The Marvels | November 10, 2023 | Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter

[DInky]

3 minutes ago, John Marston said:

Black Panther 2 did fine but it still attracted a lot of curiosity due to how the movie would handle Boseman’s passing. It also had pretty average kegs considering it had about 5 weeks of no competition. Black Panther 3 will definitely take another sizable drop 

 

The movie was well-made but I haven't rewatched it even once. It was long and so downbeat.

[SpiderByte]

A lot of rewriting history about Wakanda Forever in here, Jesus. Why are people acting like the movie was poorly received?

[DInky]

1 minute ago, SpiderByte said:

A lot of rewriting history about Wakanda Forever in here, Jesus. Why are people acting like the movie was poorly received?

 

Nobody is saying that. A movie can be great but also not very rewatchable.

Edited November 1, 2023 by DInky

[TMP]

3 hours ago, Eric Presley said:

Time has passed, so now the thread is open. Now as a reminder to everybody, this is just a silly kids movie. It bombing or succeeding won't change your life in any way, you're not seeing any of that money anyways, and if you don't like a conversation, just ignore it and move on. You aren't being forced against your will to respond in this thread, so why do it if you don't like how things are going?

If you’re shorting disney stock, then a bomb of this magnitude would make you very rich lol

[Zakiyyah6]

Wait, who is saying that Wakanda Forever was poorly received? The legs were short but it was obviously well received. No Way Home, Guardians 3, Shang Chi and Wakanda Forever were undoubtedly seen as the bright spots in Phase 4/5. Even Black Widow's reception was fine, not great but fine.

 

The B+ and B Cinemascore films are the ones that are hurting the integrity of the MCU operation. We do not know the reception of the Marvels yet because it hasn't come out so that's TBA. 

[Reed121]

1 hour ago, Spidey Freak said:

 

In hindsight, Shuri and the Women of Wakanda actually fared incredibly well without T'Challa or an appearance from a more famous MCU heavyweight in WF

Because Black Panther had side characters people cared about. Mbaku, Okoye, Shuri, Nakia. Killmonger was very popular. Even Wakanda itself became popular and more than the average setting and a slogan and title for the sequel. That’s why it was possible to have a sequel without T’Challa. It was probably the only MCU movie capable of having a sequel without its lead. You couldn’t have Thor sequel without Hemsworth or a recast or a Spider Man sequel without Holland or a recast.
 

But this wasn’t a good thing for the Black Panther franchise or the MCU. The first movie arguably did too much for the side characters at the expense of its lead. For example T’Challa’s established genius in the comics never should have been taken away/hidden and given to Shuri. It would be like taking away Spider Man’s intelligence or Reed Richard’s intellect and giving them to another character.
Black Panther in the MCU or in the comics needs its lead to be as successful as it can be just like Spider Man, Thor or Ironman do.
The decision not to recast or put the sequel on hold indefinitely (and also making the sequel a backdoor pilot for a Disney plus Ironheart TV show) is one of a number of mistakes that’s led to the situation we are seeing now with The Marvels.

 

[Reed121]

53 minutes ago, John Marston said:

Black Panther 2 did fine but it still attracted a lot of curiosity due to how the movie would handle Boseman’s passing. It also had pretty average legs considering it had about 5 weeks of no competition. Black Panther 3 will definitely take another sizable drop 

Black Panther 3 if there is one will 100% take a sizeable drop without its lead character. 
You reboot the franchise and recast and that’s a very different story.

[DInky]

2 minutes ago, Reed121 said:

Black Panther 3 if there is one will 100% take a sizeable drop without its lead character. 
You reboot the franchise and recast and that’s a very different story.

 

I think T'Challa's son, who is also conveniently named T'Challa, will be the next Black Panther post Secret Wars.

[WorkingonaName]

3 hours ago, Eric Presley said:

It bombing or succeeding won't change your life in any way, you're not seeing any of that money anyways

I have made quite a sum gambling on BO results. 

[Arlborn]

2 hours ago, eddyxx said:

As a Marvel fan who is disappointed in the MCU, this thread is tame as hell compared to BvS, Justice league, and amazing Spider-Man 2.

Absolute nuclear waste of threads, and the couple of weekend threads that followed their openings were nigh impossible to have an interesting discussion in!  As someone who enjoyed BvS, I remember that pretty vividly.

 

They definitely needed a franchise wars thread back then, people were absolutely going to war in here with each other over the DCU stuff.

 

But at least it was mostly people who were already members of this forum just having fights with each other. That's (sort of/up to a point) valid. What I can't stand is people who create accounts just to troll, that's quite dastardly.

