Superman | July 11, 2025 | James Gunn writing and directing | David Corenswet is Clark, Rachel Brosnahan is Lois

[grim22]

20 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

Anytime someone complains about how Clark destroyed the truck driver’s livelihood in MoS, I can’t help but feel like that’s a red flag. The man committed sexual assault, and tried to fight Clark when he asked him to leave. You actually can lose your job over that. Why would anyone other than Max Landis feel sorry for that guy? 
 

Anyway, that’s a big no on Vin Diesel as Lex Luthor. I think that’d actually be worse than Jesse Eisenberg. 

 

You are lucky you weren't around for the forums right after MoS released. There was a lot of nonsense being thrown around. I swear I'm not making this up, there was a pages long discussion whether Clark should have taken the shirt and jacket of a person we never see when he comes onshore after saving the oil rig. And I couldn't tell if half the comments were genuinely serious or not.

 

Like that was nitpicking of the highest variety. It genuinely felt like MoS got nitpicked to an extent no CBM had before or since. Every single detail became a fan war. That caused the supporters and detractors to become even more enmeshed in their positions.

 

Thanks to MoS, no CBMs since have endings in populated cities. Guardians 1 was a bit too late to reshoot so they added a couple of ADR lines to say "everyone has been evacuated". Ultron was ridiculous in the climax where the heroes were like pausing the fight to keep saving people (and then Civil War retconned that to make it a lot of people killed). Every other CBM since MoS has it's climax take place in either abandoned locations which are basically a void, a desert right outside town, a designated fighting spot, or outer space/underwater. It's genuinely an influential CBM in that sense.

[excel1]

48 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

Anytime someone complains about how Clark destroyed the truck driver’s livelihood in MoS, I can’t help but feel like that’s a red flag. The man committed sexual assault, and tried to fight Clark when he asked him to leave. You actually can lose your job over that. Why would anyone other than Max Landis feel sorry for that guy? 

 

LOL overanalyzing a bit much? I don't think any of the many who have criticized that scene disagree what the man did being entirely wrong. It's more laziness on that writers part that they couldn't find a more creative way for Superman to get back to him. They had to wreck the guys truck, knock out powers for other innocent people, and cause a lot of $$$ in prospect damage. It was just dumb and out of character for someone who is known to always be the bigger person.

 

Additionally, the bar scene was exceptionally generic and unoriginal. Everyone watching knew exactly what was going to happen 2 seconds into it. Again, the entire things feel lazy.

 

19 minutes ago, grim22 said:

 

You are lucky you weren't around for the forums right after MoS released. There was a lot of nonsense being thrown around. I swear I'm not making this up, there was a pages long discussion whether Clark should have taken the shirt and jacket of a person we never see when he comes onshore after saving the oil rig. And I couldn't tell if half the comments were genuinely serious or not.

 

Like that was nitpicking of the highest variety. It genuinely felt like MoS got nitpicked to an extent no CBM had before or since. Every single detail became a fan war. That caused the supporters and detractors to become even more enmeshed in their positions.

 

Thanks to MoS, no CBMs since have endings in populated cities. Guardians 1 was a bit too late to reshoot so they added a couple of ADR lines to say "everyone has been evacuated". Ultron was ridiculous in the climax where the heroes were like pausing the fight to keep saving people (and then Civil War retconned that to make it a lot of people killed). Every other CBM since MoS has it's climax take place in either abandoned locations which are basically a void, a desert right outside town, a designated fighting spot, or outer space/underwater. It's genuinely an influential CBM in that sense.

 

MOS and BvS were both treated very unfairly by critics and film snobs largely because they hated Snyder before he even got the Superman gig. MOS did not help itself by having a few extremely obvious and outright silly unSuperman moments, the worst being hurdling the oil tanker during the metropolis fight. But the idea that MOS had a 56% on RT vs. the 75% it would have had it were a Marvel will always irritate me. 

 

It was all Snyder. He already a reputation back then of being a Michael Bay "all visual style, no substance" director. They were looking to critique him. Iron Man shoots down the flying alien turtle in Avengers and it crashes into a skyscraper, nobody cares. Superman throws Zod into an Ihop, everyone calls him careless. It was ridiculous. 

