TerwillikerInst

I think they thought they could get a Top Gun 2-type reaction, but the key difference is that Top Gun 2 already had some positive buzz and buzz is the currency of film festivals. Film Festivals are really no different to comic conventions in that regard, a lot of people go in already hyped for stuff or dreading it, and the responses they give out reflect that pre-existing desire 80% of the time. I don't doubt that this movie tested high internally, but a lot of that might be because it's very much not a "breaking the mould" type of movie. At least, that's the impression I get here. It's safe and fanservicey and that could translate well to WOM (the VFX is probably not that much if an issue, people regularly sit through Marvel and Fast and Furious movies that look worse). Critical miscalculation though to mistake fan love with critical love.

Thinking back on it, this is probably the major problem with these legacy sequels, it's not just that you're dealing with the inherent seque desire to just do the same movie again- But now you also have the weird faux-reverence from producers and audiences of "doing right by the franchise" and treating the original IP and their hazy memories of it, as holy writ. It's just not healthy.

idk, it feels like over the years people have conjured up an image of the Indiana Jones movies as these kinda dark and gritty action movies when they are very lighthearted whacky goofs. All of Indy's coolness is basically set up so when the movie continually undercuts him, it's even more satisfying. Even his famous introduction scene in Raiders has him: - totally make the wrong call to bypass the golden idol's trap/- making the terrible decision to throw Satipo the idol/- allowing Belloq to steal the idol from him while confirming that this is also not the first time he's done it to Indy/- followed by Indy being chased by natives in a total blind panic/- capped off with him screaming hysterically when he finds a non-poisonous snake Even the scary stuff is fun scary, the Nazis' faces melting, the Kali sacrifice, Donovan's death etc The only thing that ever comes across as actively dark with no sense of fun is some of the mine torture stuff in TOD, and even Lucas/Spielberg admitted that was way too off tonally for the series. My biggest concern with DOD has always been that it will try too hard to be like the imagined version of Indiana Jones conjured up by people who saw them young, and not an actual follow-up to what they were. :Edit: It's also why I would never want to be the one in charge of making a sequel. You're not just dealing with the "if the previous movies didn't do it, then it 'logically' it shouldn't happen in the franchise universe" brigade, but also people who think that the type of stuff that totally happened in the previous movies, did not.

There's also the issue for Disney (as seen on Guardians 3) that critics are done giving these movies easy rides, so building good WOM from general audiences is essential.

meh, always thought this was going to have pretty much the opposite journey as KOTCS. That movie started out with glowing reviews and reception and then they got worse and worse. Which makes sense, it was starting from a position of strength and people wanted to like it, this is the exact opposite. But tbh, barring anything truly disastrous (which I'll grant is a possibility) like WOM being bad because the action scenes are terrible or folks not latching onto Indiana in this movie, I think it'll do just fine. Most of the criticism is based around it being too fanservicey and not taking enough risks which aren't exactly audience turnoffs for legacy sequels. :Edit: They also did themselves no favours releasing it at a film festival where movie reception (more than any other place) is determined by the general buzz around a project before it releases. If a movie is already highly anticipated, it will get a ton of love. And vice versa.

First photos from the filming. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-12098693/Beetlejuice-2-LOOK-Winona-Ryder-51-transforms-Lydia-Deetz.html

It's kinda funny how this franchise has sold itself on "all practical" and "no CGI" so well that now any hint of VFX work is a much bigger deal than it would be for other movie series. Especially since (and this is fairly well known within the industry) these movies use a TON of CGI.

Exactly like what happened with streaming too. It was inevitable that some form of it would be integrated into the business eventually. But studios were so dazzled by tech moguls and the dream of infinite growth/no numbers accountability that they almost destroyed the entire ecosystem of Hollywood in the frenzy to immediately switch over.

There are also the three Doctor Who specials launching in November which would put them right between the end of Loki's run and Echo's. Though in fairness, I don't know if they'll be that big a priority for Disney since they were already funded by the BBC before the deal and just acquired by Disney when they got the rights to the followup seasons.

Yeah. Like, not to date it too much, but even just this specific sequel attempt originally started out being written by the "Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter" guy and had Chloë Grace Moretz in the daughter role.

tbh- I think it's guys like Burton who were hurt the most by the death of the non-IP mid-budget film. Hollywood has slowly turned into a place where you either have original movies that cost basically no money and that you have to break your back making (especially if they're high-concept) or insanely expensive IP blockbusters. The whole point of the mid-budget movie was to have a place where you could have most of the production comforts of a blockbuster but without the huge budget-bloating need for stunts/effects etc. Like, people have forgotten that a mid-budget movie looks more like Beetlejuice (roughly $40 million, today) than Everything Everywhere All At Once ($14 million). So while a guy like Burton could work 22-hour shooting days to get a movie done in 4 weeks doing all his own special effects with some buddies... it probably isn't happening. He's not alone either, there are so many great 80/90s studio talents Sonnenfeld/Noyce/Campbell etc who haven't even been lucky enough to get offered the big soulless IP gigs.

