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Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker | 20 DEC 2019 | JJ Abrams to direct | Teaser Page 172

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18 minutes ago, Valonqar said:

I still fail to see what TLJ retconned that TFA should re-retcon. And everything that was said in both official interviews and from reliable sources points at no retconning in TROS but building on what TLJ established. 

I agree, I don't see any particular retcons in TLJ, much less any plans to "re-retcon" anything now.

 

 

Someone above criticised Kennedy for "allowing Johnson to throw out the plot for TLJ". I have no idea where that is coming from, because it couldn't be any further from the truth. There was no specific plan for Episode VIII. There is a reason why Abrams left a lot of stuff rather vague in TFA, to allow the next movie to take it anywhere its director wants to go. He might have had some ideas where he would have gone with it if the next movie was his, but there never was any plan that got ignored in favour of what Johnson came up with.

 

As multiple people involved with the production of the trilogy have confirmed by now, there was a rather unspecific plan for the trilogy as a whole. So claims that they just made things up as they went aren't entirely true either. They knew where the characters would start, and they knew where they would end. What they left open was how they got there. This allowed for creative freedom for the individual episodes. This isn't really all that different from what Lucas was doing. If you look at all the source material for the prequels, he knew how they would end, but the story of each movie still only was developed right when it came up.

 

If Lucas had pre-planned the entire OT, we never would have gotten the biggest movie twist of all time. Heck, that's a point where Lucas actually had to retcon stuff, creating the "from a certain point of view" argument, to prevent Obi Wan from looking like a complete liar. Sometimes you get even better ideas when you are right in the midst of it, than if you just planned everything in advance. Because with the latter, you can't really react to spontaneous ideas or interesting developments that you couldn't anticipate beforehand.

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49 minutes ago, Valonqar said:

I still fail to see what TLJ retconned that TFA should re-retcon. And everything that was said in both official interviews and from reliable sources points at no retconning in TROS but building on what TLJ established. 

 

JJ Abrams said there will be "more to the story"

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6 hours ago, Cheebs86 said:

A spin-off results = the mainline franchise is a sinking ship? That is like saying Ant Man and the Wasp doing less than Infinity War means Endgame was going to fall.

 

 

Name me a Star Wars trilogy that was planned out in advance...it doesn't exist. That is not how Star Wars movies have ever been made. Star Wars is not Marvel nor should it be copying Marvel.

Solo didn't just make less. It flat out bombed. It was an embarrassing performance in every way. It also gives trouble for future non saga movies since now you don't know how it will perform overseas and since these movies aren't cheap, they need an overseas buffer

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Just now, John Marston said:

 

JJ Abrams said there will be "more to the story"

there's always more to the story. it's the whole movie worth of story. that doesn't mean retcon. he said he'd honor what's in TLJ. you can honor what's in there and build on it. which is what they are doing. he also said one element from TLJ (that fans liked a lot) is coming back bigger, deeper and stronger than ever. so that also sounds like continuation, not retconning.

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Fantastic hire. She comes from Bad Robot and will be in charge of all future live action film and tv content.

 

The alt-right fans will of course have YouTube rants because she is a woman. 

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Cheebs86 said:

Fantastic hire. She comes from Bad Robot and will be in charge of all future live action film and tv content.

 

The alt-right fans will of course have YouTube rants because she is a woman. 

 

 

So she's taking over the live action parts of Kiri Hart's former position.  I wonder if she's taking over the Story Group as well or if they're completely breaking apart the duties that Hart had into 3 separate positions?

Edited by Horner

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9 minutes ago, Cheebs86 said:

Fantastic hire. She comes from Bad Robot and will be in charge of all future live action film and tv content.

 

The alt-right fans will of course have YouTube rants because she is a woman. 

I don't know who she is, but hopefully she does a better job than KK, and not let 80% of a feature complete filming before determining there is a major problem.

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I'd venture a guess that pulling the trigger on a change of director(s) after production has started will still fall to Kennedy and whoever her successor as the head of the studio ends up being.

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11 minutes ago, Ryan Reynolds said:

I don't know who she is, but hopefully she does a better job than KK, and not let 80% of a feature complete filming before determining there is a major problem.

well, she's working under KK so that means better job than whoever held the position previously. she's not replacing KK. 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/16/2019 at 12:34 PM, Cheebs86 said:

Want proof Star Wars isn’t dead? The fact we still talk about TLJ two years later.

 

Want to know when a franchise is losing interest? When people don’t even care to talk about it anymore. 

 

Also  I remember when Star Wars was dead in 1997 because Lucas ruined Han by making Greedo shoot first. I remember when Star Wars was dead in 1999 because of Jar Jar and midichlorians. I remember when it was dead in 2002 because of a terrible romantic plot and Hayden Christensen’s acting. I remember when it was dead in 2005 because Vader screamed “Noooooo!” and ruined his character. I remember when it was dead in 2015 because TFA was a ANH ripoff and Rey was a “Mary Sue”......

