The Marvel / MCU Thread || From Blade to Secret Wars, All Things Marvel!

[Masketta Man]

2 hours ago, interiorgatordecorator said:

when will mcu fans say "enough"? or have they already done so?

For some people being invested into the MCU is a style of life, those will never give up on it.

[SpiderByte]

I liked it. Not the best of the shows but people acting like it's the worst show ever made are really overblowing it.

 

It's the opposite of Secret Invasion where it starts strong then totally drops the ball at the end. It starts shaky but IMO pulls through in the later episodes, I especially loved 4.

[Belakor]

I saw 3 episodes of Echo and all I can say it's what you expect from modern Marvel: tedious, bad script, slow paced and with plot holes all over the place. The villain (if there's one) is vague af. The premise feels tired after the first episode and Maya actress is so bad, like it gives you some cringe to watch some of the acting.

 

The use of the MA rating is barely used, there is no sense of consequence, fear, anything, only CGI blood and that's all.

Spoiler

Also, as far as episode 3 Daredevil only has a cameo fight and it also feels rushed (only lasts like 1 minute) and its badly done.

 

If people were hoping a show with the quality the Daredevil series that Netflix had, man, they are going to be disappointed.

 

After this mess I have exactly 0 hope for everything Marvel throws out that is MA or R rated.

 

Back to watching the first 3 seasons of Daredevil.

[TwoMisfits]

55 minutes ago, SpiderByte said:

I liked it. Not the best of the shows but people acting like it's the worst show ever made are really overblowing it.

 

It's the opposite of Secret Invasion where it starts strong then totally drops the ball at the end. It starts shaky but IMO pulls through in the later episodes, I especially loved 4.

 

Dang, if you're saying "not the best"...yikes!

 

[Belakor]

For what it's worth, at least Marvel is having the balls to enter the R/MA territory. If they begin to hire seasoned film makers and push less trashy content they could fill the gap DC has been trying to fill since the mid 2010's,

[SpiderByte]

I don't see why Echo is a sign that Marvel shouldn't do R rated stuff for some reason. It's not like people were saying "The Marvels is proof they can't make PG-13 movies anymore". The bigger flaw Echo has is that they consolidated from six episodes to five (my guess is the big changes were made to the first and final ones), but that wouldn't change if it were or weren't violent.

Edited January 10 by SpiderByte

[SpiderByte]

Consensus on Echo overall seems to be "solid but has pacing issues". RT is up to 73 now too.

 

There were a few super reactionary types saying the action was "worse than Iron Fist" and...no. Not even close. As much snippy editing as some parts have unlike Iron Fist the camera does not cut to a very obvious stunt double in a clown wig whenever Cox does something even slightly acrobatic 

[Sckathian]

It looks mid tier to me but that’s no bad thing. Disney made a mistake running away with their toys from the Netflix shows/model - the initial idea of a grounded group made more sense that these crossovers constantly.

 

And I think Disney have shown their not incapable of bad writing either.

3 hours ago, SpiderByte said:

I don't see why Echo is a sign that Marvel shouldn't do R rated stuff for some reason. It's not like people were saying "The Marvels is proof they can't make PG-13 movies anymore". The bigger flaw Echo has is that they consolidated from six episodes to five (my guess is the big changes were made to the first and final ones), but that wouldn't change if it were or weren't violent.

We’ll have to see how it performs in the ratings. I am expecting another drop but honestly the big question is when Marvel find their level and can start growing again rather than having a break out hit (though that can happen) - so I think they need a period of consistently and cross overs within the shows and less focus of jumping to film as with The Marvels.

[SpiderByte]

Well Echos a binge release and it's on Hulu and Disney+ which should give it a big jolt at the start for sure. Plus its not like say Falcon and the Winter Soldier where it's a big movie type budget, probably closer to the similarly-scaled Defenders shows which were I think about 50 million a season not including tax credit stuff, but those were also 13 episodes each not 5.

[dudalb]

12 hours ago, Masketta Man said:

For some people being invested into the MCU is a style of life, those will never give up on it.

You have a couple of examples right here.

That is problem with modern fandom; they have to defend everything that the suject of their worship brings out and often try to prove that somehow it was a sucess when it was not. More intelligent fans are like sports fans; admit when their team blew a game oare perfroming badly rather the pretened everything is goint great.

POne roblem iwth Echo is only hard core Marvel fans have ever heard of it before the series. Yes, GOTG was not that well known, but it had alot more recognition then Rcho did.

[SpiderByte]

I think we're well, well past whether not a character is "not popular enough" for that to be a thing. The TVA in the comics was literally an extended joke about Mark Gruenwald and Loki entirely revolves around them.

[Liiviig 1998]

Echo was safe ,generic for like 4 episodes.

 

Soundtrack was pretty good.

 

Yeah nothing much happens and it's felt rushed and nothing much was developed.

 

TV MA rating was barely needed here and action was just decent .

