Harpospoke

Could we get a ranking from you of the posters ranking stuff?

JL had everything. Except one vital missing ingredient. Thor added some green to the proceedings and brought in the green.

Winning 10m in the lottery is awesome. But not really so awesome if you bought 15m worth of lottery tickets to do it.

It is kinda hard to believe. Like 3 days ago anything under 130 was hard to believe.

I thought that was a mistake, but John Wayne has made the list every single year. Like...he's the only name to never miss a single year. Wow....dude has been dead since the 70s. That's star power.

I liked it but wish they had used this version: Feels like the opposite to me. It's like there are fans of the MOVIE WW...but not the character WW. Like...I'm a fan of various characters. I'll go see any Spider-Man movie. Doesn't matter what the reviews are. Doesn't matter if I don't like the trailers. I'll see it at least once and then not go again if I don't like it. I'll also see any movie with Superman in it. Reviews won't stop me. Trailers won't stop me. Where are those WW fans for JL? If they are "only fans of WW the way she is in the WW movie" then that makes them a fan of that movie...not the character. The WW movie made me a bigger fan of WW than I ever was before so I'll probably watch any movie she is in now. ...And I'm just a minor fan of her compared to other characters. Where are the really passionate fans of WW I've heard about? It looks like none of them showed up for JL. Made me think of this:

Same here. I thought there must be some kind of director's cut where they made up at the end. There will be big tension between them when they meet again. Not exactly "made up" since they haven't been in the same room yet.

Thanks for all that. I get that the ratio of female to male has fallen a lot. But what I still don't get is that it looks like not a single WW fan who isn't also a fan of the DCU in general showed up for JL. I can buy, "not as many WW fans would be into JL" and "very few WW fans would be into JL"... But ZERO WW fans? Wouldn't at least some of them be mildly curious to see WW again? If some WW fans did show up....that's some scary OW numbers for JL. Where would it be without that?

That just makes me think of two other movies that had troubled production and people in the industry snickering before release. Titanic and Gone with the Wind. (GWTW also had multiple directors)

I noticed that quite a few times too and it bugged me. And I'm no SJW believe me. I could see the female audience being turned off by all the upskirt stuff. It must not matter at all if this opens where some are predicting. Like...not at all. I would expect a movie that is following bad WoM like BvS to open higher than 120m WITHOUT WW in the mix. Also calls into question other movies where adding a character was supposed be a box office boost like Iron Man in SM:H and various characters in Captain America Civil War. It is probably more about the audience being interested in the MOVIE...not the characters. Every movie has a bunch of different characters. I think we look at CBMs as if each one has a separate fan base that never overlap. (The Avengers probably caused that)

I don't get how it could open under WW. First....what person who went to see WW on OW would skip this one? So it should at least get 103m. That's just the WW fans from its OW. Now...didn't WW have great legs and great WoM? Where are all those people? Or was it just the same people going to see WW over and over? That's not even counting Batman fans. Superman fans (come on...everyone knew he was in it). Flash fans from the TV show? Game of Thrones fans of Momoa? (I went with one of those tonight) Doesn't make sense. I'm predicting JL blows away these low predictions. If I'm right I'm going to brag forever. If I'm wrong let's just pretend I never said anything. Anyway. It felt like a crowd pleaser to me tonight. Laughs in all the right places. "Exhilaration" all over the place. I'm thinking good WoM for the weekend. Theater was about 60-70% full for the 8:00pm show. Seems similar to Thor 3.

I feel like mocking DC fans is like kicking a puppy at this point. They got just 5 months to enjoy a good movie before another critical dud showed up to ruin the party. ....Immediately after another Marvel critical rave. And then there are bad vibes about the box office too with fears of a JL movie making less than a Thor movie. Add in director turmoil with both Snyder and Whedon (one is gone?...the other being attacked for sexism with WW) and Affleck rumored to be gone as well. Jokes about CGI mustache removal everywhere. Time to remind DC fans that it just takes one movie to bounce back. Just saw it twice this year with WW and SM:H. Both followed bad entries in the franchises and both got fans excited again.

Well 2 thngs: 1-Like I said...whether it's true or not...the statement about WB generated zero interest from the panel. No one seemed a bit concerned about "scary monopolies" if it was WB controlling 80% of all media. Only the Disney word got them concerned. So there is an anti-Disney element to this thing. 2-Making more money doesn't mean you control more media, does it? You can control more things and still make less money if things don't go well.

