The Marvels | November 10, 2023 | Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter

[Johnny Tran]

1 hour ago, TheFlatLannister said:

I would say $10M previews is the absolute ceiling if everything goes right, so o/u $70M OW which is still pretty bad. 

 

What's the production budget on this?  Apologies this isn't a movie that's been on my radar too much so I have questions that may have been answered pages ago. 

[Johnny Tran]

So here's a couple things I'm thinking about.  By the way, I do like Monica and 'Ms. Marvel' was a decent enough show IMO.  

 

1. There was a lot of talk about 'Captain Marvel' having an Avengers "bump" as it was sandwiched between two of the biggest movies of all time.  Do the low tracking numbers for this show that the bump was very significant? Also,  there was talk about the word of mouth not being great,  does the tracking speak to that at all ?

 

2. I'm shocked that they have taken so long on developing an X-Men story arc for the MCU.  It seems to me like that was the obvious direction once they acquired the rights to make those movies but so far there's nothing on that front and I think the MCU as a whole is missing star power. 

[HummingLemon496]

Yeah at this point I actually agree with the "MCU is on a decline" thing. When Multiverse of Madness had bad legs and everyone said "OMG MCU IS DYING" I didn't believe it by now I do

[HummingLemon496]

2 hours ago, TheFlatLannister said:

I would say $10M previews is the absolute ceiling if everything goes right, so o/u $70M OW which is still pretty bad. 

Good word of mouth = Eternals/Black Adam level flop

Bad word of mouth = The Flash level bomb

[fede75]

3 hours ago, Bob Train said:

One of the issues with the movie is it is not clear what the stakes are here. You watch the first trailer of NWH and it's obvious what happening there: Peter screws up the multiverse, bringing in past characters from previous Spidey movies. Even the trailer for Thor 4, Wakanda make it obvious.

 

I watched both trailers and I still have no idea what the stakes are here, or who's the villain. The only thing being mentioned constantly is the location-swapping ability, which is not nearly enough to carry a movie on it's own. And is not all that interesting TBH.

 

And bringing in 2 Disney+ sidekicks is one hell of a choice, considering the MCU is feeling very disjointed right now, with no clear characters being focused on. If this was a movie where Captain Marvel teams up with another actual important character it would do a lot better.

Monica was a Captain Marvel in the comics and was a secondary character in the first Captain Marvel movie. It makes a lot of sense having her as co-protagonist of a Captain Marvel sequel. Like having both T challa and Shuri as Black Panther in a Black Panther sequel. Kamala is in this case the sidekick/team up

[Liiviig 1998]

2 hours ago, Johnny Tran said:

 

What's the production budget on this?  Apologies this isn't a movie that's been on my radar too much so I have questions that may have been answered pages ago. 

220m . UK tax subsidy  is already deducted from that.

 

[fede75]

btw in an  interview from early this year Feige said that he thinks Monica and Kamala are characters very well liked by the general public. Clearly he make a very big mistake on what the public that don't read comics think about Monica after Wandavision ( i think would have been better if the Monica of the illuminati universe was Captain Marvel there instead of her mom Maria) 

Edited October 16, 2023 by fede75

[BOfficeStats]

6 hours ago, Arlborn said:

Uhm, your point is interesting but Days of Future Past came out in 2014 and Logan came out in 2017.

I probably should have reworded that to say "By May 2016, audiences were still fresh off of the disappointment of recent PG-13 Sony, Fox, and WB superhero films and widely viewed the MCU as the only superhero franchise capable of consistently producing good superhero movies.  This gave the franchise a halo effect and a shield against criticism ("at least its not a train wreck like [insert Fox/Sony/WB superhero film]").  

