Avatar: The Way of Water | 16 DEC 2022 | Don't worry guys, critics like it

[TomCruiseTop]

17 minutes ago, Hatebox said:

 

I know you're fucking around at this point, but now I think of it: Cameron is much like Hemingway in that his form stems from an acute understanding of functionality. At the heart of his films is an airtight story — a rare attribute in this day and age — and that's what keeps people coming back.

 

I am not fucking around. Orwell is the best 20th C writer as he sold the most books. Simple. 

[Porthos]

17 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

I am not fucking around. Orwell is the best 20th C writer as he sold the most books. Simple. 

 

Um... Agatha Christie says, "Hello".

[TomCruiseTop]

18 minutes ago, Porthos said:

 

Um... Agatha Christie says, "Hello".

 

I was thinking critical acclaim and sales (like Jim). Otherwise the best author would probably be whoever coined the phrase 'made in China'. 

[PPZVGOS]

It's quite amazing how many people discussing the global box-office forget or are totally unaware of the vagaries of the currency market fluctuations which can be quite extreme at times. 

 

To juxtapose Avatar & The Force Awakens on this very issue, let's just take an extreme example which however very well illustrates the issue at hand: Russian box-office. 

 

 

Avatar made $117.1M 

The Force Awakens made $25.95M 

 

That is a Siberia-sized gap between these two mega-blockbusters. Now, what explains this? First of all, Avatar was indeed more successful than The Force Awakens with Russian audiences, but was it 4.5 times more successful? Hell NO! 

 

When Avatar was released over there, the RUS ruble was at all-time highs versus the USD, ranging from 30 to 29 to the dollar. When The Force Awakens was released it was nearly at all-time lows ranging between 71 and 75 to the dollar. 

 

So, let us assume first that TFA was fortunate enough to enjoy the same ER as Avatar had 6 years prior: 73 x $25.95M = 1894M rubles / 29.5 = $64.2M 

 

TFA did more than half in local currency in relation to Avatar, not less than a fourth. 

 

If Avatar had the misfortune to suffer the ruble all-time lows then it would go down like this: $117M / 73 = 1.6 x 29.5 = $47.32M 

 

So, if the situation were reversed, then Avatar would appear to have made 27% less than TFA, even if in local currency it did almost twice as much. This is how much currency fluctuations can hurt a Hollywood movie at the BO. Now, not all countries experienced as a dramatic a devaluation as Russia did in 2015, but there were massive downside moves across LatAm, East Europe, parts of East Asia (to a lesser degree) and considerable down moves in the Canadian, Australian and Scandinavian currencies. Even the Euro, yen and British pound were relatively weak vis-a-vis the USD in late 2015/early 2016 and still are. BTW, the USD spiked both in late 2016 and late 2015. Damn, it's as if the USD has an anti-Star Wars agenda! 

 

Now, that I have gone back and checked the USD-EUR FX rates, when Avatar came out, the USD was only worth around 0.70 euros. When TFA came out, it was worth around 0.90. A massive difference. Something similar (or even worse) happened with Japan. Avatar had the USD at 90 yen, TFA had 115 to 120 yen to the USD. On and on it goes. 

 

This year, Rogue One has it even worse in most (not all) markets (the RUS and BRA currencies have very partially recovered) 

 

Edit: The USD won't be so strong 2 years down the line. One more year of USD bull-run would be my guess. 

Edited January 5, 2017 by PPZVGOS

[YM!]

6 hours ago, vc2002 said:

 

How exactly did you figure those numbers out?

Just a guess tbh. I think it'd increase due to how big it was in China in 2009 but not over $500M.

[4815162342]

3 hours ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

Orwell is the best 20th C writer as he sold the most books. Simple. 

 

That's now how it works. That's not how any of it works.

[That One Girl]

4 hours ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

I will make sure to use simple words for you from now on. Would not want you to become confused. 

 

Oh no, I wasn't confused.  I completely understood what they meant.  But it was so obvious you were using those words for the intention of sounding "smarter." 