I love how they start off with "we at The Ringer set out to develop a ranking that goes beyond personal opinions"...and then they immediately reveal that 2 of the metrics they used were personal opinions. lol..."lists"...always prove you can't measure art. They put my #1 CBMs at #47, #48, #41, #36, #17 so that list isn't working for me. (I like how even the author had a problem with #48) Dredd at #60? Mystery Men not even in the top 90? Oh I'm throwing stuff. I don't hate him at all. He made one of my #1 CBMs of all time so he gets a lifetime pass from me. I also love Superman and hate what he did with him...but...lifetime pass. I don't know about that, but I did hear this the other day and it illustrated how the "Disney" word gets people more fired up than the "Warner Brothers" words. Listen to what Jon Schnepp says starting about 4:50. He actually mentions that WB owned a ridiculous percentage of all media (80%) and no one on the entire panel blinked or bothered to comment on it (whether it's true or not...not a single comment). They were much more concerned about Disney and couldn't be bothered to worry about WB. That was amazing to watch.

Ugh...tell me you're kidding.

If that's true, then NZ must be a great place. Because news shows are only interested in bad news. They routinely ignore all good news. So if they can't manage to dredge up enough bad news to sustain a news network, that's impressive.

Maybe not. Hems was JACKED in Thor 3. That's where I would advocate "rest the characters". X-men and Spidey need a rest. A nice 7-10 year break would do wonders for them. Unfortunately Spidey isn't going to get one.

That's a great way for activists to lose all credibility. Either you are for equality between the sexes or you are not. Choose one. You can't support something you formally claimed is bad with some kind of "revenge" exception. Just how long will it be "ok"? How long will this revenge period last before you finally start advocating equality?

They can use the X men under the Disney label for movies like....the Fox X men movies (except better made). And then use the Fox banner if they need/want to make something like DP or Logan. It's not like Fox has those two movies as a part of their X men universe either. They are completely separate entities. The GA goes to see both and doesn't care. No reason why Disney couldn't do the same thing like they've done in the past with R rated movies. It's not like Fox is on the same level as Marvel at the box office so having the Fox division making smaller budget Marvel movies aimed at a smaller audience is the logical way to go. Being under the Fox banner would not prevent MCU elements from being present if needed. (Like Hulk and Wolverine) They still would fly the Marvel banner at the beginning of the movie. But really the best part would be the ability to not have X men movies. Fox and Sony are stuck in that situation where they have to make Marvel movies no matter what. Just look at all the Spidey and X men movies that have been forced out over the past decade and a half. Marvel having the option to put the characters away on occasion as needed would be huge. The X men movies from Fox just keep coming off the assembly line whether or not there is an audience for them. Far different from how it normally works at a studio. What normal studio would even consider making another FF movie at this point? It would be the most illogical thing possible...and Fox is doing that. They are actually considering another film in a franchise that has epic failed several times and has lost most of the audience. What studio would even consider it other than Fox? The recasting and rebooting of Spidey is the best example of how Marvel would improve the X men. Imagine the Marvel casting talent going to work on the X men characters. We would probably even get the real Rogue for the first time too with her great backstory instead of that pathetic "Rogue" in the Fox movies. Storm being up front and center finally would be another great improvement along with a real Cyclops. OH yeah...I forgot all about the Netflix shows. The R rated thing is much ado about nothing.

Deadpool and Logan were a different thing and would be the perfect candidates for the "Fox division". The normal X-movies would work just fine as Disney films. It's not like they were cursing and having sex scenes in the X-movies. (that's "safe" when Disney does it) Again...Disney has released R rated movies before that that complaint is a non issue. Go ahead and ask a random person if they know the name of the studio shown at the beginning of the movies. No one is going to care or notice if Deadpool 5 is released under the Fox banner of Disney. That "Disney formula"...is that Winter Soldier or Thor 3? Because those aren't the same. Obviously Disney lets Marvel do what they want just like how they let Pixar do what they want. And that "tone" thing...is that X3 or Deadpool? I notice the "lighter tone" isn't a problem when Fox does it.....it's actually one of their movies that didn't epic fail and the most people liked. And a "what if" thing with what "might happen" with Marvel making X-men movies is speculation. What Fox does with them is known fact. They are the least successful of the big 4 making CBMs.

