toutvabien

Well, opening to $70-80M would already have been very very strong for Barbie. It's part of an IP sure, but one that has never been tested this way. It's a known IP turned into a four quadrant comedy. If the Barbie made $200M domestic and $400M worldwide, it would still be a hit. The fact that it massively outperformed these expectations turned into a phenomenon. The MCU just had a six-film streak of $100M+ openings and that mostly included sub-franchises that never had installments make money like the first Captain Marvel did. There's a very different set of expectations. The Marvels opening to that kind of range would not mean the same thing it would mean for Barbie if it also opened to $70-80M. Heck, Shang-Chi and Eternals opening to that range, even if there were no pandemic behind it, would not mean the same thing as The Marvels opening to that range.

Looks awkward, not sexy or funny.

Has the industry/Disney tracking been discussed here? They threw out a $70-90M range for opening weekend.

Kelly Marie Tran too.

I don't think Feige and co are unaware that they "botched" the introduction of Carol in the universe. Not to invalidate your guys' experiences of having your critiques lumped up with the incels' pure misogyny - the volume of their hate was too strong after all and I can't begin to image how Larson felt by videos in 2019 literally analyzing her body language to prove that her castmates loathe her/as an example to avoid in socialization - but they changed up direction and creative team. Some were arguing (pages ago) that they took too many notes from Larson when it came to how this sequel was formed. Is it too little too late? Has the output of the past years of the MCU made it too little too late? Probably, that's what even an opening in the 90s would confirm to me. But idk, based on what we have seen and what DaCosta has said, they have given Carol layers and complex dynamics this time around. As the type of fan who forced myself to finish Secret Invasion, I'm excited to see that.

Timing, momentum and placement of a film or film franchise definitely plays a role in critical and fan reception. The quality of their output has killed the momentum, but the lack of momentum actively invites more negative critique/less passing grades. The low points of the past saga aren't all that better than the low points of the current one, but none of them got as dragged.

Don't know if I necessarily agree with the point of making this a Secret Invasion film instead of what we're getting. However, since Dar-Benn's whole point is that she has a personal vendetta against Carol, because of "unintended consequences of her actions as the intergalactic super-powered protector" which adds up thematically to how her responsibilities as a hero have also kept her apart from Monica all those years, it would have been more impactful if Skrulls were seeking for revenge and reparations from her. I know they already did that with Fury in SI, but Carol is referenced in that very show as just as responsible. Feels like there is an in-universe thread already written involving a powerful, rising force that wants to get back to Captain Marvel, connecting to the first film and the lore of the Skrulls in the MCU, but from what they've shown, it's probably gonna get a small mention in the actual film.

I've said this before in this thread, but we never really got to wonder when we're gonna be seeing those characters next. We had a basic idea. Thor and Cap debuted in 2011 and by the end of the saga they had 7 appearances each. There was a point in time when not seeing Thor in Civil War after Age of Ultron and getting back to him with Ragnarok felt like a notable wait. You got rewarded fairly fast for investing into most of those characters - the only exception being the Hulk. Even Nick Fury was popping off once every two years. Maybe this translates to something more specific, maybe it's the nature of a successful cinematic universe and they only were able to continue doing that because of its success, so it can't really be a cause to that success IG. But it's one element that feels crazy to think about now.

This thread has straight up turned into speculation on just how much this bombing will change the MCU. Watch this do polarizing okay numbers and Marvel just sticking to the changes they have already been teasing since the beginning of the year.

The Shang-Chi erasure

Blade does kind of feel like Marvel's Flash at this point, but the creative team attached rn is too good. Plus they were Born Againig it right before the strike. Well, not literally, as they hadn't shot anything. The THR article did refer to Wonder Man as an upcoming series, I haven't heard anything about it being scrapped. More movies could use that in general.

The evolution and journey of the word that has led it to be used in reference to products that cost the GPD of a small country - whether in positive or negative lightning, to advertise or slander - is unserious. I wouldn't call it "the word's new/current meaning" because there are probably still some contexts out there where it has mainted its roots.

Anyone who calls products that cost the GPD of a small country in any shape or form "woke" is being unserious, especially when we're talking about the franchise led by an ex air-force pilot character.

