Johnny Tran

Y'all should have never nibbled on the MI7 and Indiana Jones bait. The only reason they are being brought up is to try to minimize what is happening with 'The Marvels' and it's not even the same stratosphere. 'The Marvels' if it doesn't grow some serious legs is going to be one of the biggest Hollywood flops of all time. There's no minimizing it.

I agree but at the same time if you are a studio head and you're tasked with the chore of eliminating $10 Billion in debt or whatever it was, you probably have to do some wild stuff to achieve that goal.

If we want to include the TV shows then let's discuss how She-Hulk was $25M per episode and nobody was watching it and the people who did thought it was a clown show. Or we can talk about Secret Invasion being very expensive and pretty much everyone hating that as well. Loki didn't "save" the MCU from being mostly bad over the last 4 years. Did Wonder Woman or The Suicide Squad change the overall perception of the DCEU? No of course not... they were good movies that were surrounded by issues all over the place. Nobody is saying MCU can't make a good movie. James Gunn just made one a couple months ago but again it was mostly removed from the overall MCU. Deadpool 3 will probably be good too.

Saying "Well, Loki was good so MCU is fine" is hilarious to me. That's like saying 'Peacemaker was fine so I think DC should continue with what they're doing". Changes will be made to the MCU and changes are needed.

And both look great in comparison to 'The Marvels' Lol.

How come none of the regular have stopped by with the actuals?

I don't think it does. I think the whole conversation is a coping mechanism. 'The Marvels' is flopping for a variety of reasons. GOTG vol. 3 just came out this past summer and was a big success for a whole bunch of reasons that has nothing to do with current MCU.

I'm not sure what you mean by "stop putting Marvel content on Disney+" they are Disney... and furthermore, Disney+ is losing money for Disney as well. Lol. It's not a success story with or without Marvel. These are the reasons why their stock is in the tank. How much is it worth to Disney to have their stock drop from $200 per share to $85 per share? It's literally billions in market cap wiped out over the last two years.

Oh.. sorry I read that wrong. Yeah, they hadn't fully caught up to speed on how terrible previews were until like Wednesday when the trackers here had the number between $6-7M for weeks.

Lol...this is not how things work.

I think y'all have to be careful in the belief that everything comic book related is going to drop from previous installments. There's no reason yet to believe that The Batman 2 or Deadpool 3 or anything else is in jeopardy. Nobody asked for or wanted "The Marvels" apparently and MCU overall had been on a bit of a downward spiral. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3. was somewhat removed from current MCU as it really was just it's own thing and that did not see a worldwide decrease from previous movies.

I'm not arguing with you just questioning why you think Deadline would want to soften the blow for Disney/Marvel? By the way, I don't think it can get $55M.

It's hard to fire a coach who has 4 or 5 rings. Yes, it's possible that the game has surpassed them and they'll never get their mojo back but because of what they've accomplished for the franchise they are going to get more time to fix things than some nobody who has never done anything. Feige is going to get the chance to fix this.

I don't think this is me harping on critics when I say that a lot of bloggers who are now RT critics tend to give comic book movies a pass or are at least more forgiving. 'The Flash' had terrible WOM but it's sitting at 63% on RT, 'The Marvels' was rotten but now it's crawled it's way back up to 61%. My suggestion is if you care at all about the RT scores and how they might compare with the GA but don't want to read the everyday blogger, then maybe look at the Top Critics instead. 'The Marvels' is 44% with Top Critics which seems to match closer to the early WOM on the movie.

Also, does anyone think $50M+ is possible? If it matches 'Eternals' it could get to $50M on the nose. I'm still seeing some people hopeful for $55M.

Can we stop with the exaggerated "Marvel isn't going out of business, guys!" posts? Who has said that the MCU is over or that they are going to stop producing content? All I've seen is that people feel some changes should be made and these numbers seem to support that notion.

Don't you mean pull up a chair and fire up the popcorn?

1, Burn off all your goodwill through 4 years of bad movies, terrible shows and cancellations/postponements of things people might have cared about. 2. No plan or story arc leading up to the next big thing (CM sandwiched between IW and EG)

To piggyback off of @Krissykins Deadline reported that sources have the preview number at $6.5M same as @charlie Jatinder

I'm seeing some people say that MCU hasn't been on a rough patch and that this is the first true bomb. I think there's a couple different ways to look at it. I do believe 'Eternals' lost money so right off the bat I can't say this is the first bomb. I think Ant-Man 3 also lost money or it was very close to losing money. Just looking at the worldwide total of $470M I'm not sure how it got to profitability off a $200M budget and P&A. But that's all besides the point. Ant-Man 3 was supposed to setup Kang Dynasty and it did a horrendous job of it. Whether you agree that it bombed financially, it certainly bombed critically and was received poorly by audiences. The Marvels is supposed to be a big follow up to the MCU's version of Wonder Woman. Just as 1984 killed off a potential 3rd movie for her, I think this kills off Captain Marvel as a viable superhero woman character moving forward. She will probably be relegated to the background. Secret Invasion was also a complete disaster and we have to include that because the shows go hand in hand with the movie universe. If you look at what's done really well, GOTG vol. 3 and that was Gunn's last movie for the MCU so there's not much to build on there. There's also not much to build off with the latest Spider-Man movie, it felt like an event that is 75% removed from the MCU.

So we are no longer taking Charlie and others numbers at their word?

I don't love the comparison but if you are including Joker sequels and The Batman sequel DC does have two proven draws coming up along with Gunn's Superman and all it takes is 2 or 3 hits to change public perception. Imagine all three of those projects are box office winners and critically acclaimed. The attitude is no longer "DC needs to..." it changes to "DC has been on a good run." The MCU could go on a nice run and change their current perception but I'm not sure which projects right now look like a winner.

Can Disney make Tom Holland the face of the MCU while everything has to go through Sony? It's incredible that they never ponied up the money to get Spider-Man back from Sony in full, I'm positive there was a number that Sony would have accepted especially considering they were going through financial turmoil of their own. That's only a small part of the issue moving forward from Downey Jr. and Evans. They had no plan or a plan in place that casuals would care about moving forward. The Infinity Saga kept people coming back. They weren't all good movies. Some of them were quite bad but it was easy to digest because of what was on the horizon. There was something BIG to look forward to and they nailed it. The Russos and company nailed the finale. But the thing that kept everyone interested was the huge overlapping story arc and all the familiar characters. I think another thing that has happened is Marvel has gotten way too overconfident in their ability to deliver C and D-List characters to the masses. James Gunn hit a grand slam with GOTG. He also hit a home run with TSS/Peacemaker. But he's the common denominator there. That's his thing. I don't believe just anyone can get casual audiences to care about these deep cuts.

It's frankly, uncommon that a big tentpole movie's weekend thread would be locked for this long. Presale numbers are out. I'm guess the moderators are afraid of what the thread is going to look like but all they have to do is thread ban people who get out of hand. Noting how something is flopping isn't "flaming". I have to give credit to the trackers once again. They were on the $6-7M number for previews weeks ago.