 

They literally gave Anderson Cooper a line in BvS saying "thank god its not work hours, so the downtown area is totally empty" to offset the MOS complaint 😂

Edited May 7, 2023 by excel1

[Reddroast]

2 minutes ago, excel1 said:

 

LOL overanalyzing a bit much? I don't think any of the many who have criticized that scene disagree what the man did being entirely wrong. It's more laziness on that writers part that they couldn't find a more creative way for Superman to get back to him. They had to wreck the guys truck, knock out powers for other innocent people, and cause a lot of $$$ in prospect damage. It was just dumb and out of character for someone who is known to always be the bigger person.

 

Additionally, the bar scene was exceptionally generic and unoriginal. Everyone watching knew exactly what was going to happen 2 seconds into it. Again, the entire things feel lazy.

 

 

MOS and BvS were both treated very unfairly by critics and film snobs largely because they hated Snyder before he even got the Superman gig. MOS did not help itself by having a few extremely obvious and outright silly unSuperman moments, the worst being hurdling the oil tanker during the metropolis fight. But the idea that MOS had a 56% on RT vs. the 75% it would have had it were a Marvel will always irritate me. 

 

It was all Snyder. He already a reputation back then of being a Michael Bay "all visual style, no substance" director. They were looking to critique him. Iron Man shoots down the flying alien turtle in Avengers and it crashes into a skyscraper, nobody cares. Superman throws Zod into an Ihop, everyone calls him careless. It was ridiculous. 

 

They literally gave Anderson Cooper a line in BvS saying "thank god its not work hours, so the downtown area is empty" to offset the MOS complaint 😂

Now I think that MOS is a good but flawed film ( it leans too heavily on the Jesus imagery and bungled Kevin Costner as Pa Kent badly.) However BVS throws out everything interesting MOS set up and sets it on fire.

[excel1]

BvS did not deserve a 29% on Rotten Tomatoes. LOL that was a joke. Iron Man 2 has a 71%, Iron Man 3 - where PEPPER POTTS GETS ALIEN LIKE POWERS - has a 79%, Thor 2 a 66%, but BvS a 29% ?

 

That was a joke. It made everyone negative about the film, too. Had it been given the 65% isn that it deserved, the public reacts more favorably.  

Edited May 7, 2023 by excel1

[grim22]

24 minutes ago, excel1 said:

 

LOL overanalyzing a bit much? I don't think any of the many who have criticized that scene disagree what the man did being entirely wrong. It's more laziness on that writers part that they couldn't find a more creative way for Superman to get back to him. They had to wreck the guys truck, knock out powers for other innocent people, and cause a lot of $$$ in prospect damage. It was just dumb and out of character for someone who is known to always be the bigger person.

 

Additionally, the bar scene was exceptionally generic and unoriginal. Everyone watching knew exactly what was going to happen 2 seconds into it. Again, the entire things feel lazy.

 

 

MOS and BvS were both treated very unfairly by critics and film snobs largely because they hated Snyder before he even got the Superman gig. MOS did not help itself by having a few extremely obvious and outright silly unSuperman moments, the worst being hurdling the oil tanker during the metropolis fight. But the idea that MOS had a 56% on RT vs. the 75% it would have had it were a Marvel will always irritate me. 

 

It was all Snyder. He already a reputation back then of being a Michael Bay "all visual style, no substance" director. They were looking to critique him. Iron Man shoots down the flying alien turtle in Avengers and it crashes into a skyscraper, nobody cares. Superman throws Zod into an Ihop, everyone calls him careless. It was ridiculous. 

