Weekend Thread 7/28-7/30 - Barbenheimer Week 2; Barbie 93M/Oppy 46.2M - Haunted Mansion & Talk to Me OW; Mansion 24.2M, Talk 10M

[ZattMurdock]

2 minutes ago, wildphantom said:

we’re in agreement then. Lol. 
 

all I was originally saying is its performance domestically has nothing to do with the quality of the movie. What frustrates me are others that see the drop from Fallout and somehow try and rationalise it as the film being the problem. Whilst totally ignoring all other markets. 
 

If the swing was $50 million more domestic and $50 million less OS they wouldn’t even be piping up. 

Yeah my point is that people keep pointing to the film’s quality and I feel like it doesn’t really matter that much when it comes to the box office. Some films and franchises have ceilings, it truly doesn’t matter how high regarded they are. I mean, the Fast franchise and before the Transformers franchise are primary examples of that. Fast X being the biggest western film in China (I think?) and likely remaining that way kinda proves that it isn’t about quality or how well it’s reviewed really.

[WorkingonaName]

If Fast X was on the quality level of 7/8 it would have made a billion. 

[TomThomas]

2 hours ago, Ryan Reynolds said:

MIDRPT1 is worst entry since MI2, third act may be the strongest part which is why it has good reviews

This is simply not true, not even close.

[The Dark Alfred]

26 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

China wasn’t that hot for Fallout either. We are talking about a market that used to do crazy shit for western releases, like $392m for Fast 8. The last time that China kinda cared for M:I was back in 2015, and that ‘only’ grossed $139m there. The result for Dead Reckoning in China is similar to Fallout.

First of all I still don't get why people talk China box office up for Hollywood releases. Unless a film massively breaks out it hardly moves the needle, the net revenue is so much smaller than any overseas territory. FAST X will make less money than TLM. Not sure what are you smoking when you say FALLOUT wasn't hot in China. It was huge. DR simply didn't get a wide release and got pulled quickly.

[ZattMurdock]

6 minutes ago, The Dark Alfred said:

First of all I still don't get why people talk China box office up for Hollywood releases. Unless a film massively breaks out it hardly moves the needle, the net revenue is so much smaller than any overseas territory. FAST X will make less money than TLM. Not sure what are you smoking when you say FALLOUT wasn't hot in China. It was huge. DR simply didn't get a wide release and got pulled quickly.

Not sure where is our misunderstanding, but I agree with you, especially the bold. China isn’t consequential unless it truly breaks out, which rarely seems like the case for western films these days. 
 

And I’m not sure what I was looking at, but I hadn’t find the total for Fallout in China. It’s curious that Fast X is the biggest western release there this year and still did less than Fallout 5 years ago, $181m for Fallout compared with $139m for Fast X (which I’d argue that it’s not that big compared with several blockbusters that went gangbusters there before COVID). I do sincerely wonder what the hell happened, btw. The drastic change of interest needs to be linked to something else. It’s night and day compared with how the films used to break out there back in the day.

[lab276]

3 hours ago, vale9001 said:

It's so sad after these 2 gigantic movies probably everything until Christmas won't be released. 

Feels like covid again after that record breaking 2019. 

 

 

 

Is this the case? Apart from Kraven, what else has moved?

[JohnnyGossamer]

The anecdotal MI7 isn't actually that well liked stuff seems silly to me... That's like me saying of 10+ I know that saw Barbie, only a couple liked it and those 2 didn't love it. Everyone else was in the it was fine or it was meh. But, of course, that doesn't mean overall word of mouth isn't stellar.

 

Let's not pretend people were always too high with where it could get based on TGM. And, let's not pretend it wouldn't have done considerably better had it hypothetically swapped release dates with Flash or Indy. 

 

Sound of Freedom came out of nowhere and absolutely hurt it as similar but obviously not as robust as TGM, MI movies do well in flyover states and red states and that's especially where SoF over indexed.

