Diversity in top films misrepresents U.S. population

[Phil in the Blank]

Do you guys even know what racism/prejudice is?

 

It is treating someone differently in an arbitrary manner based on some inherent disposition.

 

All you morons spouting off about the "straight white males" in this thread are in fact being racist in a thread supposedly about stopping racism and promoting diversity.  So our opinion isn't relevant because of our race and sexual orientation?  The absence of racism prejudice is equality.

 

Dear god, are you really all this dense?

 

Yes, yes they are.

[dashrendar44]

I didn't say cry-babies whined about anything Dash.

 

Also Dash, It's okay to me that you are black, and I respect your skin pigment.

 

You don't quite get it. I respect anybody whether it be white, black, yellow, whatever color as I don't pass judgements on a person based on his skin color. That doesn't mean that skin color doesn't exist. That means I don't stop at a skin color to judge that individual/character because that's short sighted.

 

If you're blonde, I won't stop saying you're blonde because we should be "color-blind" like you said. It's just a matter of fact like my eyes are black or someone is tanned. We should go beyond but "going beyond skin color" doesn't mean "skin color doesn't exist anymore".

Edited August 6, 2014 by dashrendar44

[Jandrew]

Here is why you need to stop using MLK. He's not the only that fucking did anything. I'm tired of seeing MLK blvd in every city and MLK High School and MLK Museum and MLK Arena. Malcolm X, Rosa Park, Sigourney Truth, Frederick Douglas, WEB Dubois, Booker T Washington, Muhammad Ali, Ronald McNair, Maya Angelou, Langston Hughes, Marcus Garvey, Medgar Evers, Emmitt Till, Spike Lee, Bill Cosby, Mary McLeod Bethune, Thurgood Marshall, Colin Powell, Ray Charles, Condelezza Rice, Clearance Thomas, Ella Baker, Walter White, Jackie Robinson, etc. were all very important black people that did just as much, if not more than MLK.

 

Everyone always wants to use MLK because he's the most famous and has good quotes and yada yada, makes them look enlightened on the issue. Youre not enlightened on the issue so stop acting like. And it's not just blacks. There have been many Hispanic, Asian, gay, and female, etc. people that have made advancements for their minorities. If you can give me an MLK quote, you can give me a Medgar Evars quote. Oh wait, who is he? You dont know, go ahead and go Google. What about Walter White? Go Google, what about WEB Dobouis? Go Google. MLK and Malcolm X are the only ones people care to know.

 

Stop fucking using MLK to sound smart and so we don't disagree with you. You can use MLK quotes all you want, you're still blind to the issue. Just the fact alone that you that you only use MLK shows. Stop with the MLK. Stop acting like victims. Stop taking everything out of context. 

 

"Oh no, baseball doesn't have enough blacks, lets diversify" Shut the hell up. You're totally missing the point and youre being ignorant on purpose.

[Phil in the Blank]

You don't quite get it. I respect anybody whether it be white, black, yellow, whatever color as I don't pass judgements on a person based on his skin color. That doesn't mean that skin color doesn't exist. That means I don't stop at a skin color to judge that individual/character because that's short sighted.

 

If you're blonde, I won't stop saying you're blonde because we should be "color-blind" like you said. It's just a matter of fact like my eyes are black or someone is tanned. We should go beyond but "going beyond skin color" doesn't mean "that doesn't exist anymore".

 

I view skin colour in the exact same way that I view hair colour. I notice it obviously, but there is no need to judge someone because their hair is brown or red or blond. Sure it exists, but its completely irrelevant to how I view them as a person. So yes, I look at you and it registers in my mind that you are black, but its your posts that I judge you as a person on and not your skin colour. Believe me, I would view you exactly the same even if you were white.

 

I hope you would do the same if I was black.

[Water Bottle]

Do you guys even know what racism/prejudice is?

 

It is treating someone differently in an arbitrary manner based on some inherent disposition.

 

All you morons spouting off about the "straight white males" in this thread are in fact being racist in a thread supposedly about stopping racism and promoting diversity.  So our opinion isn't relevant because of our race and sexual orientation?  The absence of racism/prejudice is equality.

 

Dear god, are you really all this dense?

 

Your opinion is relevant but when white people try to dismiss the concerns of the minority-like you are constantly trying to do-then I'm sorry but it probably has something to do with your skin color. The fact that you think representation in Hollywood is a joke issue probably entails from white privilege.

 

Pointing out a person's race is not racist because unlike Spottswoode, I'm very aware of a person's color and how that influences not only that person's identity but how the world reacts to that person.

