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CJohn

Star Trek 2 OS thread

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Probably the biggest disappointment of the year. Latin America and most of Europe let this movie down big time. Still a lot of work to do to get Star Trek to finally be a big player overseas

 

I think the disappointment really is its domestic side of things.  The upper range I had for Overseas was 265 (roughly 100% increase, which I can't really find examples of the first sequel showing such dramatic percentage growth overseas over the initial film, with the exception of some comedies and the Dark Knight).

 

Even if Domestically Trek hit 300 million, the ratio it would have with Overseas would be one of the franchises best.

Edited by Newbie
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ST in 2009 had 125M~, 

3, 5, 10, 20 years ago it doesn't matter, ST has never been popular overseas. It has a stigma. Comparing it to another franchise and going lol only $230M does not do it justice. It is is not very good Boxoffice Analysis in my opinion. 

Seriously people were using Superhero films as a comparison (as they also had lower then typical ratio of domestic to overseas growth when SH films started up again.  But since Spider Man and X-Men how many Super Hero films have been released to help get the overseas audience to be more excepting of them (a lot).  

 

The one positive for Trek was that previously Trek had only done well (for a moderately budgeted film in english speaking countries), this year that expanded to many of the asian markets and I was quite surprised by this.

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It isn't just in comparison to other films, it's also in comparison to expectations, here's the WW predictions for STiD in the summer game:

 

Neo - $815M

iTz ED - $752M

JackO - $750M

TylerDurden365 - $730M

druv10 - $720M

Jake Gittes - $713M

24Lost - $711M

c00k13 - $700M

Simionski - $700M

acsc1312 - $680M

DAR - $675M

Schumacher FTW - $670M

Filmovie - $664M

iceroll - $650M

Punishment - $650M

Iron Olive - $650M

Fake - $650M

Gizmo - $650M

Sam - $630M

Cmasterclay - $630M

Glassfairy - $630M

Michael G Scott - $625M

The Stingray - $625M

Blankments Into Darkness - $625M

RichWS - $615M

Newbie - $613M

CEDAR - $605M

IronMan89 - $605M

Kayumanggi - $600M

Vanilla - $600M

Chasmmi - $600M

Kitik - $600M

ShawnMR - $600M

grim22 - $585M

baumer - $584M

Telemachos - $582M

narniadis - $575M

Jay Salahi - $571M

Dexter of Suburbia - $570M

TLK - $570M

CJohn - $560M

Mattrek - $550M

Goffe - $548M

Tower - $521M

junkshop38 - $515M

ChFloppit - $485M

laguy03 - $485M

 

This is making less than all of those.

 

Franchises can change how the market sees them if you make them look more blockbustery. The first three films in the Fast franchise made less than 110M OS (worse than ST 09), but it turned into a blockbuster anyway and this year made 550M.

Yeah and how many sequels did it take for Fast and the furious to became a major player overseas, was it the 2nd one?

 

Lets look at that franchise, and its overseas performance.

1.  Fast and the Furious 62.7 million 30% of revenue

2.  2 Fast 2 Furious 109.2 million overseas 46.2% of its revenue

3.  The Fast and the Furious Tokyo Drift 95.9 million overseas 65% of its revenue

4.  Fast and Furious 208.1 million overseas 57.3 of its revenue

5.  Fast Five 416.3 million overseas 66.5% of revenue

6.  Fast and Furious 6 550 million 69.7 % of revenue

 

It took 4 sequels for it to explode overseas.

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Yeah and how many sequels did it take for Fast and the furious to became a major player overseas, was it the 2nd one?

 

Lets look at that franchise, and its overseas performance.

1.  Fast and the Furious 62.7 million 30% of revenue

2.  2 Fast 2 Furious 109.2 million overseas 46.2% of its revenue

3.  The Fast and the Furious Tokyo Drift 95.9 million overseas 65% of its revenue

4.  Fast and Furious 208.1 million overseas 57.3 of its revenue

5.  Fast Five 416.3 million overseas 66.5% of revenue

6.  Fast and Furious 6 550 million 69.7 % of revenue

 

It took 4 sequels for it to explode overseas.

 

 

 

no, you are forgetting all of the previous Trek movies

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No I didn't the poster was talking about Modern times and was dismissing the performance of the previous films as having no bearing on the modern film's performance (or who we the poster of the board should expect the films to perform).

 

Sure lets sue the TOS films, to show its Overseas use, and that makes its growth, even stronger, though of course inflation will increase these numbers but even with inflation all but one is below and significantly below even Trek 09.

 

1.  Motion Picture (most expensive Movie to date Production Budget)  56.7 million (139 million WW)

2.  Wrath of Khan 16.9 million (96.8 million WW)

3. Search for Spock 10.5 million (87 million WW)

4.  The Voyage Home 23.2 million (133 million WW)

5.  The Final Frontier (God what a terrible film) 18.0 million (70.2 million WW)

6.  The Undiscovered Country 22.0 million (96.9 million WW)

 

Adjusted even Trek 09 did better then all previous Overseas numbers except The Motion Less Picture, which was pushed as the next Star Wars, and seriously killed Trek WW)

 

Heck even if you use the TNG films it paints a very attractive growth rate for the reboot/ sequel/ prequel of Trek (all three are technically correct descriptions of these films, which in and of itself is slightly abnormal).

