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Alien: Covenant (2017)  

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1 minute ago, Mulder said:

Iirc he was more upset because he wasn't put in charge in the first place. Oram's meant to be a smart but faithful man and yet he just looks like a moron. 


I thought he didn't want to be in charge? It seemed like he didn't think he could do it because of his faith (which was never brought up again - Thanks Ridley) and his wife convinced him that he could do it. From there on out, the character acts dumb. Daniels and Tennessee seemed to have the clearest heads.

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Just now, somebody85 said:


I thought he didn't want to be in charge? It seemed like he didn't think he could do it because of his faith (which was never brought up again - Thanks Ridley) and his wife convinced him that he could do it. From there on out, the character acts dumb. Daniels and Tennessee seemed to have the clearest heads.

If I remember correctly the line went that he was mad because he thought the company didn't trust him to be clear headed enough to be in charge because of his faith. Also would agree that Daniels and Tennessee were the smartest though only Oram had plot breaking stupidity problems. Tbh I almost never complain about character stupidity because people expect way too much from humans but Oram was just too unbelievable for me personally.

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1 hour ago, Mulder said:

If I remember correctly the line went that he was mad because he thought the company didn't trust him to be clear headed enough to be in charge because of his faith. Also would agree that Daniels and Tennessee were the smartest though only Oram had plot breaking stupidity problems. Tbh I almost never complain about character stupidity because people expect way too much from humans but Oram was just too unbelievable for me personally.


Yeah I can't remember that first exchange between Chris and his wife because it happens so fast in the beginning and I've seen multiple films since including 4 POTC movies lol. But from what I remember, he was introduced as being unconfident, indecisive and kind of bumbling. He reminded me a bit of the Lieutenant who is way in over his head in Aliens which Ripley see's.

But I agree his character was easily the dumbest one in the movie. Still I don't think he acted as stupid as the scientist in Prometheus who encourages the frightening looking worm to come closer to him to pet it. Right before he touches it, I believe it opens up showing it's not friendly...but he still thinks it's peaceful. I thought this was at least a step up from that stupidity lol.

Edited by somebody85

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Just now, somebody85 said:


Yeah I can't remember that first exchange between Chris and his wife because it happens so fast in the beginning and I've seen multiple films since including 4 POTC movies lol. But from what I remember, he was introduced as being unconfident, indecisive and kind of bumbling. He reminded me a bit of the Lieutenant who is way in over his head in Aliens which Ripley see's.

But I agree his character was easily the dumbest one in the movie. Still I don't think he acted as stupid as the scientist in Prometheus who encourages the frightening looking worm to come closer to him to pet it. Right before he touches it, I believe it opens it's mouth showing it's not friendly...but he pays it no regards. I thought this was at least a step up from that stupidity lol.

I'd say it's just as stupid though tbh this all could've been avoided if Covenant didn't have any prometheus elements at all. Like I said earlier in the thread, the base plot of a colony ship having to survive Xenos is a cool idea but the prometheus elements bog it down so much.

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27 minutes ago, Mulder said:

I'd say it's just as stupid though tbh this all could've been avoided if Covenant didn't have any prometheus elements at all. Like I said earlier in the thread, the base plot of a colony ship having to survive Xenos is a cool idea but the prometheus elements bog it down so much.


Now this I completely agree with. I would have liked to see this movie as being one or the other. I think the main reasons audiences are disappointed was because marketing sold this movie as something that it wasn't. From those trailers you expect to see a lot of tense scenes of Aliens attacking a crew aboard a ship...and when that set piece finally does happen, it feels tacked on and has none of what made Alien so special.

The ships not dirty, the lights aren't blaring and it happens so fast. They completely failed to recapture the atmosphere.

Instead the movie tries to have it all and ended up letting down a lot of people in the process. I like the AI element of it because I find AI stuff fascinating but the movie would have been stronger with David only being there in brief flashbacks.  Like they could have still shown what happened to David and Shaw and moved on and spent the rest of the movie on the colony crew being hunted by the nenomorphs and xenomorphs. They could have came up with a completely different idea for creating the xenomorph that did not involve David since this is the Engineers planet and anything goes because we don't know a lot about them. They didn't even have to explain why they were on that planet since we already know the Engineers have encountered something like that creature from the murals on the ships walls in Prometheus.

