Joker: Folie a Deux | October 4, 2024 | Lady Gaga is Harley Quinn in this 200M+ musical sequel

[Liiviig 1998]

Don't want to add to the Doom and gloom here.

 

But just don't think  weak reviews just made this drop off so bad in presales. I'm not necessarily saying it's fatigue but the GA has reached a point where they just don't throw money at CBMs ,the ones with hooks/nostalgia baits have been the most successful.

 

F4 superman have an X factor if things go right could do well or flop hard .

 

Cap 4 and thunderbolts just fall in the  " ok  this is coming out  will see" category  but hey they could pull a schang chi and surprise  but flopping hard is a very big possibility for this 2.

 

 

 

 

[HummingLemon496]

6 minutes ago, TomThomas said:

By letterboxd and imdb ratings it did just okay, actually on letterboxd it did worse than okay. Cinemascore shouldn't be used to meassure anything, Jurassic World: Dominion got A- somehow, but it clearly wasn't well received by anyone, to say the least.

Actually you have a point, kinda. That 3.1 on Letterboxd/7.0 IMDB is pretty mid

[Nero]

1 hour ago, TomThomas said:

They will. Captain America and Thunderbolts will flop.

No they won't unless they are bad

[TomThomas]

1 hour ago, Nero said:

No they won't unless they are bad

They can get great reviews and still flop like Gunn's The Suicide Squad. Thunderbolts looks like poor man's Suicide Squad.

Edited September 12 by TomThomas

[toutvabien]

I will throw in that marketing is key to a lot of these upcoming films (Superman, BNW, Thunderbolts) and point out that Superman has been getting a lot of attention for every BTS pic or anything that has come out, yet Joker 2 announcement, behind the scenes pics and every piece of marketing, all got a lot of attention and buzz.

[YM!]

2 hours ago, TomThomas said:

They can get great reviews and still flop like Gunn's The Suicide Squad. Thunderbolts looks like poor man's Suicide Squad.

I wonder why the sequel to the panned movie with a dual release on streaming and an R rating that cut off some of the original audience didn't do well. Although I don't have much faith in Thunderbolts myself.

[YM!]

4 hours ago, TomThomas said:

Endgame, Shazam and FFH were over 5 years ago. Okay, I wanted to say *very well liked. I don't think Wakanda Forever and TSS are *very well liked, at least by audiences. The Batman, Joker, ASTV, NWH & DP&W yes, 1 movie per year is not a lot.

Wakanda Forever did about the same legs wise as Thor: Ragnarok and gave Marvel its first acting nomination, and quite like Joker to Folie, it was coming off a zeitgeist original which couldn't carry the hype - in addition to the passing of the lead. If it wasn't liked at least, it would fell apart. GotGV3 and Shang-Chi also were well liked with both having better legs than The Batman or DP&W and should be within the conversation as those two are always mentioned as brights spots post-Endgame. The Suicide Squad might've fumbled at the box office (but I do think no day and date makes things less embarrassing) but is able to spawn spin-offs, one of which was very well-recieved and able to make the Suicide Squad cast migrate to the DCU (although do think them being Gunn’s baby had a lot to do with it.) Well-liked doesn't stop at the film’s original theatrical run but also how it continues after.

[Mad Max007]

If Phillips was really smart he would have gone with gangster story line for the sequel.

Superman will do $500M max with the standard Gunn 80% RT score.

[Mad Max007]

5 hours ago, TomThomas said:

They will. Captain America and Thunderbolts will flop.

Lol even those have more hype now than Joker 2 and The Marvels/Flash.

[vale9001]

Black panther 2 didn't have...black panther (you know what i mean).

 

I think any kinda of comparisons of that movie with any other sequel to see how It dropped and whatever makes no sense. 

Edited September 12 by vale9001

[Speedorito]

39 minutes ago, YM! said:

I wonder why the sequel to the panned movie with a dual release on streaming and an R rating that cut off some of the original audience didn't do well. Although I don't have much faith in Thunderbolts myself.

Was Suicide Squad panned by audiences? It made 750M (more than Man of Steel and Justice League). I’m not a huge fan of the film, it seemed popular in a try-hard edgy way, but it was popular. It also had the same Cinemascore as TSS.

 

”Suicide Squad was bad but The Suicide Squad was really good and only did poorly cause of Covid” always seemed like more an internet opinion than a general audience opinion. Especially with stuff like Mortal Kombat.

[YM!]

19 minutes ago, Speedorito said:

Was Suicide Squad panned by audiences? It made 750M (more than Man of Steel and Justice League). I’m not a huge fan of the film, it seemed popular in a try-hard edgy way, but it was popular. It also had the same Cinemascore as TSS.

