The Marvels | November 10, 2023 | Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter

[ZattMurdock]

As for the backlash we see against Nia DaCosta over she acting like any other director ever working on blockbusters of the size of The Marvels:

 

 

I stand with other Afro-American creators calling this bullshit out. People seem incredibly worried about the criticism that Fran Drescher faces, but turn a blind eye for the insane amount of vitriol that DaCosta is facing since yesterday. Yes it’s some thinly veiled racist shit. 

[John Marston]

6 minutes ago, DInky said:

 

I personally refuse to believe IW/EG added over 400M to Captain Mavrel's gross but for the sake of the argument let's say it did Doctor Strange numbers (670M WW). The drop from original to sequel would still be a big anomaly for the MCU.

 

Also, I said that IW and EG wouldn't have been able to boost Captain Marvel's box office to over 1 billion IF viewers genuinely disliked the film. Do you really think the movie was disliked to the degree that it's causing a massive drop off?

 

Endgame hype was insane and they dropped the final Endgame trailer and poster the week Captain Marvel opened which featured Captain Marvel 

 

 

its almost exactly like Alice in Wonderland. A film that rode off a very specific hype  (in this case Avatar and 3D hype) and was pretty well liked at the time but as time went by people began to look back at the film more negatively and the sequel tanked

[ZattMurdock]

 

 

 

[Dominic Draper]

40 minutes ago, SpiderByte said:

The only upside is that now presumably we never have to hear about Marvel movies "monopolizing" screens from Oscar movies or whatever the fuck.

I don't know what the point of this snark is when it's been well documented that Disney likes to strong arm theatres and by extension hurts smaller films.

[MovieMan89]

33 minutes ago, DInky said:

 

Are they? Personally, I think it's a shame what's about to happen because I love Carol and Kamala but I also can't look away. This kind of drop is insane and it's hard to rationalize. You only see a drop like this if the first movie is hot garbage but it objectively wasn't. And if the drop we're seeing is caused by Marvel/superhero fatigue then it has big ramifications for all upcoming superhero movies.

Like I said, Cap 4 and Thuderbolts are going nuclear if they’re not WOM machines. 

[SaltyPistola]

The article seems a bit whack in retrospect. I'm not pro Marvel at all but the writer has a strange vibe and is clearly pushing an agenda. It makes a lot of good points, but is also filled with some fishy shit. 

[DInky]

12 minutes ago, John Marston said:

 

Endgame hype was insane and they dropped the final Endgame trailer and poster the week Captain Marvel opened which featured Captain Marvel 

 

 

its almost exactly like Alice in Wonderland. A film that rode off a very specific hype  (in this case Avatar and 3D hype) and was pretty well liked at the time but as time went by people began to look back at the film more negatively and the sequel tanked

 

So this great reevaluation of Captain Marvel took place during the last 4 years but it didn't happen to any of the other comparable MCU films like Doctor Strange or Ant-Man and the Wasp, both of which kids would call "mid" nowadays? Let's be real here, Captain Marvel was not worse than either of those. And yes, I realize that Quantumania flopped but it opened a lot stronger than the second film, the negative reviews and bad WoM killed it.

[MysteryMovieMogul]

4 minutes ago, John Marston said:

Also the lack of Endgame hype is only part of the reason for the drop. The other part is that this looks like a total shit film with everything people complain about in recent Marvel films  and looks  unappealing to anyone over  ten years old 

I haven't seen enough to develop a solid enough opinion, but the clips and trailer I have watched don't support this opinion whatsoever. See, these kind of comments are what makes a lot of the talk surrounding The Marvels feel... off. Like, this movie doing bad means people are being extra harsh in a way that feels extreme.

[DInky]

9 minutes ago, John Marston said:

Also the lack of Endgame hype is only part of the reason for the drop. The other part is that this looks like a total shit film with everything people complain about in recent Marvel films  and looks  unappealing to anyone over  ten years old 

 

No, it doesn't.

[ZattMurdock]

3 minutes ago, Zakiyyah6 said:

Since it is apparently not against the rules to randomly bring up DC movies I'm going to bring up one for a real reason.

 

I am convinced that hardcore MCU fans have amnesia. The media was just as vicious to Wonder Woman 2017 before it came out and I don't recall most MCU fans jumping to that film's defense. There were constant articles about the tracking numbers and how the film had reshoots, how much WB and the director struggled to get the film right and even an article about how unrealistic it was for Wonder Woman to not have armpit hair. The most ridiculous things were written about that film. The media was gleefully waiting and wanting that film to fail and that the stellar reviews happened. The Marvels situation is not much different and why should it be? Why should Disney movies be treated with kid gloves? The fact is, either the media is going to be right and the film is a dead movie walking or they are going to be wrong. Whining about the media isn't going to change anything. It is up to the film to prove itself. 