 

But, sure, please tell me what racism is. Clearly as a Hispanic I don't know what you could possibly be talking about.

[mattmav45]

Your opinion is relevant but when white people try to dismiss the concerns of the minority-like you are constantly trying to do-then I'm sorry but it probably has something to do with your skin color. The fact that you think representation in Hollywood is a joke issue probably entails from white privilege.

 

Pointing out a person's race is not racist because unlike Spottswoode, I'm very aware of a person's color and how that influences not only that person's identity but how the world reacts to that person.

 

But, sure, please tell me what racism is. Clearly as a Hispanic I don't know what you could possibly be talking about.

 

If you actually want to go there, I'm 50% Hispanic myself.  25% Mexican and 25% Spanish.

 

My opinion is not stronger or weaker as a result of my race.  Period.

[Phil in the Blank]

Maybe because you dont get the point? You didnt respond to my paragraph, but instead made an ignorant statement. So since you made an ignorant statement and clearly is not seeing where we're coming from, what else should I say? Like I said, you did the same thing in the blackface thread, and that went on for days, and you still couldnt see why it was problem. Even Rich, a white male, tried to lay it out for you and you still didnt get it. So i dont expect you to get this.Maybe if you replied to me with your thoughts, instead of making an ignorant statement, then yeah we couldve debated, but youre acting like how most white males act in these situations. Dont ry to play some victim, you know it.

 

I wasn't responding to you as I had no real desire to get into yet another argument where you try to insinuate I am racist.

 

And you know what, pointing our your behavior, where you are purposely trying to shut down debate by pointing out we are white is not playing victim. It's stating the truth as I see it. I personally do not feel victimized at all by you, and in fact could not care less what you thought about me. But ultimately you are trying to use my own race against me and I call it as I see it.

 

I just hope that my comments inspire you think along the lines that, 'you know what, spottswoode is correct, i shouldn't call him out on being white, i should call him out on being an asshole.' 

[Water Bottle]

If you actually want to go there, I'm 50% Hispanic myself.  25% Mexican and 25% Spanish.

 

My opinion is not stronger or weaker as a result of my race.  Period.

 

Okay, so you are okay with the current level of diversity in Hollywood? Okay, well that's fine. But then why must you mock those who want more diverse casts? Who want people to get roles not because they're white but because they're the best actor/actress?

[dashrendar44]

I view skin colour in the exact same way that I view hair colour. I notice it obviously, but there is no need to judge someone because their hair is brown or red or blond. Sure it exists, but its completely irrelevant to how I view them as a person. So yes, I look at you and it registers in my mind that you are black, but its your posts that I judge you as a person on and not your skin colour. Believe me, I would view you exactly the same even if you were white.

 

I hope you would do the same if I was black.

 

Now you're just paraphrasing me so the last sentence doesn't make any sense because I already exposed my similar views.

[Phil in the Blank]

 

Pointing out a person's race is not racist because unlike Spottswoode, I'm very aware of a person's color and how that influences not only that person's identity but how the world reacts to that person.

 

 

 

I'm not saying that skin colour, does not influence how the world reacts to that person now. I am saying we need to move towards a future where skin colour does not influence how the world reacts to them at all.

[Phil in the Blank]

Now you're just paraphrasing me so the last sentence doesn't make any sense because I already exposed my similar views.

 

So we agree.

 

Excellent.

 

Skin Color should not play any role in how we judge each other Dash.

[Water Bottle]

Do you guys even know what racism/prejudice is?

 

It is treating someone differently in an arbitrary manner based on some inherent disposition.

 

http://thebluebanner.net/hollywood-ignores-minorities/

http://www.complex.com/pop-culture/2013/04/25-minority-characters-that-hollywood-whitewashed/the-good-earth

http://time.com/7278/agencies-hollywood-racial-diversity/

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1683&dat=20061201&id=QCcqAAAAIBAJ&sjid=nkUEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3393,462205

[Water Bottle]

The last article points out that over 70% of the time, only white actors were allowed to audition for a role. Only 8.5% of the time did white people and minorities competed for the same role.

 

You know I'm all for color-blind casting but jeesh, sure seems to me like there's no problem of race here.

[dashrendar44]

So we agree.

 

Excellent.

 

Skin Color should not play any role in how we judge each other Dash.

