ZattMurdock

Ha. And just like that, I bear somewhat cautiously positive news. So yeah, do you want the good news? We have our official first ‘cryptic positive reactIon’ about The Marvels: She is an actual film critic in Argentina. I can vouch that she isn’t joking. Pros (not for me really): She throughly disliked She-Hulk, which I love. Cons: she’s an obvious Captain Marvel super fan. What I’m saying is: press is likely getting to see this week. We might hear some whispers here and there, but actual reactions from RT critics only Nov 8, 12am ET.

Can we all just agree that if the film gets good reviews and people dig it, people will stop with this shit and credit her for her work. Call me absolutely insane, but I do think that this film has a strong shot of being good. Great even, for what it actually is. That’s all I ask. Feel free to blame Marvel and Feige if it’s trash. DaCosta has already proved herself with Candyman, if she delivers with The Marvels, she deserves the acknowledgment.

They are thankfully close. I’m just savvy enough to know that unless something changes, and I hope the board go ahead with a dedicated thread for the franchise as a whole, Deadpool 3 and the next MCU thread will just get hijacked by the same conversations over and over again. It’s just not good for those following these films that want to have a good conversation about them.5 days until the first reactions.

I think you can keep up to three, so people don’t get special treatment. One for Star Wars (despite who knows when we get the next film), one for DC and other for the MCU. It can work. I am the king of the derail. I can start talking to you and veer into a path on how Monica Rambeau was actually my Captain Marvel growing up and how I actually liked Carol Danvers a lot more than Iron Man as a kid if anything because she used to hang around the X-Men a lot, I can go into detours about how Love and Thunder and Wakanda Forever hit me at a personal level. I don’t think it’s healthy - or that it makes sense for that matter - to claim that the MCU is "collapsing and stumbling" so rapidly every day, all day, on every thread. DC has stumble and got back up again time and time again, and we didn’t do that here. Spider-Man: No Way Home was less than 2 years ago, Guardians Vol. 3 came out this year and it’s a clearly beloved film, there is a palpable hype for Deadpool 3. If The Marvels bombs, it bombs. We will talk extensively and throughly about that. We will have What want wrong threads for it. And if it doesn’t bomb, we will talk about that as well, regardless of the outcome, we’re close now. My point is, you can discuss everything you want, but threads for a film kinda need to be a thread for a film. The talk about "Marvel’s decline" didn’t start here with The Marvels, neither after Endgame. It has always been around. I think it’s a valid discussion to have, but some people just want to talk about the film, do you know what I mean? If every thread about the MCU is a referendum to MCU’s existence, imagine if we applied that to all the other franchises. It poisons the discussion and we keep going in circles. With a thread to talk the MCU in general, I can happily discuss the MCU as a whole when I feel like it and go into more specifics with the threads focusing on each film.

I can understand that. No idea what happened though, I grew out of those threads long before their were over. I think that isolated threads can be beneficial if we can keep the more general MCU / franchise ‘x’ talks at a general thread. We don’t need every MCU thread to be about Quantumania, or every DC thread to be about Flash or every thread about Star Wars be about TROS, despite the latter being a low key guilty pleasure of mine.

Actually, no. I welcome and engage with that. I’m talking about what clutters the thread, I do my best to not engage with people that clearly aren’t posting in good faith. I know that you have a bad misconception of me and I’m aware that I’ve played a role in that. What I’m talking about is the constant bickering and conversations that go back and forth over the same thing. There was a time that leaks from Reddit and shit like that was flat out forbidden or at very least heavily despised, that’s a whole separate issue that I don’t even dare to ask to be tackled because it has become so pervasive and it’s everywhere, I strongly believe that’s the major issue not only with MCU films, but blockbusters films in general. What I’m talking about is that if every day I went to let’s say KOTFM’s message thread talk about my grievances with that film, I’d be rightfully attacked. I don’t like that, so I don’t do it. I kinda follow the same rules that BOT used to have: whenever I have a fundamental issue with a film, I usually say my piece once on the Weekend thread and I never mention again. It isn’t just that I think it’s a waste of my time, I don’t want to poison the well of the conversation. You don’t see people daily making posts about KOTFM really needing to be a tv show, made by someone else and etc. What I try to engage when I talk about a film that interests me isn’t if it’s positive or negative, it’s the current topic of the day. As long as it isn’t repetitive and it’s a film I’ve an interest on, I engage with it. Edit: my autocorrect is killing me.

When people get their paychecks usually in the US? Not sure if it can be applied in the US, but I know a lot of people that were waiting for their paychecks / credit card bills to close so they would preorder their tickets. It’s common place to people here to wait until the beginning of the month to buy movie tickets or any kind of entertainment they are looking forward to. Not sure how it works in the US, but most people here receive their paychecks monthly.