The rescue signal could have came a different way or just been a glitch before Shaw died.
 

I think that's what people expected from the trailers....and Covenant isn't it.

Edited by somebody85

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5 minutes ago, somebody85 said:


Now this I completely agree with. I would have liked to see this movie as being one or the other. I think the main reasons audiences are disappointed was because marketing sold this movie as something that it wasn't. From those trailers you expect to see a lot of tense scenes of Aliens attacking a crew aboard a ship...and when that set piece finally does happen, it feels tacked on and has none of what made Alien so special.

The ships not dirty, the lights aren't blaring and it happens so fast. They completely failed to recapture the atmosphere.

Instead the movie tries to have it all and ended up letting down a lot of people in the process. I like the AI element of it because I find AI stuff fascinating but the movie would have been stronger with David only being there in brief flashbacks.  Like they could have still shown what happened to David and Shaw and moved on and spent the rest of the movie on the crew being hunted by the nenomorphs and xenomorphs. They could have came up with a completely different idea for creating the xenomorph that did not involve David since this is the Engineers planet and anything goes because we don't know a lot about them.
 

I think that's what people expected from the trailers....and this movie isn't it.

I agree with this entire post. The AI stuff is great but more suited for Blade Runner I feel like.

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1 minute ago, Mulder said:

I agree with this entire post. The AI stuff is great but more suited for Blade Runner I feel like.


I've heard rumors that Ridley Scott wants to try to tie the two universes together by connecting the replicants with the androids....which I truly hope doesn't happen. At this point I'm hoping he had very little to do with Blade Runner: 2049.

I wanted that Alien thriller too and I'm sure a lot of other audiences did. The only reason I liked it slightly more then others was because I enjoyed the AI stuff. I thought the actual xenomorph part was by far the weakest aspect of the movie and that should never happen in an Alien movie (it even used the same font of the original). It felt like it was added in a the last minute because FOX got involved with the franchise again and said "we don't care what movie you make as long as you find a way to bring the xenomorph back because that's what sells"

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2 minutes ago, somebody85 said:


I've heard rumors that Ridley Scott wants to try to tie the two universes together by connecting the replicants with the androids....which I truly hope doesn't happen. At this point I'm hoping he had very little to do with Blade Runner: 2049.

I wanted that Alien thriller too and I'm sure a lot of other audiences did. The only reason I liked it slightly more then others was because I enjoyed the AI stuff. I thought the actual xenomorph part was by far the weakest aspect of the movie and that should never happen in an Alien movie (it even used the same font of the original). It felt like it was added in a the last minute because FOX got involved with the franchise again and said "we don't care what movie you make as long as you find a way to bring the xenomorph back because that's what sells"

I'd agree. Felt so unneeded once the Neomorphs died.

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My review of Alien: Covenant:

https://grabyourseat.wordpress.com/2017/05/30/alien-covenant-film-review/

 

In 1977, Ridley Scott released a film called Alien, and it became one of the most influential movies in sci-fi and film history. Since then, it’s spawned a possibly even more loved sequel in 1986’s Aliens, a few more sub-par continuations, two terrible crossovers with Predator, and a very polarizing prequel in the form of Prometheus. That film chose not to focus on the beloved Xenomorph species of the originals and was instead a sci-fi thinking piece tackling existential questions such as “Who made us?”. Many hated the direction Scott took with that film, so for Alien: Covenant, he decided to try to shift the franchise back towards what made it successful in the first place, and it only somewhat gets there.

 

Ten years after the events of Prometheus, over 2000 colonists are aboard the Covenant and on course to settle on Origae-6. During the trip, the ship’s crew receives a distress signal from a nearby planet and goes down to investigate. The new planet has no life in sight, but seems perfect for sustaining it. But while investigating, a few of the crew members start developing some strange symptoms, and the new planet quickly turns into a nightmare.