 

But why do you feel the need to dismiss the topic altogether by initially saying "Minorities having a teary over thing that is not important", you're not even saying "I don't think that's an issue, imo" and leave at it, you basically say "Minorities crying over something that I find unsignificant and that should be unsignificant for them as well because I think so",  that's a little bit condescending like diversity is not worthy as an issue or a struggle for them to care about. You force your POV onto minorities and pass judgement as a whole, that's borderline paternalist. "Stop bitching you dimwits about this, you should bitch about that instead!"

 

Minorities don't need to be told what struggles they should carry out.

Edited August 6, 2014 by dashrendar44

[Phil in the Blank]

I would like to know exactly what is meant by that.   "Culture" is a tricky word.   All people of any given race do not share the same "culture".   A black person in Britain does not have the same cultural background as a black person in Tennessee.    A Latin person from Cuba does not share the same culture as a Latin person from Mexico or Brazil.   And obviously if you travel Europe you'll find out that being white can mean your culture is dramatically different from another white person.  A white person from Germany does not remotely share the same culture as a white person from Spain, France, or Italy.

 

Then I wonder what is meant be "celebrate".   I've seen a lot of movies set in various cultures and there usually very little attempt to "celebrate" it.   ...It's just a part of the story.   Forcing a "celebration" into a movie is probably going to have a negative effect on the narrative and possibly make it have less mass appeal.

 

 

 

Culture is a tricky word. You could write an essay on what it means but i'm just going to stick with the dictionary defintion because I'm tired.

 

"the ideas, customs, and social behaviour of a particular people or society."

 

There is a distinct lack of race in that definition and I completely agree with you that just because you share the same skin colour does not mean that you share the same culture.

 

As for using the word celebrate. To be honest I rewrote that particular sentence a few times before going 'fuck it' I'll just save arguments and use WB's words. Some films should be a celebration of a particular culture, some films should be a criticism of a particular culture, and most films should have culture as a backdrop or 'part of the story' as you will. I wouldn't mind that cultural backdrop being more diverse myself, but ultimately movies are going to try to appeal to the biggest audience.

[Jandrew]

I wasn't responding to you as I had no real desire to get into yet another argument where you try to insinuate I am racist.

 

And you know what, pointing our your behavior, where you are purposely trying to shut down debate by pointing out we are white is not playing victim. It's stating the truth as I see it. I personally do not feel victimized at all by you, and in fact could not care less what you thought about me. But ultimately you are trying to use my own race against me and I call it as I see it.

 

I just hope that my comments inspire you think along the lines that, 'you know what, spottswoode is correct, i shouldn't call him out on being white, i should call him out on being an asshole.' 

 

 

Ohh nowwww you wanna respond after I post my MLK comment. I never once in this thread or the blackface thread called you a racist. But theres no denying youre blind to the issue. Like Water Bottle said, you always say "I don't see race, everyone is grey". You're just saying that you don't have to admit that all races arent equal. I don't care how knowledgeable you are in MLK history, you still don't know the deal.

 

And no it's not because youre white. Rich is white. If he was hear, he'd be agreeing with me. Noctis is a white male. So what if he's gay? He's still a white male. Cmasterclay is a white male and he understands. So obviously I'm not calling out all white males, I'm calling out you. I'm NOT shutting down debate. All you had to do was respond to my post like I said. Instead you made an IGNORANT COMMENT. So stop trying to say that I'm shutting down debate! Jessie made an ignorant comment to so, but at least he replied. I was able to tell me my side, and he understood. That was this morning. But now you want to come in and say that I'm not wanting to hear what you have to say? Dude, please. I glad you don't care what I think of you. I don't know you or what you look like, so I don't hate your anything. What I do hate is how when these race topics come up, you want to act like youre a saint because "you see no colors" and know some history. 

 

Your comment does nothing for me. You're not right and haven't changed my mind on anything. I'd be different if I was the only one calling you out on it, but I'm not, so obviously youre the one with some kind of issue, not me. You wan't to act like I'm harping on you because youre white. Am I harping on Noctis or Cmasterclay or Water Bottle? Am I harping on Jessie? I'm harping on your because you're doing what you always do, and you for some reason, a little color in film is unwarranted.

[mattmav45]

Okay, so you are okay with the current level of diversity in Hollywood? Okay, well that's fine. But then why must you mock those who want more diverse casts? Who want people to get roles not because they're white but because they're the best actor/actress?

 

There is a big difference between people being judged on merit and diversification.

 

To diversify just for the sake of diversifying leads to unequal treatment all in the name of diversity.  

 

The problem is.......isn't that what you were trying to cure in the first place?  One study like this doesn't really mean much but that won't stop hordes of online personalities to jump up and claim injustice.

