New Year's Day Weekend Thread: Late Friday estimates (DHD) - TLJ 19.5M, Jumanji 17.5M, PP3 6.7M, TGS 5.3M

[Rebeccas]

1 minute ago, Alli said:

The Beguiled is another movie with a big difference between critics and public. and i don't think that movie was mismarketed or was some misunderstood masterpiece. i have to side with the public on this one. bad movie indeed

IIRC, the trailers for that gave it a more of a tense thriller vibe and that simply wasn’t the film. 

[grey ghost]

30 minutes ago, WrathOfHan said:

A sub-3x from the holidays is fucking horrible no matter what way you spin it, especially when the last two movies in your franchise passed that mark with ease.

There has never been a direct sequel that opened to more than 73 million in December.

 

Not alot of fair comps for TLJ.

[JonathanLB]

16 minutes ago, NoLegMan said:

I hate Fury Road, but I wouldn't say it's a bad movie because most people disagree. 

I agree. It’s not really the movie’s fault for me though, it’s a thoroughly mediocre movie in every respect besides the stunt work. It’s not like it’s as much “bad” as it’s so overrated that I hate it. If a movie has cheesy hokey villains with almost no dialogue, poor acting, bad costumes, and ZERO plot and yet inspires people to talk about its “post-feminist ideals and philosophy” it’s so laughable as to be hateable. There’s nothing there. The emperor has no clothes. The movie has nothing to say about anything! It’s the most plotless blockbuster wonder ever created and deserves none of its attention. It was entertaining enough the first time and wow the second time I saw it... I dropped it from B- to C-. 

[NoLegMan]

https://www.flickeringmyth.com/2018/01/rumour-rian-johnson-begin-shooting-first-new-star-wars-trilogy-june/ 

[Rebeccas]

Just now, NoLegMan said:

https://www.flickeringmyth.com/2018/01/rumour-rian-johnson-begin-shooting-first-new-star-wars-trilogy-june/ 

He doesn’t even have a story treatment yet lol this is probably about IX

[Alli]

I think sometimes critics score a movie based on who is involved too or based on trends. I mean The Beguiled has 77% on metascore too which is huge. it just simply isn't a movie which deserves that high of a score.

 

How about the trend of scoring every Marvel film in the 90% on RT. Those movies are as formulaic as can be. they don't deserve those high percentages imo.  maybe the same can be said about TLJ.

[AndyLL]

53 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

No one is driving down TLJ's user scores that much. Every big film will have a certain chunk of troll votes and cheats on user scores, so it mostly all evens out. Whatever shenanigans a bit more extreme than normal may or may not have happened on RT, I can't imagine the audience score would be over 65% in any case. 

The only people saying something like this haven't read them.  Go read 2-3 pages of 1/2 star ratings for TLJ and then go read 2-3 pages of PP3 which has about the same audience rating.  You'll see the difference. 

 

It's pretty blatant.  

 

Online audience scores have always been worthless for fanboy movies which is why we've never used them before to try to prove a point. ( until TLJ for some reason )

[Deep Wang]

26 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

ESB is an irrelevant comparison because of the nature of how ANH played (a true "first run" would be more like 220m not that 307m #) and saying it dropped on par with AOTC is hardly helping your argument since that's widely considered to be the worst film in the saga, and TLJ had the advantage of coming off a far better received predecessor than AOTC did. 

 

Now it is, but at the time of release it was generally considered as better than TPM.  Funny how time has a way of changing minds, I'm very much looking forward to retrospectives on TLJ in 10 years or so.

 

Which is why all this shit doesn't matter.  Star Wars survived the fucking prequels, it will survive The Last Jedi.  

[ThiagoMaia]

4 minutes ago, Rebeccas said:

Of course there are objective measures for individual aspects of films but how or whether those things come together in the right way to make a “good” overall film is entirely up to the viewer. 

Yes, I think in that is why a person can recognize that a movie is good without really liking it. But even here, if we were to share our personal criteria for evaluating a movie we would habe a lot in common. I think that one of the most subjective aspects of a person's enjoyment of a movie is connection to characters.

[NoLegMan]

Just now, Rebeccas said:

He doesn’t even have a story treatment yet lol this is probably about IX

you are probably correct, but it is interesting if it ends up being true.

[That One Girl]

10 minutes ago, grey ghost said:

Yes, I can say my child's finger painting is better than a Picasso.

 

Very heart warming thought.

 

But that doesn't mean squat to most people, critical consensus does 

 

Holy false equivalency.

[Rebeccas]

Just now, The Last AndyLL said:

The only people saying something like this haven't read them.  Go read 2-3 pages of 1/2 star ratings for TLJ and then go read 2-3 pages of PP3 which has about the same audience rating.  You'll see the difference. 