 

They literally gave Anderson Cooper a line in BvS saying "thank god its not work hours, so the downtown area is totally empty" to offset the MOS complaint 😂

 

Yeah, the moment I saw this happen in my screening (I watched MoS about a week before most people at the LA Film Festival opening day), i knew this scene would be debated, little did I realize this scene wouldn't be in like the top 5 things debated

 

[WittyUsername]

28 minutes ago, excel1 said:

 

LOL overanalyzing a bit much? I don't think any of the many who have criticized that scene disagree what the man did being entirely wrong. It's more laziness on that writers part that they couldn't find a more creative way for Superman to get back to him. They had to wreck the guys truck, knock out powers for other innocent people, and cause a lot of $$$ in prospect damage. It was just dumb and out of character for someone who is known to always be the bigger person.

 

Additionally, the bar scene was exceptionally generic and unoriginal. Everyone watching knew exactly what was going to happen 2 seconds into it. Again, the entire things feel lazy.

😂

Clark wasn’t even Superman at that point. Besides, is it really any lazier than if he just beat the crap out of the guy like in Superman II? 

[excel1]

4 minutes ago, grim22 said:

 

 

Love that Supes doesn't go after Zod either, he just stands there and poses for a second. 

[excel1]

Just now, WittyUsername said:

Clark wasn’t even Superman at that point. Besides, is it really any lazier than if he just beat the crap out of the guy like in Superman II? 

 

They could have had the guy move Superman and accidentally push himself back over the table since Clark is a wall. Could have had the guy walk out to the police waiting for him. Etc. 

 

Clark retaliating at all was a bit out character. Going to that extent? Newspaper headline the next day: "RECORD BREAKING GUST OF WIND LIFTS TRUCK, SETS IT DOWN ON POWER LINE"?

[grim22]

Just now, excel1 said:

 

Love that Supes doesn't go after Zod either, he just stands there and poses for a second. 

 

The reason given is so much worse. Fight story only makes sense if you don't have such a distracting moment, there were a million other ways it could have been done without implicating Superman

 

 

Maybe he realizes he screwed up, or he fights Zod instead of posing, or you don't focus on the collapsing garage. So many ways the scene would not have stood out.

[WittyUsername]

3 minutes ago, excel1 said:

 

They could have had the guy move Superman and accidentally push himself back over the table since Clark is a wall. Could have had the guy walk out to the police waiting for him. Etc. 

 

Clark retaliating at all was a bit out character. Going to that extent? Newspaper headline the next day: "RECORD BREAKING GUST OF WIND LIFTS TRUCK, SETS IT DOWN ON POWER LINE"?

How is him retaliating out of character? Superman punishing bullies is a time honored tradition. 

[excel1]

2 minutes ago, grim22 said:

 

The reason given is so much worse. Fight story only makes sense if you don't have such a distracting moment, there were a million other ways it could have been done without implicating Superman

 

 

Maybe he realizes he screwed up, or he fights Zod instead of posing, or you don't focus on the collapsing garage. So many ways the scene would not have stood out.

 

 

🤣 what a stupid response. Clearly a preselected trailer shot. It is a challenge with Superman. The building collapses around him - he flies out of it instead of freezing it with his breath. A lot just didn't make sense. The severity of the Metropolis destruction as well was hilarious bad too. It looks like a nuclear bomb went off in the middle of Metropolis. 

 

[excel1]

3 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

How is him retaliating out of character? Superman punishing bullies is a time honored tradition. 

 

punishing the guy for what he did to the woman, sure. punishing the guy for dumping beer on kal's head?

[TheDarkKnightOfSteel]

I mean I don’t get why the destruction level in MOS gets so much debate. I mean this is the plausible scenario if two gods were throwing punches at each other. I though critics were just reaching and at some point it just became cool to hate on the film.

 

The truck scene is not up for debate. You assault a human being you are worthy of whatever comes your way. Not two ways about it.

Sure maybe Snyder over stylising everything made somethings stand out more but they did not make a decision that was not logical and in fact Clark is being Superman as through the film he both saves people and risks his life to do so.

 

And to this day I consider this to be my favourite comic book movie even with its flaws.

[cax16]

9 hours ago, grim22 said:

 

The reason given is so much worse. Fight story only makes sense if you don't have such a distracting moment, there were a million other ways it could have been done without implicating Superman

 

 

Maybe he realizes he screwed up, or he fights Zod instead of posing, or you don't focus on the collapsing garage. So many ways the scene would not have stood out.