If I can once again suggest, just bring back the franchise wars thread. I like the idea of Marvel, DC, Star Wars and etc having their own threads, but then there will always be something else. The problem isn’t even really talking about other MCU films, comparing with other films can be healthy. It’s the constant referendum if the MCU is dying day in and day out. DC films faced massive bombs and most people here are enthusiastic for what DCU can do with Gunn as the president of DC Studios. I’m just saying that if people need to make a referendum on the MCU’s existence, let’s not pretend that started here with The Marvels thread. I have my personal grievances with Aquaman 2 but I don’t even talk about that film, neither I take please if it bombs. When we had rules in place against poison the well derails, I strongly believe threads had a much more healthier pace, regardless if the talk was negative. I mean, I was here during TASM2 and survived the experience, that was a film that it truly made me feel bad when it came out and it was bad. Let people that want to constantly have a back and forth about how much your favorite franchise suck have their own place to scream into the void, that could be helpful to all the other franchises as well.

I have no idea what that is, I barely watch most of the new Pixar films, let alone Disney’s animation. I do think that Disney animators unionizing - and the budget for Pixar films being bigger than the Spider-Verse films - is a good thing. Across the Spider-Verse should cost at least just as much as a Pixar film, not the other way around. I bet that if Pixar tried something like AtSV, their budget would have to be likely even bigger.

Oh, I think they do. Most people that post here know that. Regardless, one week from now I will be watching the film, and before that we will get the impressions and reviews. We will know soon enough.

Forgive me but I don’t even know what Raya is, I do know that Spider-Verse is my favorite western animation series of films and like it’s exposed on that article, it’s made with a lot of love by underpaid and insane amounts of crunch. People working 15 hours a day in a passion project and for a Visa so they can live their dream as animators. If you don’t understand why that matters and how Sony has a history of that with Sausage Party a few years before this, I don’t know what to tell you. Shit is wrong. People here unanimously called out once the news broke months ago, myself included, despite loving the film. No reason to turn everything into an argument, dude.

I honestly do not care if that’s the case. I sincerely do not care, I couldn’t give a fuck. If that’s the case, by all means, let’s go with that. With that said, if it’s good, I don’t want people to take away the credit from her. I think it’s incredibly disgusting how can you easily tell that she used this article as source and Variety is selling as new information. Beyond the fact that the Vanity Fair contextualizes things a lot. She had just moved to London when she was interviewed by Rebeca Ford’s Vanity Fair that it’s basically a promotion piece for The Marvels, with both DaCosta and Feige bantering between those quotes. It turns out that the SAG-AFTRA strike just happened days after the interview, so she obviously wouldn’t be able to work on that, neither it seems that her and Tessa Thompson got a grant to work on that film. From Vanity Profile’s article, it seems like she was actively working on post-production and both mention saying it was a hard part of the process. All I’m saying is that no one should dare to discredit her if that’s a win for her. I think it’s absolute madness the amount of vitriol that this woman is facing in the internet right now, and from what it looks like to me, it came from this article. I’m pissed at this, fuck The Marvels, but if it’s good, it’s Nia DaCosta’s win as much as it would be if this was a James Gunn’s film or any other white dude working as a director in the MCU.

I just posted the interview. That wasn’t what she said. Look at the previous page.

Across the Spider-Verse is a work of art and should be nominated for best film, but it will easily win best animation. The Marvels isn’t out yet.

Regardless how I take several issues with the article - and Coy kinda summarizes it here my biggest peeve: What you are saying - and I don’t blame you because that’s what a lot of people on Twitter are saying - is different than what Spiegel has written, and most of what Nia DaCosta said. So here is Spiegel’s article’s bit on The Marvels: And here is what Nia DaCosta said for her Vanity Fair profile, on which both DaCosta and Feige talked candidly praising each other, from where the quote that got modified into oblivion came from: But that’s far from the only thing they said about each other and the film for Nia’s Vanity Fair profile. Actually, the information supposedly ‘provided’ by Variety today in what it sort of looks as a hit piece that questions Nia DaCosta’s professionalism isn’t even new information. You can read about this on the Vanity Fair article that both DaCosta and Feige were interviewed for: There is also this quote: Here is the article, it’s actually a pretty chill and candid interview with Nia and Kevin sharing stories about working with her on The Marvels and vice versa: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2023/09/nia-dacosta-on-navigating-the-blockbuster-machine?utm_brand=vf&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&mbid=social_twitter&utm_social-type=owned My point and what I’m saying is: how an interview that was clearly candid ended up becoming a hit piece against Nia DaCosta? It’s obvious that DaCosta and Feige are in good terms, and with the strike following, this interview, DaCosta would have little to do other than work on post for The Marvels. Like Fisher, both DaCosta and Feige "declined to comment" (or didn’t they? It wouldn’t be the first time that Spiegel would say that and someone would come out with the receipts proving otherwise like Fisher did, but I sincerely doubt either DaCosta or Feige would go through all the trouble). I don’t know if the film is good or bad. DaCosta claiming she is conscious that she is a hired gun isn’t different than similar points made by Gunn and several other directors before, she talks about her brainstorming process with Feige on the article there, knowing that these characters live inside an universe that she has proved time and time again before to be incredibly knowledgeable of. Maybe she isn’t Iman but this woman know her Marvel comics culture. I’m just saying, I won’t take this film from DaCosta. If it’s good, that’s on her, not the MCU.

