Xillix' Critical Hit Y4 Reviews

[Rorschach]

Wait is the word count over or under Scavenger Wars?

[Xillix]

Before March goes up I want to apologize in advance to @4815162342.

 

It seems like someday this game is going to devolve into nothing but the two of us pointing out each other's tendencies to over-write things.

 

Pillars of Eternity is very well-written, obviously a labor of love, and constantly engaging. I enjoyed reading it, even though it took me a long while. You should be proud.

 

But there is NO WAY that fits into 157 minutes. So, given that my reviews and scores are "in character" as a film reviewer, reviewing these as they are presented theatrically, the score is going to be a lot lower than it would be if I were just rating your actual writing, which would easily have been four or four and a half stars. But I have to look at it as if all that was somehow squished into a single film with the stated running time - as you (fairly) do with my films - which frankly would give me whiplash.

 

I'd still like it to do well and see where the story goes.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Xillix

[Xillix]

37 minutes ago, Rorschach said:

Wait is the word count over or under Scavenger Wars?

I don't remember that word count off the top of my head. Pillars is a bit over 25.3K.

[Rorschach]

13 minutes ago, Xillix said:

I don't remember that word count off the top of my head. Pillars is a bit over 25.3K.

Oh then it’s quite under. Scavenger Wars was like 34k or something like that.

[Xillix]

4 minutes ago, Rorschach said:

Oh then it’s quite under. Scavenger Wars was like 34k or something like that.

It's not the amount of writing - again I think it's very well written - it's the sheer amount of battles and dialogue and lore and to-and-fro journeying and all of that. There's not too much plot for the text or vice-versa; the writing is paced well. It's just way, way too much plot for 157 minutes of movie.

[Xillix]

MARCH

One Piece: The Journey Begins

"Definitely needed another pass in editing, maybe even at the screenplay stage. But still, it's a good-natured and reasonably exciting adventure when it makes sense. Despite the PG-13 rating, its most receptive audience will likely be the younger kids who manage to get their parents to take them."

 

Khanh Bernarda Alba

"It got pretty confusing when two of the sisters apparently traded dresses off-screen even though they didn't like each other and were competing for the same man. Also who is this grandmother, where did she come from, and why does she loudly proclaim her need to get married? Does this have something to do with the plot?"

 

Pillars of Eternity: The Hollow Vale

"There is endless potential here. The world is interesting, the cast of characters is likable, the visuals are stunning, the plot is compelling. The lore is a bit dense, not always adequately-explained, and the absolutely epic-length plot may be a bit much for some people. Still, it's well paced, and there's no shortage of thrilling action and visual splendor."

 

Marked Up Time

"Sporadically funny, but plagued by some questionable casting choices and an overcomplex plot it does everything it can to lampshade and avoid explaining. That's funny at first but quickly wears out its welcome since the film fully commits to it anyway, and as a result the dramatic elements are also undercut."

 

Can You Imagine

"Whaddya know, Notes from the Otherspace Jr. is pretty good too."

Edited October 4, 2018 by Xillix

[4815162342]

I disagree that the fact that things get substantial description necessarily means that a running time is insufficient. Sometimes summaries use a lot to describe a little.

 

 

It certainly feels inconsistent though, especially when The Scavenger Wars is about 20% longer in word court, was only 5 minutes longer in running time, had just as much, if not more, happen in its plot, and it got your #6 of Year 3. And aside from the running time, there isn't anything you really note as an issue with the movie. So all I get is that it is a fickle crapshoot when it comes to the running time saga.

Edited October 3, 2018 by 4815162342

[Xillix]

@4815162342 Here's the thing; that's EXACTLY how I felt about The Amityville Nightmare when you and a few others said the same thing about it. That it was the description and the writing out of every scene that made it feel longer, but it could have fit. And similarly, in many reviews that was the only major count given against it. Well, I've gone back and looked it over and come to agree with you on that one. I still, personally, do not think Silent Hill was especially overstuffed, but respect your opinion that it was.

 

This year when I wrote Earthsong I went back and did an audit, which I've never done before, reading through it scene-by-scene and counting up how long each scene ought to be to have proper breathing room in my opinion. I arrived at the running time from that. When I began to feel like Pillars of Eternity was overlong and wouldn't fit I decided to go back and do the same thing with it as I did with Earthsong, just to make sure I wasn't crazy or misjudging it, or applying a different standard than I did to my own stuff.

 

By my count I got to 157 minutes before

Spoiler

the Old Watcher was even killed - and then there were still two more major battles and all the additional stuff in between them for setup and character development.

 

I stopped counting there.