Oliva is another one I never need to hear from again. 

[JWR]

I would have ended with the fight in Smallville and then Superman destroying the terraformer.

 

Once it's just Superman fighting Zod in Metropolis, the fight becomes dull and numbing. The big issue is that I never got the sense that either of them was in mortal peril, they just fly towards each other and bounce off like rubber. 

 

More should have been done to sell that these guys were getting bruised and exhausted. It never felt like their punches were having any effect. 

[John Marston]

Man of Steel will always be one of my favorite superhero movies. I love the Batman Begins meets War of the Worlds approach. Love how the film shows off the sheer strength of these superpowered beings. Beings that can crater the ground just from taking off.  Zod and Faora are some of the best supervillains in any superhero movie. Michael Shannon is GOAT. 

 

 

It was definitely a mistake to make BvS next and not just make a MOS sequel with some course correction. BVS definitely is very flawed and with a huge miscasting (Jesse Eisenberg) and is definitely the film responsible for this universe not really being able to take off. I really liked ZSJL though and thought it was a nice redemption. I am sad this universe overall didn't work and I understand the need to reboot. I am not that interested in James Gunn's likely approach though (he will probably make DC feel like Marvel 2.0 in tone and feel and that just doesn't appeal to me) but I am happy for the fans who are looking forward to it and will likely love it 

Edited May 7, 2023 by John Marston

[WittyUsername]

14 hours ago, excel1 said:

 

punishing the guy for what he did to the woman, sure. punishing the guy for dumping beer on kal's head?

The reason he dumped beer on his head was because Clark asked him to leave after he committed sexual assault. I just find it odd how people cite that scene as an example of what a dick Snyder’s Superman supposedly is, as if he’s the bad guy in that situation, and not the guy who committed sexual assault, and was probably too drunk to drive anyway. With that said, it is ridiculous how he was able to skewer that truck without anyone hearing it. 

[Lucas]

22 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

With that said, it is ridiculous how he was able to skewer that truck without anyone hearing it. 

Even more ridiculous, he skewers that truck as if he were Kylo Ren levels of unstable and lashing out lol. It looks completely comical and not at all the vibe you get from how the character probably would fuck with the truck. Lois Lane says "How do you find someone who has spent a lifetime covering his tracks", well it shouldn't be that difficult if he leaves impossible-to-comprehend truck-sized footprints everywhere lol. Snyder obviously went for the cool visual over something subtler that would be more appropriate for the character. Not a major thing but Gunn will definitely be thinking about those smaller details more lol.

 

Supes was right to fuck that truck up though.

[grim22]

20 minutes ago, Lucas said:

Even more ridiculous, he skewers that truck as if he were Kylo Ren levels of unstable and lashing out lol. It looks completely comical and not at all the vibe you get from how the character probably would fuck with the truck. Lois Lane says "How do you find someone who has spent a lifetime covering his tracks", well it shouldn't be that difficult if he leaves impossible-to-comprehend truck-sized footprints everywhere lol. Snyder obviously went for the cool visual over something subtler that would be more appropriate for the character. Not a major thing but Gunn will definitely be thinking about those smaller details more lol.

 

Supes was right to fuck that truck up though.

 

Everyone seems to be making the same point with regards to the movie. Almost everything Superman/Clark does is right (except letting his dad die that way), it's just the framing does things no favors. Snyder always goes for the cool "trailer shot" rather than what would work for that specific moment and character.

[TestPattern]

18 hours ago, grim22 said:

 

The reason given is so much worse. Fight story only makes sense if you don't have such a distracting moment, there were a million other ways it could have been done without implicating Superman

 

 

Maybe he realizes he screwed up, or he fights Zod instead of posing, or you don't focus on the collapsing garage. So many ways the scene would not have stood out.

This could be justified this Superman ducked, meaning Superman was taken by surprise and didn't think be he acted, but the fact that Superman casually flew over the tanker and struck a cool pose makes it really stupid.