Edited October 16, 2023 by BOfficeStats

[Sckathian]

2 hours ago, fede75 said:

Monica was a Captain Marvel in the comics and was a secondary character in the first Captain Marvel movie. It makes a lot of sense having her as co-protagonist of a Captain Marvel sequel. Like having both T challa and Shuri as Black Panther in a Black Panther sequel. Kamala is in this case the sidekick/team up

The audience that drove the first film to a billion is made up of people who have never touched a comic book in their lives.

[Alexander]

2 hours ago, Liiviig 1998 said:

220m . UK tax subsidy  is already deducted from that.

 

But that number was dated to September 30, 2022. Since that they had two or three rounds of reshoots + post-production. I think that real budget will be $240-250m absolute minimum.

[Madhuvan]

Again have to say that and I agree with many of you

 

The film should have been titled:

 

Captain Marvel: Secret Invasion 

 

Monica has a bit of a role and in the end, becomes an important secondary character/lead character

Kamala is teased in the end and after that, they could have made The Marvels or CM3. whatever they wanted 

[Madhuvan]

The simple fact is, that Brie will be blamed for this failure when this failure is because of Kevin and MCU 

[Dominic Draper]

7 hours ago, Bob Train said:

MCU has wasted all its female characters so far. Black Widow was not given a movie until after she died. Wanda was given the most nonsensical motivations ever in MoM, butchering her character. Captain Marvel is written in the most boring way possible and had a 5-minute screentime nothing burger role in Endgame.

 

Let's hope they do better with X-Men, as so far the female characters have been handled very badly. 

I still struggle to understand why wanda vision seemed to be well liked in the MCU fan base and MoM gets attacked.

 

Everything people say they hate about MoM is present in and/or started by Wanda Vision.

[Dominic Draper]

6 hours ago, MovieMan89 said:

Carol was a terribly dull written character in all her appearances thus far. Brie brought zero charisma to compensate for that either. At the end of the day, none of the Internet “toxic sabotage” would matter one bit for the character’s popularity if that wasn’t the case. 

I think Brie is a great character actor and meant for dramas and indies. She doesn't have the charisma/screen presence for blockbusters. She was dull and lifeless in Fast X as well. 

[Mojoguy]

Seems like the strike is going to hurt this the most. Would have really increased awareness if the three leads were doing interviews everywhere.

[Valencia]

18 minutes ago, Mojoguy said:

Seems like the strike is going to hurt this the most. Would have really increased awareness if the three leads were doing interviews everywhere.

Nah.

 

That just increases the chances of Brie saying something stupid and causing unnecessary controversy.

[toutvabien]

Don't know if I necessarily agree with the point of making this a Secret Invasion film instead of what we're getting. However, since Dar-Benn's whole point is that she has a personal vendetta against Carol, because of "unintended consequences of her actions as the intergalactic super-powered protector" which adds up thematically to how her responsibilities as a hero have also kept her apart from Monica all those years, it would have been more impactful if Skrulls were seeking for revenge and reparations from her. I know they already did that with Fury in SI, but Carol is referenced in that very show as just as responsible. Feels like there is an in-universe thread already written involving a powerful, rising force that wants to get back to Captain Marvel, connecting to the first film and the lore of the Skrulls in the MCU, but from what they've shown, it's probably gonna get a small mention in the actual film.

[TomThomas]

Fake movie.

[AMC Theaters Enjoyer]

1 hour ago, Mojoguy said:

Seems like the strike is going to hurt this the most. Would have really increased awareness if the three leads were doing interviews everywhere.

 

Agreed, I am genuinely shocked that they stuck through with the November date even after it was clear the strike wasn't ending by mid-September. 

 

I've said this before, but if your film is being sold on the dynamic between your leads....why would you not want to make sure said leads are out promoting the film together? This isn't a criticism of the film, more on Disney for being morons. 

[THUNDER BIRD]

3 hours ago, Sckathian said:

The audience that drove the first film to a billion is made up of people who have never touched a comic book in their lives.

Entire MCU became so big die to the fact that they attracted general public who haven't read much comics, if any at all.