Avatar: The Way of Water | 16 DEC 2022 | Don't worry guys, critics like it

[The Dark Alfred]

Nope, Cameron is not a good writer at all. He's a great director, but all the scripts are full of flaws and lame dialogues. But his vision and directorial skills outshine his weak writing.

Edited January 14, 2012 by The Dark Alfred

[Magic]

Nope, Cameron is not a good writer at all. He's a great director, but all the scripts are full of flaws and lame dialogues. But his vision and directorial skills outshine his weak writing.

What I mean is look how female "characters"(I use that term very loosely) are portayed in a fucking Michael Bay film and then compare them to Cameron's in T2 and Aliens for example.

[vc2002]

How much does a few naysayers' opinion mean, comparing to what Cameron had achieved?Nothing.

[Magic]

How much does a few naysayers' opinion mean, comparing to what Cameron had achieved?Nothing.

People who care about actual character development and plot aren't a few picky naysayers. Filmmaking above all should be about telling a great story with great, well developed characters. That's not being nitpicky, that's just knowing what film is supposed to be about. You can tell yourself that Avatar is the greatest film of all time until the end of time but it doesn't make it true.

[vc2002]

People who care about actual character development and plot aren't a few picky naysayers. Filmmaking above all should be about telling a great story with great, well developed characters. That's not being nitpicky, that's just knowing what film is supposed to be about. You can tell yourself that Avatar is the greatest film of all time until the end of time but it doesn't make it true.

You see your problem here? You think you speak for people who care about character development and plot. You think you speak for those who know what film is supposed to be about.This is a typical act of a naysayer.

[AniNate]

People who care about actual character development and plot aren't a few picky naysayers. Filmmaking above all should be about telling a great story with great, well developed characters. That's not being nitpicky, that's just knowing what film is supposed to be about. You can tell yourself that Avatar is the greatest film of all time until the end of time but it doesn't make it true.

Saying a story is "great" is subjective. I mean, Avatar opened to $78 million and finished with nearly ten times that much. The story obviously connected with a lot of people, whether or not it was satisfying for you. Great visuals alone cannot draw that kind of crowd. Edited January 14, 2012 by tribefan695

[Cochofles]

Yep, that's the problem with these 'internet message board film critics." They think they speak for everyone and they truly think their opinion is fact when they say things like, "Cameron can't write!!!" "Cameron's characters are cardboard!!" Yawn.

People who care about actual character development and plot aren't a few picky naysayers. Filmmaking above all should be about telling a great story with great, well developed characters.

Very few directors are as good storytellers as Cameron. Avatar has a fantastic story and one he told superbly. A story that connected on an emotional level with a lot of people, including myself. Oh wait, let me guess...it was bad because it was not original, right?

You can tell yourself that Avatar is the greatest film of all time until the end of time but it doesn't make it true.

And you can tell yourself that Avatar is badly written and the worst film of all time until the end of time, but it doesn't make it true. Edited January 14, 2012 by Cochofles

[Magic]

I struggle to understand how anybody would think Avatar would be up there with the classics, I really do. Doesn't story mean anything anymore?Avatar was very popular isn't a great argument IMO. So is McDonald's and the food is crap and gives people heart attacks.

[fishstick]

He's always been great for writing strong female characters who are more than merely window dressing which unfortunately is rather rare so I commend him for that but the "romance" in Avatar was half hearted at best. I have nothing against romance, I just don't think it was that good in Avatar.

Romance was awesome in Avatar. Half-hearted? That would be Aragorn and Arwen, a romance nobody who wrote it into the script was interested in but showhorned it to attract girls. Cameron makes romance center of his movies (or mother-child bond in movies w/o romance) instead of just tossing it in to pump more dollars from girls. In most genre movies, romance is periferal necessary evil for commercial reasons, not the A plot. Window dressing. OTOH, Cameron makes it an A plot and does it justice.You just hate Avatar cause it made more money than HP and LOTR. Don`t even try to deny, Magic, your bias is way too obvious. Edited January 14, 2012 by fishnets

[Cochofles]

Cameron is the best writer of romance and warrior chick characters out there. Haters can suck it.

