't like Crazy Rich Asians at all and I thought Miranda was the weakest part of Hamilton by far...and when you all posted about the movie's reliance on rap songs again, I went from streaming this movie this weekend to streaming it before it leave in 4 weeks - aka, not a rush...

 

 

 

Jon Chu is no star director to attract audience just because he directed one hit and I guess that Miranda's drawing power is overrated considering that Mary Poppins didn't break out either and His Dark Materials has low viewership on HBO. So Hamiton remains his one-hit wonder (outside of Broadway). I don't think that their names made a difference. At the end of the day, concept and stars sell, and this movie had no appealing concept (people singing but what is the story?) and no stars either in front or behind the camera. 

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18 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

I'm almost wondering if Disney's Hamilton and Crazy Rich Asians didn't somewhat affect this open...if people weren't impressed with Lin-Manuel Miranda and his acting/singing in the Hamilton movie (and lots of people in the Broadway demo saw it, looking at Disney+'s numbers and sign ups) and people weren't impressed with Jon Chu's Crazy Rich Asians, was the huge focus on those two names as much a Meh as a draw?  AKA, between advertising no part of the plot and relying on those names, did you give folks no reason to see this?

 

I admit - I fall in this camp...I didn't like Crazy Rich Asians at all and I thought Miranda was the weakest part of Hamilton by far...and when you all posted about the movie's reliance on rap songs again, I went from streaming this movie this weekend to streaming it before it leave in 4 weeks - aka, not a rush...

 

 

Serious question here: how was the GA not impressed with Crazy Rich Asians when the film legged itself out to nearly 5 times its opening? Seems pretty weird people kept coming back to this film if people were largely unimpressed with it.

 

No offense, but I feel like you're using your own feelings on these movies and projecting them to represent everybody else.

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26 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

I'm almost wondering if Disney's Hamilton and Crazy Rich Asians didn't somewhat affect this open...if people weren't impressed with Lin-Manuel Miranda and his acting/singing in the Hamilton movie (and lots of people in the Broadway demo saw it, looking at Disney+'s numbers and sign ups) and people weren't impressed with Jon Chu's Crazy Rich Asians, was the huge focus on those two names as much a Meh as a draw?  AKA, between advertising no part of the plot and relying on those names, did you give folks no reason to see this?

 

I admit - I fall in this camp...I didn't like Crazy Rich Asians at all and I thought Miranda was the weakest part of Hamilton by far...and when you all posted about the movie's reliance on rap songs again, I went from streaming this movie this weekend to streaming it before it leave in 4 weeks - aka, not a rush...

 

 

But both Hamilton and CRA were very well received overall by general audiences.

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27 minutes ago, Eric is Full of Pride said:

Serious question here: how was the GA not impressed with Crazy Rich Asians when the film legged itself out to nearly 5 times its opening? Seems pretty weird people kept coming back to this film if people were largely unimpressed with it.

 

No offense, but I feel like you're using your own feelings on these movies and projecting them to represent everybody else.

 

But are people impressed when they rewatched it or when they think back on it?  Watch it again yourself.  I didn't watch it the year it came out...I watched it two years later, so I came in clear and not affected by buzz.  I thought it'd be good...and it's not.  Like really not.  

 

No doubt it made money that summer - but that doesn't mean it gets remembered wildly positively...

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10 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

But are people impressed when they rewatched it or when they think back on it?  Watch it again yourself.  I didn't watch it the year it came out...I watched it two years later, so I came in clear and not affected by buzz.  I thought it'd be good...and it's not.  Like really not.  

 

No doubt it made money that summer - but that doesn't mean it gets remembered wildly positively...

 

Sure? I see it on occasion on TV and it's a perfectly pleasant and enjoyable film. Every movie gets some kind of honeymoon period but I don't think it was some straight bamboozle either that shammed the audience into liking it. The movie is not really controversial enough in any way to elicit that kind of whiplash.

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My main takeaway is that the film is the classic niche product. It has very deep support among a very narrow audience. 

It looks like WB tried to expand the support outside its natural niche and was just unable to do so.

