Transformers: The Last Knight | 6/21/2017 | Big Budget, Weak OW?

[bartonfink]

16 minutes ago, grey ghost said:

 

Yeah, maybe Pearl Harbor and Bayformers Revenge of the Fallen are Hitchcock and Kubrick level masterpieces only a few can fully appreciate. 

 

I don't know. Maybe some people genuinely appreciate the films and I wouldn't call them being ironic or hipsters. And Bay has made 12 feature films besides Pearl Harbor and ROTF for over twenty years.   

Edited November 17, 2016 by bartonfink

[grey ghost]

4 minutes ago, bartonfink said:

 

I don't know. Maybe some people genuinely appreciate the films and I wouldn't call them being ironic or hipsters. And Bay has made 12 feature films besides Pearl Harbor and ROTF for over twenty years.   

 

How many of his movied are all time classics?

 

The Rock is a cool action movie but c'mon. 

[bartonfink]

Just now, grey ghost said:

 

How many of his movied are all time classics?

 

The Rock is a cool action movie but c'mon. 

 

First of all, making "all time classics" is not the only way to prove someone's filmmaking talent. And what's the absolute standard of all time classics? Is there an irrefutable criteria for judgment? I've seen bunch of people who think Bay's films like Armageddon & Bad Boys etc are timeless classics. Some of them are just average Joe, but some of 'em are passionate moviegoers and even filmmakers. So are their opinions relevant? Or not? You talk like you're enumerating some objective facts like "water is wet." But actually it's just opinion. Even "The Rock is a cool action movie" is not a factual account of events. It's just subjective view which I agree with. I know Bay is not a favorite figure to many moviegoers and critics. But nobody has to follow critical consensus and I think it's one of the great thing about art. I think some opinions which take for granted that he's an just awful & negligible figure are pretty ridiculous.

 

 

[grey ghost]

18 minutes ago, bartonfink said:

 

First of all, making "all time classics" is not the only way to prove someone's filmmaking talent. And what's the absolute standard of all time classics? Is there an irrefutable criteria for judgment? I've seen bunch of people who think Bay's films like Armageddon & Bad Boys etc are timeless classics. Some of them are just average Joe, but some of 'em are passionate moviegoers and even filmmakers. So are their opinions relevant? Or not? You talk like you're enumerating some objective facts like "water is wet." But actually it's just opinion. Even "The Rock is a cool action movie" is not a factual account of events. It's just subjective view which I agree with. I know Bay is not a favorite figure to many moviegoers and critics. But nobody has to follow critical consensus and I think it's one of the great thing about art. I think some opinions which take for granted that he's an just awful & negligible figure are pretty ridiculous.

 

 

 

So based on your criteria any director could be put in the same category as Hitchcock, Kurosawa, Ford, Coppola, etc.

[Arlborn]

1 minute ago, grey ghost said:

 

So based on your criteria any director could be put in the same category as Hitchcock, Kurosawa, Ford, Coppola, etc.

Are you being this obtuse on purpose, by any chance? Surely you got his point that everyone is allowed to have their own opinions and idols?

[grey ghost]

5 minutes ago, Arlborn said:

Are you being this obtuse on purpose, by any chance? Surely you got his point that everyone is allowed to have their own opinions and idols?

 

Where did I say people can't like Michael Bay movies?

 

He just hasn't done anything to belong in the same category as the all time greats.

 

You can like Burger King but don't pretend it magically becomes a gormet restaurant because Wolfgang got caught eating a whopper.

 

 

Edited November 17, 2016 by grey ghost

[bartonfink]

Just now, grey ghost said:

 

So based on your criteria any director could be put in the same category as Hitchcock, Kurosawa, Ford, Coppola, etc.

 

I don't give a shit and any fucker could be regarded as great filmmaker. Coen brothers's favorite filmmaker is Adrian Lyne. Even some "greatest" filmmakers are not sacred cows. Bergman thought Antonioni & Godard just sucked ass. It's not about right and wrong. Art asks whether you agree or disagree. That's it.

[bartonfink]

22 minutes ago, grey ghost said:

 

Where did I say people can't like Michael Bay movies?

 

He just hasn't done anything to belong in the same category as the all time greats.

 

You can like Burger King but don't pretend it magically becomes a gormet restaurant because Wolfgang got caught eating a whopper.

 

 

 

Didn't you know? Wolfgang said whopper was gorgeously delicious.