 

”Suicide Squad was bad but The Suicide Squad was really good and only did poorly cause of Covid” always seemed like more an internet opinion than a general audience opinion. Especially with stuff like Mortal Kombat.

Again I think it'd have flopped either way but I do think Day and Date diluted the WB 2021 slates grosses. Probably would've done around The Flash WW which is still a failure but less an embarrassment. I probably like the first Suicide Squad the most of the 2016 CBMs but WoM was pretty mediocre. There's a lot of big hits that did in fact have mediocre WOM - look at BvS and MoM.

[TomThomas]

40 minutes ago, YM! said:

Wakanda Forever did about the same legs wise as Thor: Ragnarok and gave Marvel its first acting nomination, and quite like Joker to Folie, it was coming off a zeitgeist original which couldn't carry the hype - in addition to the passing of the lead. If it wasn't liked at least, it would fell apart. GotGV3 and Shang-Chi also were well liked with both having better legs than The Batman or DP&W and should be within the conversation as those two are always mentioned as brights spots post-Endgame. The Suicide Squad might've fumbled at the box office (but I do think no day and date makes things less embarrassing) but is able to spawn spin-offs, one of which was very well-recieved and able to make the Suicide Squad cast migrate to the DCU (although do think them being Gunn’s baby had a lot to do with it.) Well-liked doesn't stop at the film’s original theatrical run but also how it continues after.

I forgot to mention GotG3. Also wasn't The Suicide Squad spin off show greenlight before the movie's release? Otherwise I don't think it would've happened. Characters migrating to DCU has everything to do with Gunn being DC boss now and nothing else, he used his position to save his characters and drop everyone else.

[TomThomas]

33 minutes ago, Mad Max007 said:

Lol even those have more hype now than Joker 2 and The Marvels/Flash.

Based on your wet dreams? Or you have real data to suggest that?

Edited September 12 by TomThomas

[excel1]

Don't believe Joker 2 will flop until it flops. Consumers are notoriously stringent this time of year during back to school and carnival season, pretty much all retailers and hospitality businesses experience this. 

[Mad Max007]

4 minutes ago, TomThomas said:

Based on your wet dreams? Or you have real data to suggest that?

You mean like your wet dreams that suggest Joker 2 won't flop lol.

[TomThomas]

7 minutes ago, Mad Max007 said:

You mean like your wet dreams that suggest Joker 2 won't flop lol.

I don't suggest it won't flop. I suggest there are ways it could avoid a complete flop despite terrible domestic pre-sales because the movie is simply not yet released, we don't know how it's gonna do overseas or how general audience will react. "Captain America and Thunderbolts are more hyped" is based on nothing, no real data to suggest that.

Edited September 12 by TomThomas

[Mad Max007]

4 minutes ago, TomThomas said:

I don't suggest it won't flop. I suggest there are ways it could avoid a complete flop despite terrible domestic pre-sales because the movie is simply not yet released, we don't know how it's gonna do overseas or how general audience will react. "Captain America and Thunderbolts are more hyped" is based on nothing, no real data to suggest that.

The same applies to those two movies as well then. they are a year out. Thunderbolts will do fine if it's action based like the leaked trailers suggest and Cap 4 trailer was received well the last time I checked. There is now data for Joker 2 though, with reviews and pre-sales!

[Speedorito]

49 minutes ago, YM! said:

Again I think it'd have flopped either way but I do think Day and Date diluted the WB 2021 slates grosses. Probably would've done around The Flash WW which is still a failure but less an embarrassment. I probably like the first Suicide Squad the most of the 2016 CBMs but WoM was pretty mediocre. There's a lot of big hits that did in fact have mediocre WOM - look at BvS and MoM.

But there’s a difference between mixed/mediocre reception and panned though. A Suicide Squad film doesn’t outgross a Superman and a Justice League film, as well as make only 120M less than a pseudo-Justice League film, if it’s flat out rejected. More than enough people liked it. It didn’t even have the novelty of Batman and Superman together or the boost from NWH.

[TomThomas]

27 minutes ago, Mad Max007 said:

The same applies to those two movies as well then. they are a year out. Thunderbolts will do fine if it's action based like the leaked trailers suggest and Cap 4 trailer was received well the last time I checked. There is now data for Joker 2 though, with reviews and pre-sales!

We have Cap 4 "hype" data with low trailer views/likes ratio from the first trailer, that's the only data we can compare. Thunderbolts is poor man's Suicide Squad judging by leaked trailer and last Suicide Squad movie did very poorly, but ok, let's give Tunderbolts a chance and see its data when trailer is released, maybe it will randomly blow up for no reason, it happens sometimes.

Edited September 12 by TomThomas