 

It's pretty blatant.  

 

Online audience scores have always been worthless for fanboy movies which is why we've never used them before to try to prove a point. ( until TLJ for some reason )

I don’t think there’s ever been a film that had this big of a discrepancy though. We don’t really need online ratings for most movies cause they basically fall in line with the critics or they’re just more positive for brainless action movies. 

[LinksterAC]

6 minutes ago, Darth Boh-ne'er said:

 

Now it is, but at the time of release it was generally considered as better than TPM.  Funny how time has a way of changing minds, I'm very much looking forward to retrospectives on TLJ in 10 years or so.

 

Which is why all this shit doesn't matter.  Star Wars survived the fucking prequels, it will survive The Last Jedi.  

In my humble opinion, not only will it survive The Last Jedi, it will ultimately endure because of it.

Edited January 1, 2018 by LinksterAC

[grey ghost]

3 minutes ago, JonathanLB said:

I agree. It’s not really the movie’s fault for me though, it’s a thoroughly mediocre movie in every respect besides the stunt work. It’s not like it’s as much “bad” as it’s so overrated that I hate it. If a movie has cheesy hokey villains with almost no dialogue, poor acting, bad costumes, and ZERO plot and yet inspires people to talk about its “post-feminist ideals and philosophy” it’s so laughable as to be hateable. There’s nothing there. The emperor has no clothes. The movie has nothing to say about anything! It’s the most plotless blockbuster wonder ever created and deserves none of its attention. It was entertaining enough the first time and wow the second time I saw it... I dropped it from B- to C-. 

@Lor San Tele

[grey ghost]

5 minutes ago, That One Guy said:

 

Holy false equivalency.

Are you saying the quality of a Picasso is not subjective?

 

Please explain.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2018 by grey ghost

[MovieMan89]

7 minutes ago, The Last AndyLL said:

The only people saying something like this haven't read them.  Go read 2-3 pages of 1/2 star ratings for TLJ and then go read 2-3 pages of PP3 which has about the same audience rating.  You'll see the difference. 

 

It's pretty blatant.  

 

Online audience scores have always been worthless for fanboy movies which is why we've never used them before to try to prove a point. ( until TLJ for some reason )

Actually, reading the first few pages of bad user reviews on RT, a large chunk aren't even of the "childhood ruined" ilk. Lots of them are complaining about weak plot, too boring, weak character development, not following up on TFA's plot points satisfactorily, etc. 

Edited January 1, 2018 by MovieMan89

[That One Girl]

1 minute ago, grey ghost said:

Are you saying the quality of a Picasso is not subjective?

 

Please explain.

 

 

 

Jesus fucking christ dude.  You're comparing an artist who paints for a living to a 7 year old child who painted for fun.  Comparing two films is different, since most people who make a full feature film are professionals that do it for a living as well.

[MCKillswitch123]

1 hour ago, grey ghost said:

Give me a list of "bad" movies with over 90% on RT.

 

Should be easy since the score is meaningless.

Well, there are movies like There Will Be Blood and Juno that I personally didn't really like that much when I saw them. The Tree Of Life has 84% - which is close to 90% - and I think it totally sucks.

 

Emphasis on "I personally didn't like them". As in ME, I DIDN'T LIKE THEM. Because I'm not a sheep that follows RT blindly and I can think on my own. If I dislike a movie with high reviews (or a vice-versa scenario), so be it, I don't care. But I will not give in to whatever idea there is that a movie is objectively good because a website says that a lot of people agree on it being good. Since when is art "objective", after all?

 

Consensus is obviously helpful and indicative that there is, in a well reviewed movie's case, higher chance of me liking a movie than not. However, it doesn't mean that a movie is objectively good, period.

[grey ghost]

10 minutes ago, Alli said:

I think sometimes critics score a movie based on who is involved too or based on trends. I mean The Beguiled has 77% on metascore too which is huge. it just simply isn't a movie which deserves that high of a score.

 

How about the trend of scoring every Marvel film in the 90% on RT. Those movies are as formulaic as can be. they don't deserve those high percentages imo.  maybe the same can be said about TLJ.

90% doesn't mean a movie is a masterpiece. It means the vast majority of critics recommend the film.

 

Love or hate Marvels winning formula, it's not a deal breaker for critics.

[grey ghost]

5 minutes ago, That One Guy said:

 

Jesus fucking christ dude.  You're comparing an artist who paints for a living to a 7 year old child who painted for fun.  Comparing two films is different, since most people who make a full feature film are professionals that do it for a living as well.

Don't curse at me, you fucking porg.

 

Is the quality of Picasso's art subjective or objective?

 

Yes or no.

 

It either is or it isn't.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2018 by grey ghost