[Dementeleus]

I think the Bay fandom is unique in somehow demanding respect by trying to use famous names as legitimacy.

[DMan7]

The trailer better be here or else I wouldn't forgive who bumped this. 

[The Futurist]

5 minutes ago, Nutella of Arabia said:

I think the Bay fandom is unique in somehow demanding respect by trying to use famous names as legitimacy.

 

The Bay fandom is a master race that is able to think like uber talented directors who perfectly khow & understand how complex & virtuositic Michael Bay s brand of filmmaking truly is.

 

Cameron is probably the most knowledgeable director in the industry today, he knows everything about everything as far as how a movie is made and when he talks about Bay, it is with genuine admiration.

 

 

[Dementeleus]

11 minutes ago, The Futurist said:

 

The Bay fandom is a master race that is able to think like uber talented directors who perfectly khow & understand how complex & virtuositic Michael Bay s brand of filmmaking truly is.

 

Cameron is probably the most knowledgeable director in the industry today, he knows everything about everything as far as how a movie is made and when he talks about Bay, it is with genuine admiration.

 

 

 

I rest my case.

[BadAtGender]

Bay is a pretty exemplary 2nd unit director. 

[Black Hawk]

 

[bapi]

Pearl Harbor is better than any TF sequel.

[John Marston]

Looking forward to this. Third and fourth TF are the ones I liked 

[baumer]

Michael Bay is an absolutely fantastic director and there are very few other directors who can do what he does. He truly tell the story with his camera. Every Michael Bay thread that we go into it's always the same s***. Michael Bay sucks Michael Bay can't direct Michael Bay Michael Bay Michael Bay Michael Bay. If a man was that horrible he would not be hired and his films wouldnt be making money and people regular people would not be enjoying it as much as I do. I love the guy.

[The Futurist]

For the record, I don't need validation of famous directors to tell me how great Bay is.

 

Fell in love with the guy way before I learned the directors I listed said nice things about him. 

 

It just furthers the point how some of you (& the cinephile intellingentsia, the good taste police as I call them) are lost souls when it comes to your derivative Bay bashing.

 

The way he composes his shots, his understanding of space (if you re lost in a Bay movie, it is you re too old) , his uber complex editing (same thing, if it s too fast, you re too old), his creativity when it comes to action is unparalled in blockbuster land, the sheer virtuosity of his set pieces, the way he understands the Reptilian brain, his love of celluloid, his quest for the perfect image in each and every shot he creates, his love of  Saturated Orange, his 360 shots (dayum!), his great taste in woman, his love for the military & their technology, his work ethic, his story-telling prowess, his don't fuck with me-I won't fuck with you attitude, his love of practical shooting, action & stunts, his fidelity with his crew (he s been working with the same stunt team since the Bad Boys days), his talent with actors (yep, he is a great actor s director, you probably missed this under the controlled chaos of the action) , his generosity with his audience : there is enough action & set pieces in Bay  movies to fill 3 other "normal" blockbusters (I know most people consider this as a negative, your loss I guess), his movies look like they cost 300m, the incredible epic feel & scope of his movies etc etc etc

His understanding of light & color is only matched by Ridley Scott I would say.

 

Dennis Murren told Michael Bay that he helped ILM to make giant leaps thanks to his notes during the making of Pearl Harbor especially how light works in a shot, in an image, he gave notes that no other directors that worked with ILM made before him.

 

That s no accident Transformers (2007) was a game changer in VFX history , it was the first time you had CGI characters that perfectly integrated in live action shots, in urban areas, in broad day light, interacting seamlessly with tons of stuff, that s because Bay understands physics, light & color like no other.

Only Cameron is as good in those departments & he is Bay s hero.

 

Oh, I missed another member of Bay s fan club : Edgar Wright, no, he is not mocking Bay in his films, he is paying hommage.

That need for validation of Bay fans, I swear !

 

And yes, Bay s style is brutal & agressive but that s what make it so visceral, powerful & unique.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 19, 2016 by The Futurist

[The Stingray]

Bay's movies give me splitting headaches.
 

[The Futurist]

55 minutes ago, The Stingray said:

Bay's movies give me splitting headaches.
 

 

Well, I won't lie, Transfomers 4 almost gave ma a brain aneurysm, you think it s finished but there are 3 last action set-pieces before The End appears on screen.

 

 

Edited November 19, 2016 by The Futurist