Not a bad point in the first paragraph. They could only make so many movies so Ant-Man, Dr Strange, and even Cap may have been pushed further down the line. ...Although Marvel would have the ability to NOT make a Spidey movie...which is a huge deal. Sony has to keep pumping them out until the character dries up and dies. WB has that power with the DC characters. Sometimes they can just let the characters rest for a while. Sony can't let Spidey take 7 years off like WB did with Batman after B&R. But Marvel doing the X-men would be more like GotG where every member gets to shine instead of it just being "Starlord and friends". Gamora, Rocket, Drax, and even Groot get to be main characters. If Fox did GotG they would have cast some hunky actor for Starlord and relegated the rest of the characters to support players. I think you are confusing Fox and Marvel because it is Fox movies where Wolverine was in every movie mugging for the cameras. They couldn't even do First Class or Deadpool without wedging Wolverine into the movie. We've been "taking our chances with Fox" for 17 years. I think we know what they are about after all this time. This has to be fanboy driven. ...Or anti-Disney maybe? We actually know exactly what Fox does with the X-men and it's not good most of the time. They've shown us for 17 years. But that's preferable to the company that created the characters and has demonstrated they are better at CBMs than Fox?....and have resuscitated Spider-Man? All based on speculation on "what Marvel would do"?....the company that made the X-men popular in the first place ....mixed in with their comic book universe. None of these claims make any logical sense. A non-cloud Galactus might be the main reason I want this to happen. ....ok...and a non-suck Silver Surfer...and a non-suck Dr Doom...and a non-suck Storm...and a Cyclops as a real character. Didn't even think about Kang...another great character. Here are some of the R rated movies Disney has released: Miramax Quentin Tarantino’s Pulp Fiction Quentin Tarantino’s Kill Bill Volume 1 and Volume 2 Peter Jackson’s Heavenly Creatures Kevin Smith’s Clerks Gary Felder’s Things to Do in Denver When You're Dead Woody Allen’s Mighty Aphrodite Danny Boyle’s Trainspotting Anthony Minghella’s The English Patient Gus Van Sant’s Good Will Hunting Lasse Hallström’s The Cider House Rules Steven Soderbergh’s Full Frontal With Dimension Films: Robert Rodriguez’s From Dusk Till Dawn Robert Rodriguez’s Sin City Robert Rodriguez’s The Faculty Halloween H20: 20 Years Later Wes Craven’s Scream Wes Craven’s Scream 2 Wes Craven’s Scream 3 Bad Santa The Amityville Horror So obviously releasing a Deadpool or Logan under the Fox banner wouldn't be an issue.

They've made a couple of decent movies. ...Which never resonated with the public the same as the efforts of other studios. Fox is the only one to fail to get a CBM over 250m domestic. Not surprising to me that Deadpool...the one they didn't bother with as much...was the one exception. The list of characters they have mishandled and/or completely failed with is a mile long. Just start counting them...you'll need to remove your shoes and get a friend with all their fingers and toes as well. Add in that they also dropped the ball on two of the best Xmen stories....Dark Phoenix and Apocalypse. They were handed some of the greatest characters and stories in CB history and completely blew it. I can't think of a bigger waste of material. I mean....Sony had some serious issues with Spidey...yet they still did way better than Fox.

Yes Fox wasted Deadpool. One of the biggest epic fails in CBM history. Us Supes fans complain about what WB did to Supes...but that's nothing compared to what Fox did to DP. Poor RR had to fight Fox for years to get DP made properly. They finally threw a small budget at them and let them do what they wanted after the test footage was released and the public reaction slapped Fox in the head with a dose of reality. DP was good because Fox didn't care. The worst thing that could happen to DP was being a huge hit and getting Fox interested. Giving them "credit" for DP is an insult to Ryan Reynolds. The Fox version of Deadpool turned out like this: That's how bad they screwed him up. Marvel "screwing up" a character is minor compared to that abomination. There is a reason why you had to reach for small time characters like Mandarin and Sif. Marvel has a great track record bringing their characters to the screen. ...Including characters that no one thought would work onscreen. (lest we forget what people thought before Iron Man, Cap, Thor, Ant-Man, Dr Strange, and GotG were made) Fox does things like totally slaughtering characters in embarrassing fashion. And not minor ones either....they actually screw up legendary characters like Dr Doom, Galactus, Phoenix, Silver Surfer, Apocalypse, Storm, Cyclops, Rogue, and Deadpool. It's truly been one of the biggest epic fails in CBM history. No other studio can compare to the Fox ineptitude. It's not close. They've all had their down moments of course....Fox has created its own category of fail. The Xmen are filled to the brim with great female characters too....all of which Fox has wasted. Suggesting they are better at female characters has got to be fueled by fanboyism. You don't see how it would improve if Marvel got the Xmen back...I don't see how it WOULDN'T. A studio could drop the ball pretty hard and still improve on what Fox has done. Marvel created those characters so the whole idea is silly to begin with. There would be no "Wolverine and Friends" at Marvel. Finally Storm, Cyclops, Rogue, Collossus, Phoenix, and Kitty Pryde would be real characters instead of background noise for the Wolverine chronicles. See Spider-Man Homecoming for an example of what happens when a Marvel character is created by a studio who understands the character....namely Marvel. Oh now that is huge. Should be a headline. Agreed. This idea that Marvel...the company who created the characters...wouldn't know what to do with them is the most illogical claim possible.

Same. It's not hard at all to do. They can do small stories with Daredevil and big stories with the Avengers. It all works. Even in the MCU they can easily do Ant-Man and Avengers. It's not hard to understand why mutants would be different in a shared world. People like Iron Man, Ant-Man, and Cap get their abilities in a different way. Mutants being born with superior abilities is a huge thing. That's going to scare people. It's the next step in evolution and that suggests extinction for the species being "left behind". Is it a problem that characters like Spider-Man and Hulk are disliked and/or feared by the public while Iron Man and Cap are adored? ...Nope...not a problem at all. It's not just one reality for every character.