 

Barbie and Oppenheimer even hit the late late legs of Elemental briefly. They sucked out the oxygen from everything else. They are the box office right now. I expect it to impact Meg and Mutant Mayhem even a little.

 

Part One was stupid too. Better to cheat like Fast X and Across the Spider Verse and just not include part one in title. Heck, Infinity War too. General audiences don't pay huge attention to behind the scenes stuff so while us here all knew long, long, long ago that Fast X and Spidey were part ones most others didn't. I mean, after knowing Fallout is essentially Rogue One Part Two as it uses the same exact primary villain and then ties up that storyline so it's always been odd to me that they decided to title it as much. When they hadn't done it earlier. It DID NOT impact the box office as much as SoF and Barbie and Oppenheimer but it was a stupid decision nonetheless.

 

Those are the three biggest factors with its underperformance along with maybe some slight fatigue.

 

By all metrics, audience scores are more than fine for it...

Rottentomatoes Verified Audience 94% 4.6/5.0

Letterboxd 3.9/5.0 with 240K~ ratings

Cinemascore A

IMDB 8.0/10.0 with 100K~ ratings (I don't put as much faith in this one as I once did but MI7 film is the type that might get an uncontroversial rating there not voted up or down by many like other stuff there)

...those are all very strong audience scores. Just for a number of reasons, including a few I failed to list, it didn't take off with the same type of legs as Rogue or Fallout.

Edited July 29, 2023 by JohnnyGossamer

[WorkingonaName]

4 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

Not sure where is our misunderstanding, but I agree with you, especially the bold. China isn’t consequential unless it truly breaks out, which rarely seems like the case for western films these days. 
 

And I’m not sure what I was looking at, but I hadn’t find the total for Fallout in China. It’s curious that Fast X is the biggest western release there this year and still did less than Fallout 5 years ago, $181m for Fallout compared with $139m for Fast X (which I’d argue that it’s not that big compared with several blockbusters that went gangbusters there before COVID). I do sincerely wonder what the hell happened, btw. The drastic change of interest needs to be linked to something else. It’s night and day compared with how the films used to break out there back in the day.

Meg is technically a western co-production.  

[ZattMurdock]

2 minutes ago, WorkingonaName said:

Meg is technically a western co-production.  

You expect that to break out higher than Fast X? I have no idea. If Fast X is the highest, anything goes I guess.

[JohnnyGossamer]

8 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

You expect that to break out higher than Fast X? I have no idea. If Fast X is the highest, anything goes I guess.

In China specifically, yes. It has potential. Isn't the star of the Wolf Warrior and Wandering Earth movies one of the leads in it? Didn't a production company in China throw in a huge chunk of money toward the production budget? That should help it. 

[grim22]

Just now, JohnnyGossamer said:

In China specifically, yes. It has potential. Isn't the star of the Wolf Warrior and Wandering Earth movies one of the leads in it? Didn't a production company in China throw in a huge chunk of money toward the production budget? That should help it. 

 

Meg presales are huge so far. Could end up doing more than 250M in China if it delivers on Statham punching a shark.

[ZattMurdock]

6 minutes ago, JohnnyGossamer said:

In China specifically, yes. It has potential. Isn't the star of the Wolf Warrior and Wandering Earth movies one of the leads in it? Didn't a production company in China throw in a huge chunk of money toward the production budget? That should help it. 

I have no idea. The last time I cared for a Statham joint was with the first Crank. Pretty sure I never even got to the sequel. 

[Liiviig 1998]

Don't know why poeple are harping on @Ryan Reynolds it's clearly his opinion that it's the second last entry same just like it's third last for me . Guess some didn't enjoy as much as others.

 

I agree anecdotal MI7 thinking it's not well recieved is just silly. Audience metrics all over the board are great and clearly barbenhiemer ,SOF are affecting it and it would have done way more.

 

But even before barbenhiemer . OW was ok but some reason audiences just failed to appear as expected .