 

Obviously this isn't an objective system but it does reflect how I feel about the pacing personally, so in any case I figured it was a good basis for my own review as that showed me I'd consider this movie rushed by my standards. And it's not like I went through and counted words or descriptions to get to the number; I re-read the entire first two-thirds or so of the movie and jotted down how long the scenes felt, how much time it seemed would be needed for it based on the events and dialogue that occurred, and added them together via calculator. It's not as if you're a victim of purple prose in any case; like I said in an earlier post the WRITING is very well-paced, efficient without a lot of over-description. It really is the sheer number of characters and events and connective tissue and lore, not the writing style.

 

So obviously, you're welcome to disagree, as I have in some cases with your similar assessments of my stuff. But this was not arbitrary; I went to a lot of rigor "confirming" it for myself because I really did like your writing. I'll admit that The Scavenger Wars didn't get the same scrutiny; the idea hadn't even occurred to me yet until I actually wrote Earthsong, which by your standards might be a slow, ponderous bore, if this is any indication.

 

I don't mean to offend you or frustrate you - again, I liked the writeup - but that's how I felt about it, and I stopped and made doubly sure I felt that way before I gave it a review or a score. In any case, this is only one review of the film, the first, in fact, and if history is any indication others will likely be more generous.

 

So I sympathize with your frustration as I've felt that way myself, but this is not anything personal, you're a very good writer, but I stand firm on this being my opinion in this case.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Xillix

[4815162342]

@Xillix it's not your method I take issue with so much as that up to the present it feels inconsistently applied. I don't want to get into the nitty-gritty about how you reach your opinion since that's a personal thing that's all you.

 

I'm fine knowing what I'm gonna get from you, I'd just expect that other films get the same treatment.

 

 

 

So, to deflect the tension, you can generate a 2-2.5 star rating for Mass Effect now I guess 

Edited October 3, 2018 by 4815162342

[Xillix]

1 minute ago, 4815162342 said:

I'm fine knowing what I'm gonna get from you, I'd just expect that other films get the same treatment.

Yeah, like I said, this was a new thing I just came up with for my own sake this game year. I'll probably put it into practice when I get the sense something might feel a bit overdone. Not gonna audit EVERY movie or I'd never finish but if it feels problematic I'll try to confirm it before I say something.

 

As to Mass Effect - any scenes involving sexy turian men will not count toward your running time.

[4815162342]

3 minutes ago, Xillix said:

Yeah, like I said, this was a new thing I just came up with for my own sake this game year. I'll probably put it into practice when I get the sense something might feel a bit overdone. Not gonna audit EVERY movie or I'd never finish but if it feels problematic I'll try to confirm it before I say something.

 

As to Mass Effect - any scenes involving sexy turian men will not count toward your running time.

 

It is a good thing then that almost every action scene in the second and third acts involves a Turian.

 

 

I did briefly consider giving Pillars a run-time in the 165-168 range but ended up keeping it where it was. That might have just gotten me to 2.75 tho. 

 

The next film will definitely push closer to 3 hours in running time simply because the rough concept I have features more going on in terms of happenings and characters moving around the map (whereas here it was confined to a small-ish region).

 

 

 

That being said, I would appreciate it if you could maybe give some opinions/insights on the characters who'll be players going forward in the films. Would help with any adjustments I need to make.

[Xillix]

18 minutes ago, 4815162342 said:

That being said, I would appreciate it if you could maybe give some opinions/insights on the characters who'll be players going forward in the films. Would help with any adjustments I need to make.

I dig the characters! I'll say Aloth is personally my favorite but there is a section of the movie towards the middle where it felt like he sort of faded into the background. Though again I could just be biased because... he was my favorite. You'd just introduced several new characters in any case, so it makes sense. I appreciate that you managed to give a lot of the characters (Eder, Lord and Lady Raedric, and Nedmar especially) their own arcs. Obviously not all of them developed much but look forward to them doing so going forward.

 

If I had two main criticisms character-wise - first, as I said before, there was no explanation of what Aumaua are, so when Kana showed up I got confused and had to Google them; keep that in mind for new character intros in sequels. And second, Sarana feels just a bit passive, being led along by vague feelings and such for most of the film, though it makes sense given that she's just become something totally new to her, in essence. As the main protagonist I assume her arc will be spread more over the films, so that's forgivable. It looked like you were setting up a more substantial arc for Aloth next time around, such as with the reflecting pool scene. I'd like to see that. I think it's a good bet to shift focus/development among small groups of the supporting characters in each film.

 

I don't know anything about the games so I've no idea what's "supposed" to happen between them. The dynamic between Eder and Durance and their conflicting gods has a lot of promise; since you dug into Eder so much in this one it could be good to see more from Durance's side next time. Seemed like you hint at that with the whole "fifteen years of silence" deal. Aloth and Kana have a lot in common, so that seems like fertile ground too; often the people most similar to you in a group are the ones you can wind up in the deepest conflict with.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Xillix

[cookie]

I feel like if standards like this are suddenly going to be applied people should have a reasonable idea over what those standards are, or else everyone are going to start pulling their hairs out because of something as small as the digits on a runtime listing turning into total crapshoots, which is really no fun at all.