 

TNG

1.  Generations 42.4 million (118.1 million WW) 35.9%

2.  First Contact 54.0 million (146.0 million WW) 37%

3.  Insurrection 42.4 million (112.6 million WW) 37.7%

4.  Nemesis 24.1 million (67.3 million WW) 35.7%

 

TNG averaged a higher percentage WW then TOS films did, So I reasonable expected this film to mirror closer to TOS, then TNG.385.7 million WW) 33.2%

 

Trek 2009 128.0 million (385.7 million WW) 33.2% - Which did due percentage wise less business overseas.  And that was with early screenings, overseas, opening overseas first, having early critic and fan viewings in several cities WW, of about 14 of the film all designed to help build interest).

 

And finally, even with a four year break a serious increase.

 

STID 238.6 million (467.4 million WW) 51%

 

Trek has one of the worst stigma's of adventure/action and its been that was for 30 plus years of film going.  Now if they can expand to another Area , and still keep english speaking countries and the gains in Asia, I can see another possible chance for significant growth, but I still would not expect 400 or more overseas (at least not at this stage).

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Newbie, If you read what I wrote at the time you will see that I never thought it was a terrible performance, merely mediocre. I was arguing with people who suddenly after the film came out thought this was somehow a great performance even though everyone was predicting more before it came out. You yourself thought it was going to make a lot more then it did, so you should be somewhat disappointed yourself

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No I didn't the poster was talking about Modern times and was dismissing the performance of the previous films as having no bearing on the modern film's performance (or who we the poster of the board should expect the films to perform).

 

Sure lets sue the TOS films, to show its Overseas use, and that makes its growth, even stronger, though of course inflation will increase these numbers but even with inflation all but one is below and significantly below even Trek 09.

 

1.  Motion Picture (most expensive Movie to date Production Budget)  56.7 million (139 million WW)

2.  Wrath of Khan 16.9 million (96.8 million WW)

3. Search for Spock 10.5 million (87 million WW)

4.  The Voyage Home 23.2 million (133 million WW)

5.  The Final Frontier (God what a terrible film) 18.0 million (70.2 million WW)

6.  The Undiscovered Country 22.0 million (96.9 million WW)

 

Adjusted even Trek 09 did better then all previous Overseas numbers except The Motion Less Picture, which was pushed as the next Star Wars, and seriously killed Trek WW)

 

Heck even if you use the TNG films it paints a very attractive growth rate for the reboot/ sequel/ prequel of Trek (all three are technically correct descriptions of these films, which in and of itself is slightly abnormal).

 

TNG

1.  Generations 42.4 million (118.1 million WW) 35.9%

2.  First Contact 54.0 million (146.0 million WW) 37%

3.  Insurrection 42.4 million (112.6 million WW) 37.7%

4.  Nemesis 24.1 million (67.3 million WW) 35.7%

 

TNG averaged a higher percentage WW then TOS films did, So I reasonable expected this film to mirror closer to TOS, then TNG.385.7 million WW) 33.2%

 

Trek 2009 128.0 million (385.7 million WW) 33.2% - Which did due percentage wise less business overseas.  And that was with early screenings, overseas, opening overseas first, having early critic and fan viewings in several cities WW, of about 14 of the film all designed to help build interest).

 

And finally, even with a four year break a serious increase.

 

STID 238.6 million (467.4 million WW) 51%

 

Trek has one of the worst stigma's of adventure/action and its been that was for 30 plus years of film going.  Now if they can expand to another Area , and still keep english speaking countries and the gains in Asia, I can see another possible chance for significant growth, but I still would not expect 400 or more overseas (at least not at this stage).

Lol big mistake. This is 2013/2014, when most Hollywood blockbusters OS double domestic. Not 1980s when most Hollywood blockbusters DOM totally overshadow or double OS. ST09/STID performed like it was in the 1990s international marketplace. That's why its a BIG disappointment.

Edited by firedeep
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Lol big mistake. This is 2013/2014, when most Hollywood blockbusters OS double domestic. Not 1980s when most Hollywood blockbusters DOM totally overshadow or double OS. ST09/STID performed like it was in the 1990s international marketplace. That's why its a BIG disappointment.

 

Star Trek 2009 only made 128 million worldwide and that was 2009.

 

Only delusional trekkies expected this to make a huge amount overseas.

 

Face it, Star Trek is a very U.S. centric franchise. The fact that this one actually increased, shows signs that it may be becoming more popular in other countries.

 

It's not really a disappointment, unless your talking about domestic (which is a whole other story).

Edited by Fancyarcher
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Nah STID was a big disappointment on every level, dom/os/quality/entertainment.

 

 

The fact that this one actually increased, shows signs that it may be becoming more popular in other countries.

Lol. Since when this is a big achivement. Why so low standard. Basically every sequel increases these days, let alone one from a well received one.

Edited by firedeep
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Nah STID was a big disappointment on every level, dom/os/quality/entertainment.

Lol. Since when this is a big achivement. Why so low standard. Basically every sequel increases these days, let alone one from a well received one.

 

The Star Trek franchise has never been popular overseas, never.

 

When Star Trek V did poorly in the U.S., they even sent it straight to video in most foreign countries.

 

I don't see how it could be considered a disappointment, unless the studio really expected the franchise to somehow increase magnificently all of the sudden. It did actually increase considerably, but it only did as well as it could, considering its a trek film.

 

And entertainment quality is certainly up for debate.

Edited by Fancyarcher
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As much as Viacom wants it to be differently, Star Trek is a TV property first and foremost. And as a TV property it is very popular world wide.

 

Not really. It's a U.S. thing first and foremost.

 

Also most of the Star Trek movies have been successful.

Edited by Fancyarcher
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