 

Just see china. It has technically the same reception as barbie but it just behaved like a typical Hollywood nowdays and dropped  really big last weekend while barbie is just legging out and will probably beat it in china.

 

was the marketing just that terrible  or something. Because it ticked everybox  and box office just didn't  materialize.

 

even without barbenhiemer I had a hard time seeing this getting to RN and GP numbers.

 

Don't know how part 2 will pan out but if iam cruise and paramount just make it the last one and then shift focus to top gun 3 and see where stuff goes from there.

Edited July 29, 2023 by Liiviig 1998

[Krissykins]

34 minutes ago, lab276 said:

 

Is this the case? Apart from Kraven, what else has moved?

Gran Turismo 2 weeks

Challengers to 2024

Ghostbusters to 2024

Kraven to 2024

Spider Verse 3 delayed indefinitely

I think that’s all of the ones so far. Most of those are only Sony though, we don’t know if other studios will follow. 

[ZattMurdock]

2 minutes ago, Liiviig 1998 said:

Don't know why poeple are harping on @Ryan Reynolds it's clearly his opinion that it's the second last entry same just like it's third last for me . Guess some didn't enjoy as much as others.

 

I agree anecdotal MI7 thinking it's not will recieved is just silly. Audience metrics all over the board are great and clearly barbenhiemer ,SOF are affecting it and it would have done way more.

 

But even before barbenhiemer . OW was ok but some reason audiences just failed to appear as expected .

 

Just see china. It has technically the same reception as barbie but it just behaved like a typical Hollywood nowdays and dropped  really big last weekend while barbie is just legging out and will probably beat it in china.

 

was the marketing just that terrible  or something. Because it ticked everybox  and box office just didn't  materialize.

 

even without barbenhiemer I had a hard time seeing this getting to RN and GP numbers.

 

Don't know how part 2 will pan out but if iam cruise and paramount just make it the last one and then shift focus to top gun 3 and see where stuff goes from there.

Mission: Impossible is Cruise’s baby, but Paramount has already made clear that the series could just keep going without him before during the teens. I don’t think a M:I without Cruise is happening anytime soon, and MI8 with him is definitely happening and likely more. But they will slowly pivot the series to other people over just stopping, I believe. It was supposed to slowly become Jeremy Renner’s series for a hot minute.

[TomThomas]

37 minutes ago, JohnnyGossamer said:

The anecdotal MI7 isn't actually that well liked stuff seems silly to me... That's like me saying of 10+ I know that saw Barbie, only a couple liked it and those 2 didn't love it. Everyone else was in the it was fine or it was meh. But, of course, that doesn't mean overall word of mouth isn't stellar.

 

Let's not pretend people were always too high with where it could get based on TGM. And, let's not pretend it wouldn't have done considerably better had it hypothetically swapped release dates with Flash or Indy. 

 

Sound of Freedom came out of nowhere and absolutely hurt it as similar but obviously not as robust as TGM, MI movies do well in flyover states and red states and that's especially where SoF over indexed.

 

Barbie and Oppenheimer even hit the late late legs of Elemental briefly. They sucked out the oxygen from everything else. They are the box office right now. I expect it to impact Meg and Mutant Mayhem even a little.

 

Part One was stupid too. Better to cheat like Fast X and Across the Spider Verse and just not include part one in title. Heck, Infinity War too. General audiences don't pay huge attention to behind the scenes stuff so while us here all knew long, long, long ago that Fast X and Spidey were part ones most others didn't. I mean, after knowing Fallout is essentially Rogue One Part Two as it uses the same exact primary villain and then ties up that storyline so it's always been odd to me that they decided to title it as much. When they hadn't done it earlier. It DID NOT impact the box office as much as SoF and Barbie and Oppenheimer but it was a stupid decision nonetheless.

 

Those are the three biggest factors with its underperformance along with maybe some slight fatigue.

 

By all metrics, audience scores are more than fine for it...