[Water Bottle]

I just want to point out that unless a role needs to be a certain race for the narrative to work, I wouldn't complain if Hispanics were underrepresented if they kept losing out on colorblind casting. I think I said this earlier but if that was the case, then we just need to work on improving Hispanic's acting ability but at least then we'd have a shot.

 

But come on, when blind casting only applies 8.5% of the time? I think even you Spottswoode would have to admit that we are pointing out a legit problem.

 

There is a big difference between people being judged on merit and diversification.

 

To diversify just for the sake of diversifying leads to unequal treatment all in the name of diversity.

 

I agree entirely. I don't think a movie should cast a Hispanic actor just so there's a Hispanic actor. I don't think a movie should have a black best friend just because it needs a black character.

 

But right now Hollywood is judging based on skin color, not on merit.

[Phil in the Blank]

But why do you feel the need to dismiss the topic altogether by initially saying "Minorities having a teary over thing that is not important", you're not even saying "I don't think that's an issue, imo" and leave at it, you basically say "Minorities crying over something that I find unsignificant and that should be unsignificant for them as well because I think so",  that's a little bit condescending like diversity is not worthy as an issue or a struggle for them to care about. You force your POV onto minorities and pass judgement as a whole, that's borderline paternalist. "Stop bitching you dimwits about this, you should bitch about that instead!"

 

Minorities don't need to be told what struggles they should carry out.

 

I don't force my view onto anyone. I'm not holding a gun to anyones head. 

 

The problem with screaming about the lack of, i dunno, Hispanic lead actors is that you are bitching about the symptom while not looking at the cause. It's like getting told your blood pressure is high, so you get angry at your blood as you chow down on another Big Mac. 

 

And while we group people together for convenience don't make the mistake that minorities are just one big group think. There will be people from minority groups who agree with you, there will be people from minority groups who agree with me, and there will be people from minority groups who think we are both full of shit. People are individuals with their own thoughts and beliefs and values. I'm not telling minorities anything, I am communicating my own beliefs and values.

[Phil in the Blank]

Ohh nowwww you wanna respond after I post my MLK comment. I never once in this thread or the blackface thread called you a racist. But theres no denying youre blind to the issue. Like Water Bottle said, you always say "I don't see race, everyone is grey". You're just saying that you don't have to admit that all races arent equal. I don't care how knowledgeable you are in MLK history, you still don't know the deal.

 

And no it's not because youre white. Rich is white. If he was hear, he'd be agreeing with me. Noctis is a white male. So what if he's gay? He's still a white male. Cmasterclay is a white male and he understands. So obviously I'm not calling out all white males, I'm calling out you. I'm NOT shutting down debate. All you had to do was respond to my post like I said. Instead you made an IGNORANT COMMENT. So stop trying to say that I'm shutting down debate! Jessie made an ignorant comment to so, but at least he replied. I was able to tell me my side, and he understood. That was this morning. But now you want to come in and say that I'm not wanting to hear what you have to say? Dude, please. I glad you don't care what I think of you. I don't know you or what you look like, so I don't hate your anything. What I do hate is how when these race topics come up, you want to act like youre a saint because "you see no colors" and know some history. 

 

Your comment does nothing for me. You're not right and haven't changed my mind on anything. I'd be different if I was the only one calling you out on it, but I'm not, so obviously youre the one with some kind of issue, not me. You wan't to act like I'm harping on you because youre white. Am I harping on Noctis or Cmasterclay or Water Bottle? Am I harping on Jessie? I'm harping on your because you're doing what you always do, and you for some reason, a little color in film is unwarranted.

 

So you don't vilify white people with similar views to your own but you do call people out for being white who don't agree with your views.  Sounds rather Uncle Tom like there.

 

As for not wanting color in films....Here is a quote from me from about 2 years ago in the Bond thread on if he should change ethnicity. 

 

"My personal feelings are that there is nothing about Bond that makes him inherently white. He was white when he was created because black people simply wouldn't had been likely to succeed within an organisation like MI6. Of course this is 2012 and colour has no barrier for entry these days and hence Bond could be any colour you could think of as long as he acted British.

Doesn't mean the next Bond should be Black, it just depends on who is the best man for the job. "

 

http://forums.boxoffice.com/index.php?/topic/6554-do-you-want-to-see-james-bond-portrayed-with-a-different-ethnicity/page-4

 

I have no problem with their being more diversity in the cinema. That is not my beef here.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Spottswoode