Curiouser and Curiouser

It just doesn't look all that good. And I feel like its audience is super young, so I don't know how much previews really matter for it. Maybe I'm wrong.

This movie looks absolutely terrible - like it has no real reason to exist aside from perhaps a contractually obligated IP play or something.

It's 3.5 hours long, so I don't read too much into anything. Re: the international drop, I really do think it's the Leo factor.

Because everyone wants to look good in the press? It's vey normal. I do think they have something to be proud of regardless.

the actor strike may have made that impossible. I was initially skeptical but now i'm of the opinion it hurt the movie.

Everything is always spin. 23.3 million domestic for a 3.5 hour movie alone isn't anything to sneeze at. Let alone that it's not an action movie, it's not IP, and it's depressing. Call me crazy, but I always thought over 20 million openings were what you'd hope for for an adult drama. The only reason this seems disappointing is the budget. But as has been discussed to infinity, the budget is way less relevant to this project than to non Apple films. Never mind the biggest movie star in the world did almost zero press for this, which I think probably would have boosted that international number even more. I don't believe it's opening in china either. The budget itself is literally the only drag on its performance right now. And the budget was so outside the realm of typical movie math I don't even know how you can analyze it as a profit loss sort of thing. That is very cool about NIGHTMARE BEFORE CHRISTMAS. My daughter adores it, so maybe i'll take her. we watch it at home all the time though.

An Irish guy made a film about my culture's tragedy haha. I'm not Irish. I was happy a big movie did get made about it, but I can't say it was a perfect movie. No one ended up seeing it, which sucks. I do think it's good people are seeing KOTFM. I think there is more than one way into any historical event, and I look forward to supporting an Osage filmmaker telling their version at some point. Killers of the Flower Moon made me interested in this part of history, so I hope it happens one day. I am sad to admit without these projects, I don't know if it would have captured my attention otherwise. Not because I'm indifferent, but sometimes we need a big neon flashing light on something to force ourselves to stop and watch.

I don't understand how anyone can hate Martin Scorsese. The man has done so much for cinema through his films and the World Cinema Project. He's a deeply thoughtful and sensitive person. Clearly well meaning. And I have seen so much disdain for him, and maybe that's why I am overly sensitive to critiques of this film. He clearly meant well and tried his best with this story. Apple spent 200 million to try to do it justice.

Of course they are entitled to their valid opinions! i'm interested in their opinions. My only critique of them is I simply don't believe a movie premiere is the place for that sort of nuance they were going for. Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know. I really don't think Scorsese cares. I feel like going to a premiere is inherently an endorsement of a film. So to do that and then give the media quotes that become the whole story is a little unusual. no one should ever feel pressure to attend a premiere of a movie they do not support or endorse. But i'm not even saying that applies to them. I think their message was being deliberately misinterpreted by the anti scorsese crowd. That's what I'm reacting to. For the most part, I think their comments were very interesting and thoughtful. I can relate to seeing your people's tragedy be depicted on screen and the mixed and sad feelings that come with that. This film is of much higher quality than basically the only film that ever tackled my people's story.

no where did I ever say "how dare they" stop being disingenuous. It's offensive. If anything, the people speaking for Christopher Cote are the ones cynically using his comments to try to justify why this project sucks. Also, way to ignore the numerous members of the community who are thrilled with the film! It's like this notion that if one person has any issue with it in a community, we all have to immediately feel like their opinion holds the most weight.

I just feel it's a little cynical that Scorsese seems to be getting more criticism than David Grann, when David Grann's book is mostly about the birth of the FBI. People laugh at this budget, but a huge reason the budget was this high was because Scorsese wanted to make this movie "top of the line" and not cut corners or shoot elsewhere. It had to film where it happened. Of course I cannot speak for any indigenous people or the Osage, and everyone has a right to feel however they want. I really didn't mean to suggest Cote can't have his opinion. I just don't agree film premieres are the place for more nuanced critiques or discussions. That's all! He did really good work in the movie and a premiere is about celebrating everyone's work. And promoting the film, which was already hampered by the lack of actors.

It doesn't have to be, but that is what THIS story is about. It is about a historical event.