Rottentomatoes Verified Audience 94% 4.6/5.0

Letterboxd 3.9/5.0 with 240K~ ratings

Cinemascore A

IMDB 8.0/10.0 with 100K~ ratings (I don't put as much faith in this one as I once did but MI7 film is the type that might get an uncontroversial rating there not voted up or down by many like other stuff there)

...those are all very strong audience scores. Just for a number of reasons, including a few I failed to list, it didn't take off with the same type of legs as Rogue or Fallout.

Well said.

[Liiviig 1998]

5 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

Mission: Impossible is Cruise’s baby, but Paramount has already made clear that the series could just keep going without him before during the teens. I don’t think a M:I without Cruise is happening anytime soon, and MI8 with him is definitely happening and likely more. But they will slowly pivot the series to other people over just stopping, I believe. It was supposed to slowly become Jeremy Renner’s series for a hot minute.

That's why I said they make part 2 last MI movie. 

[grim22]

48 minutes ago, JohnnyGossamer said:

The anecdotal MI7 isn't actually that well liked stuff seems silly to me... That's like me saying of 10+ I know that saw Barbie, only a couple liked it and those 2 didn't love it. Everyone else was in the it was fine or it was meh. But, of course, that doesn't mean overall word of mouth isn't stellar.

 

Let's not pretend people were always too high with where it could get based on TGM. And, let's not pretend it wouldn't have done considerably better had it hypothetically swapped release dates with Flash or Indy. 

 

Sound of Freedom came out of nowhere and absolutely hurt it as similar but obviously not as robust as TGM, MI movies do well in flyover states and red states and that's especially where SoF over indexed.

 

Barbie and Oppenheimer even hit the late late legs of Elemental briefly. They sucked out the oxygen from everything else. They are the box office right now. I expect it to impact Meg and Mutant Mayhem even a little.

 

Part One was stupid too. Better to cheat like Fast X and Across the Spider Verse and just not include part one in title. Heck, Infinity War too. General audiences don't pay huge attention to behind the scenes stuff so while us here all knew long, long, long ago that Fast X and Spidey were part ones most others didn't. I mean, after knowing Fallout is essentially Rogue One Part Two as it uses the same exact primary villain and then ties up that storyline so it's always been odd to me that they decided to title it as much. When they hadn't done it earlier. It DID NOT impact the box office as much as SoF and Barbie and Oppenheimer but it was a stupid decision nonetheless.

 

Those are the three biggest factors with its underperformance along with maybe some slight fatigue.

 

By all metrics, audience scores are more than fine for it...

Rottentomatoes Verified Audience 94% 4.6/5.0

Letterboxd 3.9/5.0 with 240K~ ratings

Cinemascore A

IMDB 8.0/10.0 with 100K~ ratings (I don't put as much faith in this one as I once did but MI7 film is the type that might get an uncontroversial rating there not voted up or down by many like other stuff there)

...those are all very strong audience scores. Just for a number of reasons, including a few I failed to list, it didn't take off with the same type of legs as Rogue or Fallout.

 

MI:DR-P1 is actually in danger of becoming known as a bad movie because of the bad box office. This happens from time to time when the box office decline can't be blamed on anything in particular, so the narrative moves to "it must have done bad because it was bad". Clearly there's word of mouth issues to some extent because it wasn't doing great at the box office even pre-Barbenheimer as it consistently came in below expectations.

[kayumanggi]

 

[GambitPool]

8 minutes ago, grim22 said:

 

MI:DR-P1 is actually in danger of becoming known as a bad movie because of the bad box office. This happens from time to time when the box office decline can't be blamed on anything in particular, so the narrative moves to "it must have done bad because it was bad". Clearly there's word of mouth issues to some extent because it wasn't doing great at the box office even pre-Barbenheimer as it consistently came in below expectations.

Can't wait to see a bunch of "I just watched Dead Reckoning Part One on streaming. Why didn't it do better at the box office?" articles and Reddit threads. 😐