As chaotic as The Marvels WW < Captain Marvel DOM sounds, I don't see it happening.

Secret Invasion actually had 461M minutes watched in its first five days vs 418M for Moon Knight, tho the episode was 10 minutes longer, so when you do the math, that's actually a few more people who watched MK. But damn, they weren't even that far apart at first. Biggest suprise is honestly that She-Hulk actually did quite well, 4B minutes is good, considering how short the episodes were.

This is acknowledged in the article. At the same time, Marvel and Star Wars are supposed to be the big draws on the platform. Hence why they are all amongst the most expensive seasons of TV ever. Also worth noting that Disney+ is on a downwards trajectory in general and there are obvious reasons why people would be streaming more in the vast majority of 2021 compared to late that year, last year and this year.

Interesting graphic from the THR Daredevil/Marvel TV article on the performance of the shows, including Ms. Marvel. Feels relevant in the thread.

Where did you get that 50% figure from? The last trailer has more views than the last GotG trailer and not far off the one from Quantumania.

Starting to feel like this may be closer to The Flash rather than the first Aquaman in % of female audiences.

They better female gaze the shit out of the Park Seo-joon character, push the Disney Princess-y vibe of his thing with Carol, get this to blow up on fem TikTok and get a thirst watch "WoM" boost.

Eh, I don't think the title/brand change had to do with doubt on Captain Marvel's appeal. Did they add the Wasp in the Ant-Man brand because they thought Ant-Man himself wasn't big enough? Hope hasn't been relevant since that second film. Guess it brought in more % of female audiences than the other ones, but still. I think it's a case of Marvel just relying on their overall brand power, across movies and deciding to be more comic booky and creative with titles and branding. They have even recently embraced different forms of titles, such as Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings and Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, which are closer to comic book naming rather than big Hollywood blockbuster naming, a.k.a adding subtitles to sequels. Captain Marvel: Secret Invasion would be a whole other movie than the one they made here. They wanted to include these other women who have either been Captain Marvel in the comics before Carol was a thing (Monica) or were created in response to the character and to reclaim her old name (Kamala); they are all deeply connected in their comic history, so it makes sense to have them cross roads within the established Captain Marvel franchise. But The Marvels is a nerdy title. It's the type of title you give when you have the momentum that guarantess success. Now they find themselves in a position in which they could use the help of more marketable branding, a.k.a. generic Captain Marvel subtitle sequel.

I laughed at the suggestion that the title was gonna harm this in any way just weeks ago. But if this gets great reviews and still opens below $100m, I'll have admit that maybe it played a bigger role than I originally thought it could. An interesting thought I had is that if they advertized this as a Captain Marvel 2 and then Monica and Kamala (in the eyes of GA, a Captain Marvel superfan they wouldn't have seen before) getting significant co-lead roles may have backfired and have people complain that it wasn't Carol focused enough. With this title, it's more likely that people are surprised by how much Carol-focused it actually is and build buzz for that.

That featurette has some of the best shots they have shown yet off the movie. Would be funny if Marvel dropped two of their best looking films (and Loki S2, which looks fucking beautiful) the same year as Quantumania.

Interesting that neither of the spots released today are like the leaked, longer one, with the voice over AND how Carol focused they are. I don't know how to read pre-sales in general, but we're in a kind of new era of Marvel movies getting more and more backloaded. What's actually crazy is how quickly that happened. Phase 4 carried on the goodwill and momentum of the previous saga and even earlier this year, Quantumania managed to open past $100M despite the worst reviews, reactions and buzz ever for a Marvel movie, causing it to lose steam even before release. The two subsequent films, installments of more popular sub-franchises, do no longer have that security. Even if they manage to replicate the late fan screening/great buzz of Guardians 3, The Marvels won't open much higher. It could act as a good building block to secure getting back to the kind of momentum they used to have. If the floor of Guardians 3 was already sub $90M, I wouldn't be too shocked if it's even lower for this one, despite my overall optimism for this film's performance. And yea, in the context of this film, a $75-80M opening would be no good news at all. And the floor can go lower for future releases, if that's the case. If Marvel fails to build back momentum, I really don't see the next bunch of Avengers movies getting close to Age of Ultron numbers.

How many hours left till tickets go on sale?