 

It also appears to have an issue for any musical looking to succeed. I don't hear any music from it breaking out anywhere. Hamilton, Greatest Showman, etc, had songs that were all over the place. I haven't heard a single song from the musical outside of watching ITH this weekend on Max. 

 

It was also likely overhyped within its bubble. It's basic core group is musical theater fans, Domincan Repuclic natives and some of the intelligista on the NE and West Coasts. Outside of that it just doesn't appear to be attracting large groups from anywhere else.

 

Maybe it also suffers from being a short term musical as well. This only ran on Broadway for a couple of years. Not like it had been around for many years growing a fanbase. 

 

The only other observation I can give in my anecdotal family observation. Three of us watched it this weekend. My wife and I both liked it. My son, who usually likes musical films, didn't have a strong positive reaction to it. It just didn't seem to hold his interest. 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, TwoMisfits said:

 

But are people impressed when they rewatched it or when they think back on it?  Watch it again yourself.  I didn't watch it the year it came out...I watched it two years later, so I came in clear and not affected by buzz.  I thought it'd be good...and it's not.  Like really not.  

 

No doubt it made money that summer - but that doesn't mean it gets remembered wildly positively...

I did see it again. I watched it two years ago and I still liked it just as much as I did the first time. Maybe it turns out my opinion will change when I watch it again, but I feel confident in my own interests and tastes that I will still enjoy the movie.

 

And sure, I won't speak for everybody. But the idea that everybody else in the world is like me, where they enjoyed the movie on its first watch, and then suddenly did not like it on a second watch...well, I'm sure that was some people's reactions, but I doubt it was enough people to negatively impact this film.

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54 minutes ago, Valonqar said:

 

Jon Chu is no star director to attract audience just because he directed one hit and I guess that Miranda's drawing power is overrated considering that Mary Poppins didn't break out either and His Dark Materials has low viewership on HBO. So Hamiton remains his one-hit wonder (outside of Broadway). I don't think that their names made a difference. At the end of the day, concept and stars sell, and this movie had no appealing concept (people singing but what is the story?) and no stars either in front or behind the camera. 

 

Lin-Manuel Miranda wrote several songs on the Moana soundtrack and that movie is incredibly popular on streaming, so that's something, but yeah. I mean, he wasn't the star of Mary Poppins Returns and it didn't flop, but the expectations were probably never realistic.

 

Even if you can't tell what ITH is about from the ads, they do make it pretty clear LMM isn't the lead. People who liked him in Hamilton aren't going to flock to theaters now just because he has a minor role of a totally different project about an entirely different subject.

 

Crazy Rich Asians wasn't a musical but it had its fair share of colorful spectacle, so I understand linking to another Jon Chu movie. But ultimately, CRA is a rom-com where the ordinary girl learns her boyfriend is rich and struggles to fit into his world/win over his mother. It's a much easier sell than a musical about rising property values and societal pressures faced by immigrants and the next generation. In the Heights has romantic plots, but it's not the primary focus of the story. So I get WB advertising the hell out of the "experience" and connections to other popular stuff, because the things it's about don't easily sway people to attend movies.

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I just watched ITH and it's a great movie, i'm latino so you know, it hit different for me. But after seeing the movie i kinda understand the lack of interest.

 

The movie is very niched, it seems like made focusing only on our community, it talks about very specific problems, very specific situations that maybe isn't appealing for someone who is not familiar or not interested in the latino community.

 

And also this movie doesn't have one very important thing that Crazy Rich Asians have for example, which is a sense of mistery, discovery.

 

Watching CRA i feel like the movie enter in a different world that make lots of people interested in discovering it because they presented it in this mysterious way. Watching ITH i feel the movie only goes deeper in subjetcs that lots of people kinda already know and make way more sense for us.

 

It's very sad tho seeing this flopping because it is truly a wonderful movie and well done in every way. But it is what it is, results at HBO Max shows that people doesn't want to see it even for free at home, much less in a theater. Now i hope it find some impressive stability considering it's quality.

 

 

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