Not really about The Marvels, but since Tatiana Spiegel wrote the article and part of it is about this film, I think this adds context to the LA Mag article that I’ve posted above. Siegel used to work for THR at the time of this article, left THR and went work to Rolling Stone, where she published the article that Fisher mentions on his tweets. Apparently, the disagreement between Masters and Spiegel was due to this piece: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/feature/ray-fisher-opens-up-about-justice-league-joss-whedon-and-warners-i-dont-believe-some-of-these-people-are-fit-for-leadership-4161658/ Which is in direct opposition to the article Spiegel posted later at Rolling Stone.

Directors working on different films during post-production is quite more common than people realize. It doesn’t mean that they aren’t working on the film during post-production, and judging the person who wrote this piece, it does weird me out how this isn’t really the first time she has done similar articles. Last time was Ray Fisher, and there is kind of a pattern forming here. Also if that wasn’t damning enough, there is this: https://lamag.com/news/hollywood-trade-wars-heat-up Siegel wrote a scathing article on Ray Fisher back in the day for Rolling Stone, and apparently there was a very public schism between THR’s Kim Masters and her over Ray Fisher. I don’t think Snyder is a saint, but I do think that there was something incredibly fucked up about Fisher’s whole situation there. There is also this thread by Fisher that sparked the article above from last year:

Because the whole operation was ran basically as a sweat shop: https://www.vulture.com/2023/06/spider-verse-animation-four-artists-on-making-the-sequel.html It’s absolutely tragic to see people using Across the Spider-Verse’s production budget as the template going forward. Yes, Across the Spider-Verse is an work of art, one of my favorite films of the year and one of my favorite animations of all time, arguably tied for my favorite Spider-Man film, but it isn’t a project that we should be parading around as the role model for the industry going forward.

Holy shit.

I mean there is a LOT of rated R films and series on D+ already. It’s not like they would be breaking ground there. I think that the idea that Disney would hold on for a ‘family brand’ type of streaming never made sense since they bought Fox. And it’s not like they aren’t making more rated R films and series either.

I know that @AnotherDayAnotherDollar is far more knowledgeable about this than me, so I’d defer to him.

I think that’s a good thing. Now they should merge it with Disney+.

Yeah, releasing this July 4th - if feasible to get ready by then - would be great for this. First Captain America to get a release date at Independence day as well.

It was the plan all along. This is what Secret Wars is about. Does anyone really believe they would get satisfied only reuniting some Spider-Men and X-Men with the new generation of Avengers? Secret Wars is precisely about that. I’ve been saying this here to deaf ears for years. I’m not sure how can anyone working at Marvel can react to this without giving away what Secret Wars is. Secret Wars is everyone is here on steroids the movie. It’s what the comics were as well. I don’t believe that Tony Stark is sticking around, neither that a soft reboot is following. I also don’t believe that this is about multiverses or time displaced Avengers either. Do you remember those visions that Thanos had once he killed half the universe? Or that deleted scene with a vision that Stark has with an older Morgan played by that girl from 13 Reasons Why? The infinity stones, particularly the soul stone, are special. There is a reason why they required Gamora’s and Natasha’s sacrifice. In the comics, Adam Warlock and Gamora formed the Infinity Watch because they were trapped inside the soul stone. Stark is dead. He died. Same for Gamora. Their souls in the other hand…

What has people working isn’t changing, what I mean is that there is no way we get a Batgirl situation here. I think a recast of Kang is unavoidable at this point, but I take issue with the article assessment that they are struggling to recast him. You can make Kang’s story work without him, misdirection is very much at the heart of what Kang is as a character, it’s also a theme of Loki’s show. What I believe people misunderstand about Kang is that he was never supposed to be the Thanos of this era. He can be a cunning villain, but the actual big bad for Secret Wars has always been Doctor Doom.