 

Trailer was Miles better than actual show.

 

There is a weird ancestral magic plot that feels so out of place in a pretty grounded show for the most part. 

 

Would have given this like a 6 didn't hate it and there was nothing aggregious about it but Disney+ marvel just couldn't help itself and delivered another truly terrible finale .

 

It was anticlimactic and resolution of conflict for a grounded show is some nonsensical magic shlock .

 

Echo's new powers are just generic and lame magic stuff.

 

5/10. Safe show with really terrible finale that just about Falls  the same trap of  most marvel D+ shows.

 

It's better than she hulk and Secret invasion .

 

Meh start for spotlight and don't know about DD born again. But Disney + really don't know how to write to structure their shows for the most part. We had 30ish min episodes in five episode show . Like seriously. 

 

They treat their shows more like content than actual stories.

 

Echo should have been like a 2hr Disney+ exclusive movie same of most of this Disney + shows.  

 

Have no hope in most of the rest of shows. 

 

Know they are going to change their structure to the typical showrunner structure but they were just dumb and foolish to think this wasn't going to blow in their faces.

 

Disney + continues to be a thorn to the MCU. 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 11 by Liiviig 1998

[Belakor]

23 minutes ago, Liiviig 1998 said:

 

Know they are going to change their structure to the typical showrunner structure but they were just dumb and foolish to think this wasn't going to blow in their faces.

 

 

Do they even care at this point? everyone but the hardcore Marvel fans know that their products are an easy skip, for both TV and cinema right now. 

 

I had hope on Echo because of the "Spotlight" thing and MA rating but it's just another fiasco. 

For me its crystal clear they will continue to deliver products with shitty scripts and with awful productions. 

 

Maybe another mega flop like The Marvels is going to really wake them up.

[Torontofan]

yeah show is a flop online ratings still negative after the Dude bro bombardment. 

[SpiderByte]

I think two days is a bit early to be declaring it a massive failure, especially given that doesn't really line up with its reception. It doesn't cost much (definitely of the Marvel shows, though IDK what What If wound up costing) and has mostly positive reviews, I don't think that'll go down as a failure for them.

[dudalb]

Given the lack of recognization with the GA, this had to be really good to find an audience, and it just is not that good.

The MCU is in trouble, yes they had a sucess with Loki 2, but that is one sucess against how many failures?

[Manny G]

On 1/10/2024 at 8:31 AM, Belakor said:

For what it's worth, at least Marvel is having the balls to enter the R/MA territory. If they begin to hire seasoned film makers and push less trashy content they could fill the gap DC has been trying to fill since the mid 2010's,

Didn’t DC delivered an Oscar winning highest grossing Rated R movie of all time? Even on TV Watchmen is BY FAR the most critically acclaimed comic show witha slew of Emmys. They’ve done filled it lol to act as if this weak  Disney + stuff is Marvel “having the balls” is laughable.

[Porthos]

14 hours ago, Belakor said:

Do they even care at this point? everyone but the hardcore Marvel fans know that their products are an easy skip, for both TV and cinema right now. 

 

I had hope on Echo because of the "Spotlight" thing and MA rating but it's just another fiasco. 

For me its crystal clear they will continue to deliver products with shitty scripts and with awful productions. 

 

Maybe another mega flop like The Marvels is going to really wake them up.

 

FUN FACT:

 

Even if the reaction to The Marvels would have "really woken Marvel up", that would have made ZERO DiFFERENCE in the quality of Echo.

 

ZE-RO.

 

None.

 

Nada.

 

Zilcherino.

 

Hell, production times being what they are, the reception to Quantumania only did so much, considering it was already completely in the can.  And make no mistake, reaction to AQM did indeed change things as this went from a reported eight episode weekly release to a six episode binge.

 

(if you didn't know, this was shot from April to August.... ***OF 2022*** — only so much one can do even when the powers that be decide things need fixing)

[TMP]

39 minutes ago, Manny G said:

Didn’t DC delivered an Oscar winning highest grossing Rated R movie of all time? Even on TV Watchmen is BY FAR the most critically acclaimed comic show witha slew of Emmys. They’ve done filled it lol to act as if this weak  Disney + stuff is Marvel “having the balls” is laughable.

Comparing Watchmen to the embarrassing flops of Disney+ really shows how badly Marvel fumbled the whole “TV” thing, especially with how big the budgets were for these bombs

[dudalb]

5 minutes ago, TMP said:

Comparing Watchmen to the embarrassing flops of Disney+ really shows how badly Marvel fumbled the whole “TV” thing, especially with how big the budgets were for these bombs

Even if the shows had been rating sucesses, they still would have had a problem with the huge budgets. Turns out streaming is just like Broadcast and Cable TV: you simply cannot spend as much on a TV show as you would if the project were a theatrical movie. It just does not work. There have been TV shows that were rating sucesses, but still got cancelled because they simply cost too much to be profitible no matter what the ratings.