JUSTICE LEAGUE | 427.2 M overseas ● 654.4 M worldwide

[ZeeSoh]

Just now, Brainiac5 said:

@ZeeSoh I found the problem

The next two weeks will decide the fate of the Justice League movie. It’ll open in Japan and Pakistan later this week and debuts in Lebanon on the 30th. The film should be over/under $325 million worldwide as of yesterday, with a solid $10.55m Tuesday in North America for a new $111.9m five-day cume. At least it has already passed Green Lantern and Catwoman.

 

 

Can you clarify what is the problem there? Are you referring to the over/under 325m part?

[mredman]

2 minutes ago, Squadron Leader Tele said:

@Jay Hollywood works in the biz. He may not have access to specific numbers (since neither he nor I work for the inner circle of WB), but I wouldn't discount what he says.

Deadline said 700 million it will get in profit land. We should not discount that either though. And if it did cost 300million then they do not only hinge on BO money to make a profit. You also said that i believe yesterday no big blockbuster movie does that.

[Dementeleus]

4 minutes ago, Jay Hollywood said:

 

I gave the movie a thumbs up. I liked it more than Thor 3. 

 

I waited in line 4 hours for MOS midnight before preview showings, thought it was gonna be great. The DCEU has been shitty. But as we speak I'm sitting in a room with 8 batman posters soooooooooo 

 

But there have been 9 modern-era Batman movies, sooooooo why do you hate him so much?

[Mr Impossible]

5 minutes ago, Brainiac5 said:

@ZeeSoh I found the problem

The next two weeks will decide the fate of the Justice League movie. It’ll open in Japan and Pakistan later this week and debuts in Lebanon on the 30th. The film should be over/under $325 million worldwide as of yesterday, with a solid $10.55m Tuesday in North America for a new $111.9m five-day cume. At least it has already passed Green Lantern and Catwoman.

 

 

Maybe it can do well in Pakistan considering it's doing really well in Asia. 

[Dementeleus]

Just now, mredman said:

Deadline said 700 million it will get in profit land. We should not discount that either though. And if it did cost 300million then they do not only hinge on BO money to make a profit. You also said that i believe yesterday no big blockbuster movie does that.

 

WB may not lose money in the long run. But that's hardly an amazing thing when this was supposed to be their tentpole of all tentpoles. 

 

Put it another way: The HOBBITs were considered a mild disappointment and every single one of them grossed 900m+ WW. Each of them also likely cost less than JL did.

 

Averting a horrific financial disaster by only being a disappointment isn't the sort of thing WB set out to achieve here.

[Fullbuster]

2 minutes ago, Squadron Leader Tele said:

 

WB may not lose money in the long run. But that's hardly an amazing thing when this was supposed to be their tentpole of all tentpoles. 

 

Put it another way: The HOBBITs were considered a mild disappointment and every single one of them grossed 900m+ WW. Each of them also likely cost less than JL did.

 

Averting a horrific financial disaster by only being a disappointment isn't the sort of thing WB set out to achieve here.

 

JL was a billion grosser, it had everything to do it.

 

Beauty and the Beast 2017 went beyond $1B, don't forget it.

[Barnack]

18 minutes ago, mredman said:

it isnt at all. Teamupmovies is not new anymore so the big openings for those do not Avengers 1 numbers anymore. Also Deadline did say 700 million would get it in profit land. Even Tele yesterday said JL will get in profit and eventually earn money. Jay is twisting everything around. Also it earned money on Product placement which he does not calculate in his numbers either. Fores even say 700 million will get this in profit

Product placement earning tend to (like tax credit) be included in the net budget numbers people talk about and they are not necessarily giant, one franchise with the best product placement of all time are the James Bond movie, being the official smarthphone used by James Bond and having him doing publicity with it outside the movie sold for 5m in money (50m in ads paid by the smarthphone company, that is were the money usually is, in a bigger marketing campaign for the movie, not in cash) and for big names part of that money goes to the actor that has to do the ads/accept to "lower" itself doing publicity in is movies, not all of it goes to the movie.

 

One thing that is hard to talk about profit for a movie like Justice league, is that it probably will with merchandise, but it will be hard to isolate that movie effect on world sales on a on going franchise like that (versus a new movie or a dormant franchise revived by a movie like Ghostbuster were you can compare merchandise sales the last 5 year's versus the year and the movie and the 2 following year in a easier way).

 

It is not that Jay is twisting everything around or contradicting Tele, las t year WB made 1700 million in operating income.

 

Having their biggest flagship title loosing 20m or doing 20m in profits, is not a big distinction between the 2, yes doing 40m more in one scenario is nice, but that about the same difference than doing 200m or 240m in profit on it, the above or below the profit line (that do not take into account inflation and time) is not a big distinction.

 

Often a movie accounting sheet will have a :

RETURN THRESHOLD (the expected profit) and the actual profit will be talked in margin with this and not with the break even line, and if that line for justice league was 215m, doing 20m in profit will show minus 195m, a 20m loss will show minus 235m, both in the red, both not that different. 

