JWR
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Posts posted by JWR
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Ezra Miller was a liability from almost every conceivable angle:
Their legal issues and controversies made them completely toxic from a PR standpoint. They couldn't do interviews, advertisements, or any kind of promotional materials.
Even going with the "general public doesn't know about Miller or their scandals" argument, that's still not helpful because Miller is not a well known presence and lacks the star power to draw people in.
The last time we saw Flash in the movies was the much maligned Justice League where he was a secondary character. Not exactly a major selling point.
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1 minute ago, IronJimbo & Sheldon's Son said:
Best case scenario for Elemental is not bombing as hard as The Flash, neither are gonna break even but Elemental could do well OS. Something like 130:160 for 290m WW for The Flash versus 120:200 for Elemental and maybe it can come close to break-even on streaming. At least the marketing budget should be less than Flash's lmao.
Yeah. My optimistic prediction is that Elemental proves that the Pixar brand still has some strength among families and that it's an important stepping stone for future movies to be more successful.
Maybe it'll have a second life on streaming and make some profit via home video sales.
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Will this lead to the movie profiting? Probably not. But, it shows that the movie will have more staying power than Lightyear.
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42 minutes ago, Madhuvan said:
The fall of WB and Disney is just on another level
They do get success here and there but overall they both are struggling while Universal, Sony and Paramount are winning
Paramount: Babylon, Dungeons and Dragons, Paws of Fury
Universal: Spirit Untamed, Easter Sunday, Renfield, and (soon) Ruby Gillman.
Sony: Morbius, Devotion, I Wanna Dance With Somebody, etc.
They might not have as many recent Ls as Disney and WB, but they're not exactly in that much of a better spot. The box office is still recovering.
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Probably won't turn the box office around, but it IS a sign that it'll have some staying power.
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It is what it is. My only consolation is that will have better word of mouth than Lightyear and will hopefully be remembered more fondly in hindsight.
I do see it having a second life on home video.
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Just now, excel1 said:
Need to stop speaking such broad generalized terms. Joaquin Phoenix as Joker was huge boost to its explosion. Zendaya 100% helps her IP films. etc etc etc. The potential spectrum for this film is huge.
Need a cast that has direct appeal to generation z. It is what it is.
All that does is prove my point that having well known names in a superhero/comic book movie helps. It definitely helped in the case of Joaquin Phoenix as Joker. Though it's important to consider that the Joker is Batman’s most well known villain.
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3 minutes ago, excel1 said:
That isn't true whatsoever and you aren't the casual moviegoer that they need to excite.
It is true, though. The character is the draw for the casual moviegoer, not the actor playing them. Though it does help if they're played by someone famous or well known.
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12 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:
Yeah this is going to SDCC. Likely Fantastic Four as well.
I see a compromise where they announce one big casting and reveal everyone else at SDCC.
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5 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:
I would think they’d just wait until Comic Con at this point.
Gotta do something to mitigate the PR about Flash's numbers.
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Uneven and messy in the third act, but I really dug it. Even got emotional at some parts, too. Solid 7 out of 10.
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10 minutes ago, Johnny Tran said:
That's going to happen because it's an origin movie. (I know he said it isn't an origin but it sounds like it'll be close) vs. the 3rd part of a much beloved trilogy.
WBD should be viewing the new Superman through the Batman Begins lens. A good movie that sets the table for the rest.
Gunn has confirmed that it won't be an origin story.
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3 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:
I’ve said this before, but again, WW and AM managed to be breakout hits, and even the first Suicide Squad did really well, despite awful reviews, and having immediately followed BvS.
Snyder left back in 2017. He had nothing to do with the creative decisions made during Walter Hamada’s tenure. You can’t keep using him as a convenient scapegoat.
Wonder Woman and Aquaman are exceptions, not the norm. The former had favorable and strong word of mouth, while the latter was a big dumb fun adventure movie had the advantage of coming out during Christmas. Everything else post Justice League has been the studio trying to salvage what's left of the DCEU.
You are correct that the previous regime at WB bears most of the responsibility, but Snyder is not a blameless, nor is he a convenient scapegoat. He drove the train off the tracks, but WB put him in the driver's seat.
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3 minutes ago, ChipDerby said:
I want to be realistic and say my OW expectation for this would be $120 mil. (Though Man of Steel inflated would be $150 mil)
But the box office landscape can change between now and then.
$80-100M is my realistic prediction. Might go up or down depending on WOM and production news.
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Just now, Unfitclock said:
@JWR so we’re probably looking at an opening in the 30s
Seems like it, but we'll have a clearer picture tomorrow.
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5 minutes ago, Unfitclock said:
Is there a chance elemental has really strong walkups and gets to 40 plus opening weekend
Not impossible, but reaching that won't be easy. It's only chance is to hope for strong audience word of mouth and families with young children.
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Seeing this in 6.5 hours. Still looking forward to it.
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27 minutes ago, KGPatt2 said:
If they had released the Ultimate Cut of BvS and the Ayer Cut of Suicide Squad in theaters and not brought in Whedon for Justice League, then everything would have been fine IMO. But they cut BvS down and then panicked and it all collapsed on itself. Not saying the Ultimate Cut is even good and who really knows what the Ayer Cut would look like, but I'd be willing to bet it's far superior to what we got. Without going full awful on those 2 and simply getting movies that are fine, then Wonder Woman does even more to help propel into Zach Snyder's Justice League and this universe, while not on the level of the MCU, is making good money and running a solid 2nd as opposed to being in full scramble mode for 6 years.
I get Snyder's vision wasn't for everyone and this is not a popular opinion, but the decisions made by executives in 2016 is what caused the majority of these problems.
I'm sorry, but that couldn't be more wrong.
The Ultimate Edition of BvS would have had the exact same reception as the theatrical cut. It's more coherent, but it still has all the elements that audiences disliked about Snyder's vision: The morose tone, the questionable characterizations, etc. Same movie, just longer and it would have made less because of that runtime.
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2 hours ago, Mulder said:
How does like every DC thread on here become the Zack Snyder debate club thread.
Because a lot of the woes plaguing WB, and the DC brand specifically, can be traced back to WB making him the architect of the DCEU.
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14 hours ago, Cmasterclay said:
I'll add even further on to that - given his combination of domineering style plus mediocre results in his previous films, it was always a bad choice to hire him in the first place. I said as much at the time but then the amazing Man of Steel trailers tricked me.
It did have compelling trailers.
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16 minutes ago, AJG said:
I stand by my opinion tat ZSJL was great and only needs to be trimmed to maybe 2.5 hours (instead of 4). If I had time I would do it myself.
Good movie, better movie than the theatrical cut. But it would have flopped in 2017 all the same.
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10 minutes ago, Cmasterclay said:
Most of this could have been corrected if they had just realized Zach Snyder was bad after BvS and started from scratch on Justice League with the same actors and a clear visual changeover.
I'll add onto that: They should have ditched or reigned in Snyder after the polarizing reception of Man of Steel. Instead they only let him double down on everything that made that movie so divisive.
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5 minutes ago, WebSurfer said:
Eh, quality-wise, I’m trying to remain optimistic.
But, BO wise, not sure what they were thinking…
My guess is they were thinking that this looked like a guaranteed dud that they could afford to take a loss on.
Father’s Day/Juneteenth Weekend Thread | Flash implodes with 55M, Elemental bombs with 29M, holdovers hold atrociously | Theaters are dead, streaming is dead. Everything is dead really.
in Numbers and Data
Posted
Alas. Their only hope now is to mitigate the damage.