100%. I've been banging this drum for ages now, and the more stuff he does, the clearer it becomes that he's just salting the mine with gold dust before he unloads it on some buyer. Like, announcing a slew of insanely expensive brand new LOTR movies, a brand new DC Universe, and new Harry Potter-stuff is kind of an odd thing to do for a company which is in debt and still technically losing money. Those IPs haven't exactly been gaining in value in the past few years so he needs to juice them up a bit just long enough for someone to buy them. Hell, some will probably not have any big money put into them before the sale happens. That's probably why he hired Gunn and is giving him a lot of leeway. He knows that by the time it actually gets going in earnest, it won't be his problem anymore. Even doing this lavish 100 Years Celebration while also actively gutting WB suddenly makes more sense when you realize that he wants to keep the brand name and library looking valuable. Now, it is possible he changes his mind? Maybe, I guess. But I don't see it. He's a used car dealer. And a used car dealer doesn't buy up a creaking old wreck just so he can spend decades lovingly restoring it back to its former glory.

It's genuinely amazing how Hollywood studios' ability to sell a movie has atrophied so thanks to the ever-increasing expansion of IP blockbusters. Like, getting the word out by doing early screenings and making sure the positive WOM gets spread is not some crazy newfangled experimental marketing technique. They've been playing on easy mode for so long and eventually, this is going to happen to every other franchise too.

Not to mention the fact that Paramount also has a financial stake in Indy 5.

This. The combo of streaming and the ever-increasing focus on IP blockbusters have made studios forget how to properly make money from a movie/make it stick in the public's mind, if they're not playing on easy mode.

Interesting change in aspect ratio here. Could be cropped but might also indicate that this wasn't shot on 70mm? idk :Edit: Since it's carrying over so much else from Belfast, I'm beginning to wonder if it's even shot on film.

Also, so many of these directors actively can't be bothered to learn how to actually design and shoot VFX sequences. They'll just film the actors doing whatever on a bluescreen and then have the VFX teams pick up the slack in post, usually requiring them to completely change everything in the shot.

Yeah. If they're building exterior sets now then the rumoured May/June filming date is probably correct which gives them plenty of time to finish shooting the movie before the end of the year and allows an 8-10 month post window. I could see them maybe holding it back for the early Holiday season, though.

tbh- I would expect something closer to 'remastered' video games. Where they update the graphics to a 2020s standard and keep the soundtrack, maybe add in some new lines or something by using AI to de-age the cast's voices. idk, I don't want this to happen, but it feels extremely plausible.

Hollywood's dirty little secret is that pretty much every studio movie that got a proper theatrical release followed by home video and tv/cable sales, turned a profit. Even the massive flops, eventually. Budgets are fudged because it lets them decide whether or not the movie was "a hit", "underperformed", "flopped", or "broke even" on their balance sheets. It's only now in the era of pointlessly bloated megabudgets* for MCU-style films, combined with burning money on streaming services, that studios have gotten into the habit of writing off basically everything they release just to make the stock line go up. And surprise, surprise, they've realized it's not a workable model. *Seriously, if you know anything about film production and effects work, that money is so clearly not up there on the screen.

The only way this movie doesn't signify a total disaster for the MCU if it opens as low as some people are predicting (and bearing in mind, that is still just hypothetical for now) would be dependant the kind of reviews and audience reception it gets. If fewer people go to see it on opening weekend but it has great word of mouth and or solid legs then it might be worth it taking the hit for those other MCU movies if it manages to get people back on board.

Oh yeah, of course. I just meant it didn't necessarily have to be stylized in that specific way. Though in my ideal world, it probably would be something similar. 50s gleaming bright 'modernist' metal and chrome with Gotham as its dark smoke encrusted decrepit gothic twin is the way to go imo.

There's a good chance of course that Georgia is just being used because it's in America and cheap and the movie will use second-unit shots and CGI to make it look like somewhere else. Still though, I hope this doesn't mean it's going to look like a boring regular modern-day city. It doesn't necessarily have to be some kind of gleaming art deco throwback but it would be nice if they at least did something to avoid the MCU effect of everywhere on Earth looking and feeling like downtown Atlanta. :edit: It's also kind of weird they aren't shooting this in the UK since nearly all of DC's recent major movies have been filmed at the WB studios in Leavesden. Nobody wants to film in LA because of the cost, and because of that, studio space outside there is at such a premium right now. So it's odd WB is passing up the opportunity to film at the giant studio complex they own outright. I'd say Gunn probably just wants to keep the production as close to LA as he can, but in that case, you'd film in somewhere like Vancouver (where he did Peacemaker). I guess he must have just had a good experience doing TSS and GOTG there,

In fairness, the only reason WBD is doing any of this is because Zaslav is looking to sell pronto so he's just salting the mine with some gold flakes before he offers it to buyers. Why do you think they announced more LOTR movies, a brand new DC Universe, and new Harry Potter-stuff despite the fact that WB is saddled with debt and losing money? Those IPs haven't exactly been gaining in value in the past few years so he needs to juice them up a bit just long enough for someone to buy them. Even doing this lavish 100 Years Celebration while also actively gutting WB suddenly makes more sense when you realize that he wants to keep the brand name and library looking valuable.