[Dementeleus]

14 minutes ago, mredman said:

Deadline said 700 million it will get in profit land. We should not discount that either though. And if it did cost 300million then they do not only hinge on BO money to make a profit. You also said that i believe yesterday no big blockbuster movie does that.

 

That's true, but the Forbes breakdown (which seems reasonable to me) also shows it's a long hard slog to break-even at best.

[mredman]

6 minutes ago, Squadron Leader Tele said:

 

That's true, but the Forbes breakdown (which seems reasonable to me) also shows it's a long hard slog to break-even at best.

true but that article was when it will do 635 million. We will see where it ends up

Edited November 22, 2017 by mredman

[Brainiac5]

26 minutes ago, ZeeSoh said:

Can you clarify what is the problem there? Are you referring to the over/under 325m part?

Yes as he never gives a  definite  Number.

Some just went with the 325 but it can very well be closer to 340mil.

We just will not know until things are clear.

[Barnack]

21 minutes ago, mredman said:

Deadline said 700 million it will get in profit land. We should not discount that either though. And if it did cost 300million then they do not only hinge on BO money to make a profit. You also said that i believe yesterday no big blockbuster movie does that.

No one here is talking about only BO money, calculating rental is a good way to start (after that you use a percentage, a big movie like that will do at best 40% of is money from box office in 2017 I would imagine at worst over 50%). You are right that outside freak movie Star wars/Age of ultron type, IT, Get Out, etc..., movies are still in the red after theatrical.

 

Everyone here is fully considering all the direct revenues avenue (airlines, dvds, streaming, soundtrack, TV) here in this evaluation of success/failure, maybe not the harder to estimate impact on ongoing Justice league products, but just because it is too hard (and they could be negative, sometime you can overproduce merchandise because of how much are sold close to release date and you want to be ready that you get stuck with them).

[Dementeleus]

4 minutes ago, mredman said:

true but that article was when it will do 635 million. We will see where it ends up

 

If you're arguing that it can ultimately turn a profit, I don’t disagree. All I’m saying is that this is not what WB wanted or expected for one of its crown jewel tentpoles. 

[Subzero]

4 minutes ago, Squadron Leader Tele said:

 

If you're arguing that it can ultimately turn a profit, I don’t disagree. All I’m saying is that this is not what WB wanted or expected for one of its crown jewel tentpoles. 

But I don't think for one minute that WB is expecting 1B for this ...we fans do ...but I doubt WB think so.

This was a troubled production since day 1 ...with so many issues .....dissapointed (YES) but WB will be happy with any profit they can get from this. Also they are quite content that they have setup these characters for solo outing, and the characters were not the problem ...and most folks are quite happy with them.

 

Edited November 22, 2017 by Subzero

[Brainiac5]

40 minutes ago, Subzero said:

You did and he did answer that it wasn't included, I remember seeing it in the JL thread or the Monday Thread.

I knew I remembered him saying it.

[Dementeleus]

2 minutes ago, Subzero said:

But I don't think for one minute that WB is expecting 1B for this ...we fans do ...but I doubt WB think so.

This was a troubled production since day 1 ...with so many issues .....dissapointed (YES) but WB will be happy with any profit they can get from this. Also they are quite content that they have setup these characters for solo outing, and the characters were not the problem ...and most folks are quite happy with them.

 

 

WB didn’t launch the DCEU with the intent of breaking even, c’mon now. Even after BVS, there was every expectation this would be a significant blockbuster (by them and everyone else).

[ZeeSoh]

48 minutes ago, Subzero said:

You did and he did answer that it wasn't included, I remember seeing it in the JL thread or the Monday Thread.

Err. No he didnt. I just posted the relevant posts, did you just ignore that? If you want you can go to Rth's profile and look through his posts. 

[Brainiac5]

2 minutes ago, ZeeSoh said:

Err. No he didnt. I just posted the relevant posts, did you just ignore that? If you want you can go to Rth's profile and look through his posts. 

I may have asked someone else about it.

Its just that there’s so many replies you can get lost in you you are replying to.

[ZeeSoh]

2 minutes ago, Brainiac5 said:

I may have asked someone else about it.

Its just that there’s so many replies you can get lost in you you are replying to.

Someone else doesn't have access to the numbers that Rth has and thus couldn't possibly know whether it included China/SK numbers or not. Why are you making something so simple so difficult?

[Brainiac5]

5 minutes ago, ZeeSoh said:

Someone else doesn't have access to the numbers that Rth has and thus couldn't possibly know whether it included China/SK numbers or not. Why are you making something so simple so difficult?

You are not getting what I’m trying to say but I won’t make it any harder for you.

Lets wait and see where the film is after this weekend .

If it’s over 500mil ww then 700ww+ is where I believe it will be heading to.

Under 500ww then it may fall short of 700mil.

[Subzero]

21 minutes ago, Squadron Leader Tele said:

 

WB didn’t launch the DCEU with the intent of breaking even, c’mon now. Even after BVS, there was every expectation this would be a significant blockbuster (by them and everyone else).

True but they didn't expect all the issue that it faced.

Snyder had to leave due to family issues as he was directing under lots of stress ...and who knows what went on behind the scene and then change of director etc...

Then the Afleck issues ...yada yada ....