 

 

[Xillix]

6 minutes ago, cookie said:

I feel like if standards like this are suddenly going to be applied people should have a reasonable idea over what those standards are, or else everyone are going to start pulling their hairs out because of something as small as the digits on a runtime listing turning into total crapshoots, which is really no fun at all.

Again the only reason I did it in this case at all was because I felt like it was quite abnormally overstuffed on my first read-through. I'm not saying we're all going to do this, or it's part of the rules. Really I hadn't been putting nearly as much thought into this sort of thing until very recently when my own films received near-identical criticism from other reviewers and I looked for a way to correct that for my own purposes. Then I just re-purposed it to confirm a feeling I already had about another movie.

 

Like I said, not gonna do this for everything, just ones that feel exceptionally strained to me personally, so I feel better about the criticism I woulda been giving anyway. Not gonna point any fingers but I didn't start the fire

 

If we wanted to excise it completely from critical consideration then fine, I understand it's a small detail during the actual writing process, probably more intended to help box office counts by measuring showtimes per day. But if other people are going to specifically call out those numbers as a problem pacing-wise, which they have been for a while, then I'm going to do it too.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Xillix

[Xillix]

And that is a serious offer; if we agree to not count the runtime number for reviews I'll be totally on board because I DID really like reading PoE:tHV a lot more than 2.5 stars indicates. The only condition being that if people go back to doing it anyway I fully reserve the right to call them on their shit.

[4815162342]

16 minutes ago, Xillix said:

I dig the characters! I'll say Aloth is personally my favorite but there is a section of the movie towards the middle where it felt like he sort of faded into the background. Though again I could just be biased because... he was my favorite. You'd just introduced several new characters in any case, so it makes sense. I appreciate that you managed to give a lot of the characters (Eder, Lord and Lady Raedric, and Nedmar especially) their own arcs. Obviously not all of them developed much but look forward to them doing so going forward.

 

If I had two main criticisms character-wise - first, as I said before, there was no explanation of what Aumaua are, so when Kana showed up I got confused and had to Google them; keep that in mind for new character intros in sequels. And second, Sarana feels just a bit passive, being led along by vague feelings and such for most of the film, though it makes sense given that she's just become something totally new to her, in essence. As the main protagonist I assume her arc will be spread more over the films, so that's forgivable. It looked like you were setting up a more substantial arc for Aloth next time around, such as with the reflecting pool scene. I'd like to see that. I think it's a good bet to shift focus/development among small groups of the supporting characters in each film.

 

I don't know anything about the games so I've no idea what's "supposed" to happen between them. The dynamic between Eder and Durance and their conflicting gods has a lot of promise; since you dug into Eder so much in this one it could be good to see more from Durance's side next time. Seemed like you hint at that with the whole "fifteen years of silence" deal. Aloth and Kana have a lot in common, so that seems like fertile ground too; often the people most similar to you in a group are the ones you can wind up in the deepest conflict with.

 

Yeah the biggest character arc of this film was meant to be Eder. Aloth and Durance will get fleshed out more going forward. There's definitely foreshadowing for both of them that I think with Durance in particular could be guessed.

 

Kana is someone who is not developed in the game that much so I might not do too much with him, though having a stable, Team Mom kind of character could be what the band of misfits needs.

 

 

As for descriptions, I didn't want to turn into a series of Wikipedia articles. Aumaua are basically NBA-sized people (6.5-7 feet tall, 250-300 lbs) that have yellow/orange or blue skin depending on their origin. They also don't grow facial hair.

 

But I'll keep things in mind going forward.

[4815162342]

I'll also note that I don't foresee going much higher than this in word count, ever.

 

So there's that.

[cookie]

2 hours ago, Xillix said:

And that is a serious offer; if we agree to not count the runtime number for reviews I'll be totally on board because I DID really like reading PoE:tHV a lot more than 2.5 stars indicates. The only condition being that if people go back to doing it anyway I fully reserve the right to call them on their shit.

Fair enough. I'm not saying people shouldn't do at least a basic time-check on their work (I'm going to run repeated tests with Voltron once it's finished), but the penalty for a movie you otherwise really liked seemed a little harsh to me. I would've kept it to one or half a star penalty myself.

Edited October 3, 2018 by cookie

[Blankments]

I'm curious how you find the plot of Marked Up Time overly complex? It's a simple three-act structure that has a B-plot in act 2 that converges with the A-plot in act 3. 

 

Once all the reviews are out, I plan on doing a post-mortem on MUT because even though I still think it's a great story, I'm not particularly proud of how I told it in CAYOM. Think I learned something interesting here as a writer

[cookie]

10 hours ago, Rorschach said:

Oh then it’s quite under. Scavenger Wars was like 34k or something like that.

TSW is 30,229. The length was in part because I didn’t have the time to trim it down.

Edited October 3, 2018 by cookie