 

I have heard this same story for over 20 years, the TLJ version of anger/predicting doom isn’t any more compelling. 

Thank you. I've been trying to explain this. Star Wars was viewed as basically DEAD AND BURIED after Attack of the Clones got owned by LOTR:TTT and Spider-Man at the box office.  What happened? It rebounded. Even when it rebounded with Revenge of the Sith, the result was the prequels were subpar. Before TFA's came out, even tho everyone knew that it was the REAL sequel everyone wanted to see (The Sequel to ROTJ) there were people saying it wouldn't sniff Jurassic World. It became the highest grossing movie ever domestically. Not even Endgame is sniffing that beast domestically which is insane. Solo "Flopped" but the cartoon clones movie that had ties to the main movies "Flopped" too. No one wanted to see a younger Solo movie. lol. People want Boba Fett or Kenobi, or other movies from the extended universe (the books made years ago). 

 

Regardless of what The Last Skywalker movie does, If they make a Knights of the old Republic movie/trilogy and it has good to great buzz, don't be surprised if they explode, because those are stories that the fanbase actually wants to see.

 

Star Wars is far from "dead." It's not marvel right now (no one is) but people declaring it "dead" need to pump the breaks.

Edited by jaybox
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1 hour ago, Cheebs86 said:

YouTube rants because she is a woman. 

 

I didn't see any youtube rants about Victoria Alonso in the many years she's served as a producer for the MCU. What gives?

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2 hours ago, John Marston said:

Solo didn't just make less. It flat out bombed. It was an embarrassing performance in every way. It also gives trouble for future non saga movies since now you don't know how it will perform overseas and since these movies aren't cheap, they need an overseas buffer

We can argue till the cows come home about "Solo"'s merits as a film (I though it was just OK) but it's performance at the box office is not a question of debate. It was an expensive flop that cost Disney a lot of money. To deny that is to deny reality...something which, sadly a lot of fans..and not just SW fans..all too often do.

if you liked Solo as a movie, fine, but don't try to tell me it was not a disaster for Disney from a business point of view.

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2 hours ago, Horner said:

I'd venture a guess that pulling the trigger on a change of director(s) after production has started will still fall to Kennedy and whoever her successor as the head of the studio ends up being.

What makes this interesting is that  Rejwan is moving from a key position at JJ Abrams Bad Robot productions, and apparently Warners won the bidding war between Disney,Universal and Warners to partner with Bad Robot, so The Mouse decided to do a little talent raiding...grabbing talent from the competition is an old Hollywood custom.

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1 hour ago, LaughingEvans said:

 

I didn't see any youtube rants about Victoria Alonso in the many years she's served as a producer for the MCU. What gives?

I guess any  criticism of Kennedy is automatically sexist.

Sorry, but KK has made some serious mistakes at Lucasfilms,and she deserved to be criticized for them .

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1 minute ago, dudalb said:

I guess any  criticism of Kennedy is automatically sexist.

You guess wrong then.

 

And few people on this thread, if anyone, has even suggested such a thing.

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, dudalb said:

I guess any  criticism of Kennedy is automatically sexist.

Sorry, but KK has made some serious mistakes at Lucasfilms,and she deserved to be criticized for them .

There is sexist attacks thrown at KK purely because she is a woman (see Geeks and Gamers). But I don’t see any of it in this thread. There are reasons to like and dislike her outside of that, but there are some awful YouTube channels out there. Not here.

Edited by Cheebs86

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Posted (edited)

Got to admit, I am getting slightly tired of folks conflating:

 

Attacking Kathleen Kennedy's performance online.

 

with

 

Criticizing aspects of Kathleen Kennedy's performance online.

 

Strangely enough, attack and criticize aren't synonyms. 

 

Folks on all sides* of this issue could do well to remember that.

 

* Not so much on this thread, but I have in fact seen people on the 'pro-KK' side online conflate "criticize (aspects of)" with "attacks" and they need to knock it off as well

Edited by Porthos
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, LaughingEvans said:

 

I didn't see any youtube rants about Victoria Alonso in the many years she's served as a producer for the MCU. What gives?

 

I think a lot of that has to do with Kevin Feige being very out in front on point for Marvel.  Kennedy is his counterpart over at Lucasfilm so she draws fire in the way he draws praise, given the current situation with the two fanbases (using "current" loosely with SW here, elements of their fans have been in various states of agitation for nearly two decades now).

 

Alonso did ruffle some feathers with the rant brigade recently in an AMA on reddit where she mentioned the X-Men name being a little problematic, in the wake of JL's line in DarkP.  The YT cottage industry hasn't quite taken off on that one yet though.

Edited by Horner

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