This isn’t the Wonder Woman thread, but as a long time poster here you and I remember the amount of hype surrounding Wonder Woman - and long time fans of the superhero genre posters here - very differently. I remember standing shoulder to shoulder with @Cochofles hyping the shit out of that film and I don’t remember any crazies talking about Wonder Woman’s armpit hair (?!) here or elsewhere either. There was apprehensiveness if Jenkins was going to pull it off, but people were rightfully rooting and cheering for that film here; 

[Zakiyyah6]

2 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

This isn’t the Wonder Woman thread, but as a long time poster here you and I remember the amount of hype surrounding Wonder Woman - and long time fans of the superhero genre posters here - very differently. I remember standing shoulder to shoulder with @Cochofles hyping the shit out of that film and I don’t remember any crazies talking about Wonder Woman’s armpit hair (?!) here or elsewhere either. There was apprehensiveness if Jenkins was going to pull it off, but people were rightfully rooting and cheering for that film here; 

I didn't say that absolutely no MCU fans were defending it. Obviously some were. And I'm mainly talking about how the media across the internet were after it. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Zakiyyah6

[DInky]

4 minutes ago, MysteryMovieMogul said:

I haven't seen enough to develop a solid enough opinion, but the clips and trailer I have watched don't support this opinion whatsoever. See, these kind of comments are what makes a lot of the talk surrounding The Marvels feel... off. Like, this movie doing bad means people are being extra harsh in a way that feels extreme.

 

Comments like that (talking about John Marston here, not you) immediately betray that the person in question is a "get woke, go broke" type.

[Dominic Draper]

3 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

This isn’t the Wonder Woman thread, but as a long time poster here you and I remember the amount of hype surrounding Wonder Woman - and long time fans of the superhero genre posters here - very differently. I remember standing shoulder to shoulder with @Cochofles hyping the shit out of that film and I don’t remember any crazies talking about Wonder Woman’s armpit hair (?!) here or elsewhere either. There was apprehensiveness if Jenkins was going to pull it off, but people were rightfully rooting and cheering for that film here; 

Are you suggesting people weren't attacking wonder woman before release anywhere? Or just on here.

[SpiderByte]

Lol it is nothing remotely like the lead up to Wonder Woman. Nobody was saying Wonder Woman was going to result in Justice League being cancelled 

[DInky]

Just now, SpiderByte said:

Lol it is nothing remotely like the lead up to Wonder Woman. Nobody was saying Wonder Woman was going to result in Justice League being cancelled 

 

That was BvS's job.

[ZattMurdock]

Just now, Dominic Draper said:

Are you suggesting people weren't attacking wonder woman before release anywhere? Or just on here.

I’m not omnipresent. I think it goes with the territory that a film featuring a woman as the lead to face backlash from bigots and men that try way too hard to like women but in truth hate them. What I’m saying is that the amount of vitriol and downright hate for this film and people that are part of this project is off the charts for anything I’ve followed before. Captain Marvel’s thread here was bad, but not nearly as bad as what we have right now. What I’m saying is that comparing the overall sentiment on BOT for either Wonder Woman or Captain Marvel can be compared with The Marvels. 

[Dominic Draper]

2 minutes ago, SpiderByte said:

Lol it is nothing remotely like the lead up to Wonder Woman. Nobody was saying Wonder Woman was going to result in Justice League being cancelled 

You're right. Wonder Woman was 20x worse than this.

[MysteryMovieMogul]

16 minutes ago, Zakiyyah6 said:

Since it is apparently not against the rules to randomly bring up DC movies I'm going to bring up one for a real reason.

 

I am convinced that hardcore MCU fans have amnesia. The media was just as vicious to Wonder Woman 2017 before it came out and I don't recall most MCU fans jumping to that film's defense. There were constant articles about the tracking numbers and how the film had reshoots, how much WB and the director struggled to get the film right and even an article about how unrealistic it was for Wonder Woman to not have armpit hair. The most ridiculous things were written about that film. The media was gleefully waiting and wanting that film to fail and then the stellar reviews happened. The Marvels situation is not much different and why should it be? Why should Disney movies be treated with kid gloves? The fact is, either the media is going to be right and the film is a dead movie walking or they are going to be wrong. Whining about the media isn't going to change anything. It is up to the film to prove itself. 

I wasn't a part of this forum when Wonder Woman came out, but I was a member of a number of online film communities, more than now actually, and the only folks attacking this film in such a manner were the Geeks & Gamers of the world. Most of what I read about the film was positive. No one was talking about Gal Gadot the way they're talking about her now. I don't remember a vicious mainstream media reaction to Wonder Woman, though.

12 minutes ago, DInky said:

 

So this great reevaluation of Captain Marvel took place during the last 4 years but it didn't happen to any of the other comparable MCU films like Doctor Strange or Ant-Man and the Wasp, both of which kids would call "mid" nowadays? Let's be real here, Captain Marvel was not worse than either of those. And yes, I realize that Quantumania flopped but it opened a lot stronger than the second film, the negative reviews and bad WoM killed it.

I still think folks are understating the effect of no actors being able to do promotion. No Comic-Con hype. No New York Comic-Con hype. I don't buy the reevaluation of Captain Marvel, because the discourse behind that film is the same now as it was a month after release.

[DInky]

5 minutes ago, Dominic Draper said:

You're right. Wonder Woman was 20x worse than this.

 

I recall a lot of people calling Gadot an awful actor and body-shaming her (even though she looked great in the trailers). John Campea was on this insane crusade against her, endlessly crying about how the role should have gone to Jaimie Alexander.

Edited November 2, 2023 by DInky

[The Wild Eric]

Moderation

 

We're done with this "which was treated worse" crap with Wonder Woman and The Marvels. We don't do this petty fanboy war nonsense here anymore, and everybody here knows this will lead to pointless fights over some silly kids movies. So why even bother bringing it up?

 

Anybody who continues this further will see a threadban.