This is the story of the Osage Murders. How do you tell a story without murder? Indigenous women are killed and go missing nowadays at a ridiculously high rate and barely anyone pays attention. This film underscores that sad reality. It draws attention. I just simply don't get how any version of this story is told that doesn't include murder. I felt the Osage characters were treated with a lot of dignity by Scorsese.

They can think what they want and be as vocal as they want in their own time. They were there to promote the movie. Why go at all? Again, I don't even think their opinions are wrong or invalid. How can I? It's their opinion. Just like I have my opinion about stuff. You typically don't see people dressing up and going on a promotional circuit and being negative is all. It's weird.

And I find that a little nuts, personally. No one even knew this horrible thing happened. Now they do.

I still find going to a premiere and being remotely negative to be kind of weird. Of course he's entitled to his opinion, I just think it's rude. But all of that aside, I just do think his words are being deliberately twisted to make it sound like he's making some sort of indictment on the film overall. It was more just his musings on it. The bummer is the entire premiere became about him, and that isn't really fair to everyone else who worked on it. And the actors can't respond or anything. There are people related to Mollie and Ernest who firmly believe there was real feeling between the couple. So for Cote to just say there's not love just abuse and be critical of portraying any genuine feeling felt a little out of bounds to me, personally. That's not his family's story. The movie doesn't take a remotely sympathetic or even empathetic view of Ernest. I just simply do not understand why portraying things as they actually happened is somehow disrespectful. Overall though, I think he is of course more than entitled to discuss his feelings on the film as an Osage and someone who worked on it. Just wish the forum he picked was maybe a little better and there was time for a real discussion.

Scorsese was going to direct it with Leo in the lead role at one point.

A film DiCaprio couldn't even promote. Shocked he didn't try to subtly promote the movie by just being more visible. If anything, the opposite. Wake me up when he ever releases a film that opens to single digits. Then we will talk. Especially when he can promote the movie. I don't think any other actor would open this movie to anything close to what it got, and he's such a big star internationally the lack of international publicity tour I think is going to hurt it. Such a "what if" scenario.

What did he get wrong? Also, Christopher Cote wasn't telling people not to see the movie. People are actually misinterpreting what he was even saying. Yes, it's not by Osage for Osage. It's by a white director and it speaks more to the general public. That doesn't mean he did anything "wrong" or disrespectful. I think people are doing this man a disservice by acting like he attended a premiere on a film he worked hard on and then trashed it. That's not what happened. And if it was, he shouldn't have even gone to the premiere (but he didn't do that).

You've never heard of his World Cinema Foundation?

Joker is a massive comic book character. That's like pointing to Margot Robbie in Barbie and saying she must be a huge draw, in spite of the fact that nothing else has actually resonated at the box office much.

I guess i'm the only one on here who thinks north of 20 million for a movie with this length and subject matter (and set in the 1920s) is good Whether or not it made sense for Apple is not for me to say. This is the movie they bought and there's no way their expectations could have been much higher. Maybe some of the tracking from some places got them excited at the last minute, but I feel like it did in line with its tracking...at least according to the Ankler. Right down the middle of tracking. I would have LOVED to have seen the press tour with the cast. Such a bummer we will never get that. Biggest movie star in the world in this film and he's the invisible man. I get why, but it is so weird. I just don't think they could have delayed this movie anymore, and clearly they were comfortable with it opening during the strike if they felt it would clear 20.

She's very clearly a lead. And I think she will win. Nothing about Poor Things excites me. Seems very weird.

This movie did nothing to change Marty or Leo's status...he's going to make whatever he wants next and same with Leo, who is still going to get to choose from every script. I actually do not think it'll be the wager for either of them though, I just don't see someone at marty's age directing a physically grueling type of movie. But maybe i'll be wrong.

If anyone is interested, this is partial analysis from one of the best industry trade's The Ankler (subscription only, basically the new version of Deadline Hollywood ) "Killers of the Flower Moon: $23 Million ($44 Million global) • Pretty good number considering only the director could actively promote it (although APPLE did put the 🔥 on the Marketing buys this week). ◦ 53% said they attended the pic due to Scorsese. ◦ 48% for the plot. ◦ 36% said Leo was a factor for them. • In the dead center of tracking. • A- Cinemascore • 44% were under 30 years-old 👀 They break down the audience more than this, but I found this pretty fascinating. The Scorsese number is nice And they suggest this could get to 100 million domestic.