I love when people say that Cameron forgot about character and plot. If Titanic and Avatar's characters had not connected with people, they would not have had the extraordinary repeat business they did. I didn't see the film 5 times (in theatres) and God knows how many other times on DVD because I wanted to gawk at CGI vistas. I did so because every time I watch it I am swept up in the romance between Jake and Neitiry and because the film always gets to me, emotionally. And all of the people I know who saw it feel the same.

I struggle to understand how anybody would think Avatar would be up there with the classics, I really do. Doesn't story mean anything anymore?Avatar was very popular isn't a great argument IMO. So is McDonald's and the food is crap and gives people heart attacks.

What you can't seem to grasp is that just because YOU think it's bad doesn't make it so. And being popular does not make it good. Having an emotionally resonant core, a fantastically well-told story, and superb craft does. Yes, story means everything. And that's why Avatar succeeds. Edited January 14, 2012 by Cochofles

[Magic]

Romance was awesome in Avatar. Half-hearted? That would be Aragorn and Arwen, a romance nobody who wrote it into the script was interested in but showhorned it to attract girls. Cameron makes romance center of his movies (or mother-child bond in movies w/o romance) instead of just tossing it in to pump more dollars from girls. In most genre movies, romance is periferal necessary evil for commercial reasons, not the A plot. Window dressing. OTOH, Cameron makes it an A plot and does it justice.You just hate Avatar cause it made more money than HP and LOTR. Don`t even try to deny, Magic, your bias is way too obvious.

Do I like Potter? Yes. Does that mean that I pretend that they are they greatest films of all time? No. The films, as much as I like them are pretty flawed and pale in comparison to LOTR. I enjoy them but I don't pretend they are masterpieces because I'm not delusional. It's one thing to like something, it's another to pretend that it's the greatest movie ever. The list of movies that I would say are better than any Potter film would be pretty extensive. Edited January 14, 2012 by Magic

[fishstick]

I love when people say that Cameron forgot about character and plot. If Titanic and Avatar's characters had not connected with people, they would not have had the extraordinary repeat business they did. I didn't see the film 5 times (in theatres) and God knows how many other times on DVD because I wanted to gawk at CGI vistas. I did so because every time I watch it I am swept up in the romance between Jake and Neitiry and because the film always gets to me, emotionally. And all of the people I know who saw it feel the same.

For this I had to take you off Ignore list. Now if you only renounced Shitto, we could be bff.Anyway, spot on. Repeat business was staggering because people cared for characters and universe, not because 3D was OMG so amazing.of course, same people won`t say that TH is doing well because 48ft or whatever 3D is OMG so amazing. It`s going to be ebecause people care for undistinguishable slapstick dwarf #8.

[fishstick]

I'm not delusional. It's one thing to like something, it's another to pretend that it's the greatest movie ever.

You think LOTR is the greatest movie ever and that`s delusional too. And a big double standard. Only what you consider the best is rational and eevryone else`s standard is insanity. You should get out more. Edited January 14, 2012 by fishnets

[Cochofles]

Nobody here has said "AVATAR IS THE GREATEST FILM EVER OMG!!!!". We only say that it's superb film entertainment in every aspect. But go ahead, keep parroting that it sucks because "it has no story/it's derivative/it's lame." To each their own, amigo. Just don't talk as if it's a fact, because it is not. It's your opinions, and that is cool.

[fishstick]

Hear,hear!

[Cochofles]

Hear,hear!

You still my friend? Hey, forget what I said about Ottogirl!

[Magic]

You think LOTR is the greatest movie ever and that`s delusional too. And a big double standard. Only what you consider the best is rational and eevryone else`s standard is insanity. You should get out more.

I don't think it's the greatest movie ever but as I do think they are very strong films, yes. They may have added things you don't like or had a couple of actors that you hated but I rate them pretty highly.

[fishstick]

I don't think it's the greatest movie ever but as I do think they are very strong films, yes. They may have added things you don't like or had a couple of actors that you hated but I rate them pretty highly.

But not delusionally high.

[Magic]

But not delusionally high.

I wouldn't put them up there with The Godfather or something but I would say there aren't that many trilogies that compare. The Star Wars OT and the Toy Story films would have to be up there. Can you think of many others?

[fishstick]

You, of course, mean Toy Story and The Prequels trilogy, no? It`s proposterous to put Toy Story in the same sentence with SW OT. Now that`s trully overrated series, TS franchise.

Edited January 14, 2012 by fishnets