 

Edited November 1, 2023 by Arlborn

[Reed121]

16 minutes ago, DInky said:

 

I think T'Challa's son, who is also conveniently named T'Challa, will be the next Black Panther post Secret Wars.

Aging him up is unnecessarily complicated. Black Panther fans want T’Challa not his made up son. I think the next Black Panther movie whenever that comes will have a different cast and T’Challa proper. There won’t  be a Captain Marvel 3 and there isn’t a need for Black Panther 3 without T’Challa/Chadwick. Bob Iger said not every movie needs a sequel.

Edited November 1, 2023 by Reed121

[DInky]

2 minutes ago, Reed121 said:

Aging him up is unnecessarily complicated. Black Panther fans want T’Challa not his made up son. I think the next Black Panther movie whenever that comes will have a different cast and T’Challa proper. There won’t  be a Captain Marvel 3 and there isn’t a need for Black Panther 3 without T’Challa/Chadwick. Bob Iger said not every movie needs a sequel.

 

They wouldn't have introduced him if the plan wasn't to have him take up the mantle. And why throw away all the supporting cast? Aging the character up will be super easy with Kang Dynasty and Secret Wars.

[TMP]

21 minutes ago, WorkingonaName said:

I have made quite a sum gambling on BO results. 

Main reason to use this site tbh

[Reed121]

1 hour ago, Kon said:

 

This is likely true.

 

Wakanda Forever worked as a goodbye for Chadwick Boseman. That likely attracted more attention on the movie.

A normal Black Panther sequel with Chadwick with a similar reception to Wakanda Forever minus the depressing tone and lack of rewatchability would have made more money and opened bigger. 
Nearly everyone who went to see Wakanda Forever would have seen Black Panther 2 with Chadwick but there were people who skipped Wakanda Forever because it didn’t have T’Challa at all.
 

[Valencia]

2 hours ago, Dominic Draper said:

Marvel stans spent like 10 years relentlessly and obnoxiously attacking and trolling DC, Fox and Sony, making every discussion anywhere a total disaster and impossible.

 

They are getting back about 10% of the energy they put out and are having complete meltdowns and cranking up the victim complex. Pretty hilarious to see.

 

Foxmen universe is gone.

 

Sony makes terrible Spider-Man spin offs without Spider-Man (minus Spiderverse).

 

DC is just ashes at this point.

 

There’s nothing for the fandoms to war over.

 

Everyone is failing lol.

 

 

[DInky]

I legitimately felt like I was coming home from a funeral and a wake when i was walking out of the theater. Didn't help that they added to the overall sense of misery by killing Queen Ramonda as well.

[M37]

1 hour ago, DInky said:

 

Even if the first movie made only 800M or even under that, the drop we're seeing right now would still be terrible.

If Captain Marvel opened in Ant & Wasp's spot in summer 2018, rather than just weeks before Endgame, does it make a similar $215M+ DOM & ~$620M WW? I don't think that's a unrealistic sliding doors expectation (presuming one believes they are both Tier 3 characters in the MCU)

 

AMWQ dropped from that total to $476M WW, despite the theatrical introduction of Kang that boosted the fan interest/OW significantly (and terrible quality that produced disastrous legs) ... and Marvels has no such big storyline hook. Plus a fair amount of "baggage" - real or imagined (as in I don't want to debate it) - that appears to be pulling it down further than a similar ~$200M DOM & $400-$500M WW baseline expectation that I think many had

 

I just don't think it can be overstated how the Infinity Stone storyline, constantly building towards an Endgame climax, raised the floor on even the lowest level of solo films, that the more rudderless/shotgunning direction post-Endgame no longer is able to.

[GambitPool]

15 minutes ago, DInky said:

I legitimately felt like I was coming home from a funeral and a wake when i was walking out of the theater. Didn't help that they added to the overall sense of misery by killing Queen Ramonda as well.

Still don't understand that decision. We already had the loss of Chadwick in real life and T'Challa in universe. Why did they need to add Queen Ramonda to that? It made the film unnecessarily bleaker. 

[DInky]

4 minutes ago, GambitPool said:

Still don't understand that decision. We already had the loss of Chadwick in real life and T'Challa in universe. Why did they need to add Queen Ramonda to that? It made the film unnecessarily bleaker. 

 

It felt like something that was in the original script (because for some reason we always have to kill the parents) that should have been taken out after Boseman passed.

[Torontofan]

The great DC wars was much worse.

 

Star wars was funny as it was like everyone was happy with the Force awakens and Rogue one.  Any issues were just mild disagreements.

 

December 15, 2017 however was like a nuclear bomb went off on the internet and this forum.