 

Most mainstream audiences found Prometheus a little too deep and missed the presence of the aliens, but many loved the new direction and wanted to see where it would go. Covenant attempts to satisfy both groups, so naturally, it can be a little uneven. A lot of the film hits the same horror beats as the original Alien, including similar first encounters and final battles and a checklist of fallen characters. This can make it feel a little “been there, done that”, but the scenes are updated with modern technology, and they sure do look cool. There’s one completely original new battle towards the end of the film that never would have been possible in the 70s and 80s and is sure to be one of the most crowd-pleasing scenes of the year.

 

But at the same time, Covenant attempts to continue the rather deep creation arc started in Prometheus. The backlash did cause them to switch their end goal a bit, so if you were looking forward to seeing what Noomi Rapace learns on the Engineer’s home planet, you’re going to be a little disappointed. The main way that the Prometheus story continues is through David (Michael Fassbender), the very curious android that set many of that film’s events in motion. Covenant explores what David’s been up to in the ten years since, which leads to quite a few more philosophical questions. However, the film doesn’t completely commit to this plotline, as it is too busy appeasing Alien fans. But there is enough of it to pull you out of the tension of those scenes. With two completely different end goals in mind, the film struggles to get to either.

 

Despite this story hurdle, Covenant succeeds in spades in the technical department. Ridley Scott is one of the best directors of all time, and he makes yet another gorgeous looking movie. Landscapes are beautiful, and production design of the Covenant itself is marvelous. Every shot is framed perfectly, allowing Scott to maximize the tension of each scene. And it’s very well acted. Katherine Waterston does fine work as the pseudo-Ripley, Billy Crudup perfectly captures the reluctant captain, and Danny McBride has a great dramatic turn as the ship’s pilot. But coming out on top for the second film in a row is Fassbender. He plays double duty as both David and Covenant’s on-board android, Walter. A few scenes involve the two robots talking to each other, and Fassbender and his multitude of accents play them magnificently.

 

Covenant would be a much stronger film if it knew what it wanted to be. Alien, Aliens, and Prometheus are all very different movies, but all three committed to what they were, and they all did great jobs of it (yes, even Prometheus). Covenant tries to be all three at once, and it just ends up being a weaker version of each. It’s too slow to just be a great action or horror movie, and too unfocused to be a great thinking piece. Acting is good, but David is pretty much the only character to be developed, so you don’t really care what happens to any of them, something that the previous movies worked hard to avoid. It’s still an enjoyable film, and fans shouldn’t be disappointed, but it lacks the focus to sit up among the best.

 

Grade: 6.5/10

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"Do you want to serve in heaven or reign in hell?”

 

Alien: Covenant is a film in constant struggle. It cannot decide whether it wants to be a spectacular sequel to Prometheus, building off characters and moments from that film that justifies its existence, or if it wants to be a generic Alien sequel, full of forgettable characters and dull setpieces. It's clear Scott would rather it be the former, but he directs the generic Alien scenes well, making them be slightly more enjoyable than they could be others' hands, but that's not enough to make them truly needed here.

 

Fassbender unsurprisingly is the best part of both of these films, in a dual role that makes him the most memorable part of this. Scratch that, that's underselling him too much; Fassbender delivers the best performance in a blockbuster since 2015, making his characters utterly compelling, overshadowing the actual monsters present here in sheer terror. It's a truly remarkable performance in an otherwise sadly unremarkable film.

 

The rest of the ensemble can be lumped together as "forgettable." Technically, the film always looks good, and it's also just really nice to see a hard-R gritty sci-fi horror in this day and age. Besides those simple joys and Fassbender, Alien: Covenant remains a large disappointment, being so close to greatness, but being too concerned with the franchise's own history to touch it. C+

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God this movie fell apart from me on rewatch (much like ID: Resurgence did last year). Way too many flaws to even mention. I hadn't seen it since May and I'm surprised I didn't pick up on all the illogical and flat out idiotic writing in this movie. The spectacle must have distracted me or I've just seen too many other great movies lately.

I have no desire to ever see it again. Cinemasins is going to tear it apart.

C - C- (Down from B+).

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