[That One Girl]

4 hours ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

I am not fucking around. Orwell is the best 20th C writer as he sold the most books. Simple. 

 

Well, considering how many copies Fifty Shades of Grey sold, where are your praises for the wonderful works of E.L. James?

[RandomCat]

3 hours ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

I was thinking critical acclaim and sales (like Jim). Otherwise the best author would probably be whoever coined the phrase 'made in China'. 

 

I am in no way liking this casual equation of Agatha Christie to a 'made in' stamp. 

 

>.< especially since her novels are widely and critically acclaimed.

[TomCruiseTop]

1 hour ago, 4815162342 said:

 

That's now how it works. That's not how any of it works.

 

Maybe in the Soviet Union, but in the west it's exactly how it works. 

[TomCruiseTop]

1 hour ago, That One Guy said:

 

Well, considering how many copies Fifty Shades of Grey sold, where are your praises for the wonderful works of E.L. James?

 

In comparison to the books I'm thinking of FSoG was a tadpole, it's like comparing TPM to Avatar, one is a mole hill, the latter, Everest. 

[RandomCat]

16 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

In comparison to the books I'm thinking of FSoG was a tadpole, it's like comparing TPM to Avatar, one is a mole hill, the latter, Everest. 

 

18 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

Maybe in the Soviet Union, but in the west it's exactly how it works. 

 

Which would make Christie Queen of the Everest. Highest sales, with highest critical praise.

Edited January 5, 2017 by RandomJC

[IronJimbo]

9 hours ago, vc2002 said:

 

How the forum members react to this post

 

(BTW Tele starts at 01:00)

 

 

VC2000 always hating

 

[TomCruiseTop]

3 minutes ago, RandomJC said:

 

 

Which would make Christie Queen of the Everest. Highest sales, with highest critical praise.

 

I'm almost certain it would make whoever compiled The Bible and numerous other religious texts higher than her, and would probably place Mao Tse-tung higher too. I'm happy to help you compile a list of best selling books of all time. I'm not sure this is the correct place to do it though. 

[RandomCat]

3 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

I'm almost certain it would make whoever compiled The Bible and numerous other religious texts higher than her, and would probably place Mao Tse-tung higher too.

 

If we go by your criteria, yes.

Edited January 5, 2017 by RandomJC

[TomCruiseTop]

Just now, RandomJC said:

 

If we go by your criteria, yes.

 

What is it with people on this forum restating the obvious as a reply? It makes zero sense to me. 

 

If it were the criteria with which you seem to be confusing mine with I'd be called SpielbergScholar, please, learn to read. 

[IronJimbo]

8 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

What is it with people on this forum restating the obvious as a reply? It makes zero sense to me. 

 

If it were the criteria with which you seem to be confusing mine with I'd be called SpielbergScholar, please, learn to read. 

ouch leave him alone, not everyone is a scholar you know

[TomCruiseTop]

1 minute ago, IronJimbo said:

ouch leave him alone, not everyone is a scholar you know

 

Especially unlikely from Florida. 

 

That aside, what aspects of the first film are you hoping make a more profound return in the sequels? 

[RandomCat]

Just now, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

What is it with people on this forum restating the obvious as a reply? It makes zero sense to me. 

 

If it were the criteria with which you seem to be confusing mine with I'd be called SpielbergScholar, please, learn to read. 

 

Your criteria is fluctuant and poorly conceived. How do you compare EL James to Orwell in your TPM to Avatar? Critical success or financial? If critical, there are more authors who are more critically successful more consistently, and with higher marks. If you mean Financially, well there isn't even a question. On both those measures there are authors who are above and beyond Orwell. Rowling would far better fit.

[IronJimbo]

Just now, JamesCameronScholar said:

 

Especially unlikely from Florida. 

 

That aside, what aspects of the first film are you hoping make a more profound return in the sequels? 

 

Expecting the bar to be raised on cgi and visuals yet again, it will be the best thing we have seen in 9 years.

Wanting some nice action sequences

Enchanting pandora feeling, remember the 3d seeds scene? damn

I want to see more humans and more of Jims visionary sci fi tech