Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny | June 30 2023 | Very mixed reviews out of Cannes

[scytheavatar]

3 hours ago, ThomasNicole said:

Yeah of course it’s a mess, do you see how Disney overall is doing? The problem comes from above , Disney is stucked and don’t know how to move forward, they only know how to sell nostalgia and this isn’t working anymore

 

LF was doing fine before TLJ that is one the most critically acclaimed blockbusters of the past decade, but when the fans turned into savage beasts, Disney freakout completely, ep IX was damage hard because of that. She didn’t pissed the fans, she gave creative freedom to a director that try to go into new places with the franchise and the freaks didn’t accept it, putting her in this weird position in a franchise that simply can’t move forward and Disney behind her putting pressure scared of online backlash.

 

The TV shows are supervised by other people way more than KK

 

What is she supposed to do? It’s not her fault that all her plans of trying new things have to be stopped due to a bunch of loud weirdos.

 

Solo is probably the only movie where really the chaos seems to be because of her, and honestly that’s nothing unusual, Thor 2 have similar trouble production to keep in the Disney house

 

 

 

 

Lucasfilm made The Mandalorian which was loved both by old fans and those new to Star Wars. Why is it so hard to make stuff which is unifying and universally loved by everyone?

 

3 hours ago, ThomasNicole said:

Indiana Jones is a damaged brand mainly because everyone hated Indy 4 and is being attacked online by the same weirdos

 

 

Indiana Jones is a damaged brand because it already had a prefect ending with Last Crusade. There never was a reason for Indy 4 to exist and now they want to make an Indy 5?

 

Edited June 29, 2023 by scytheavatar

[ListenHunnyUrOver]

5 minutes ago, scytheavatar said:

Why is it so hard to make stuff which is unifying and universally loved by everyone?

Is this a serious question? 

[scytheavatar]

3 minutes ago, ListenHunnyUrOver said:

Is this a serious question? 

 

Ok, more accurately I know it's hard to make that. But stuff like The Mandalorian shows that it can be done.

[ListenHunnyUrOver]

Decent legs might be possible, but I’m worried about how tepid even the positive reactions are. 

[WorkingonaName]

Indy really needed a Skyfall level movie to keep relevance. 

[Hatebox]

A common complaint from (as far as I can tell) good-faith fans on Reddit who’ve seen it is that the middle act is the phoebe waller-bridge show and Indy takes a very noticeable backseat. Maybe that’s just garden-variety misogyny but it would explain why she’s so prominent in marketing. 

[FunkMiller]

5 hours ago, ThomasNicole said:

Oh sure it’s absolutely normal behavior to boycott things over female characters, attack every person of color in the franchise, harassing the producer and think change something about a franchise is the same of destroying their childhood 

 

No one is obligated to pay for anything or watch anything but you don’t have to behave like a bunch of Karens about it either. Don’t like it? Move on and watch other things.
 

These people spend the last year having meltdowns about Indiana Jones having Phoebe in the cast, if you don’t see how pitiful this is maybe your ideas of why the country is falling apart are fundamentally childish and you should rethink.

 

The worst part of the whole asinine culture war is that the emphasis is placed in completely the wrong place when it comes to poor film making.

 

Kathleen Kennedy isn’t a poor studio head because she champions more representation…

 

…she’s a poor studio head because she allows the kind of corporate mandated, focus group strangled, safe, reactionary dreck Lucasfilm have been producing for years to be made. Rey is an awful character. But it’s not because she’s female. 
 

 

[TomThomas]

3 hours ago, TerwillikerInst said:

This is purely anecdotal, but I'm a member of several James Bond fan forums and as you might imagine they fit the target Indiana Jones revival sequel demographic perfectly, mostly middle-aged center/center-right white men. 

 

And while for ages the various Indiana Jones subthreads have been filled with a lot of negativity ("it's going to be woke", critical drinker videos, doomcock, all the usual suspects) those who have seen the movie have been pretty overwhelmingly positive and surprised at how positive they've been.

 

Not sure how much you can read into that necessarily, but I do think it might bode better for WOM, at least among that demographic. 

 

The question is, will they see it in theatres, and what will others think?

 

Critical Drinker did like 4 or 5 bait videos on Indy 5, with the first one before they even started principal photography and it had millions of views. The guy wanted it to be bad so much and greatly contributed to overall negativity, idk why.

[Xavier]

It’s so obvious at this point: the hate for the movie does not come from the actual film specifics. It’s a mix between misogyny towards PWB who made the cardinal sin of being Fleabag (go see it) and the accumulated hate towards LF and Disney for “ruining childhoods”. 
I unfortunately encountered some videos on YouTube that were frankly embarrassing to watch: 50yo manbabies/anti feminists stopping short of inciting violence against PWB. 
Do these people think that Harrison Ford would take part in a movie where his most beloved character would be sidelined like that?

[TomThomas]

The whole hate against PWB is the most artifical and forced hate I've seen in a long time, most of those gamers can't even explain why they hate her. I've never watched anything with her, but Fleabag has great reception across the board and not review bombed, I've never come across any controversial quotes from her that could trigger this reaction, unlike Brie Larson, and her contributions to No Time To Die are widely considered some of the best parts of the movie even by gamer crowd. So what's the whole deal? Did I miss something? If this movie has noticeable problems, I'm pretty sure they have nothing to do with PWB.

Edited June 29, 2023 by TomThomas

[Last Man Standing]

3 hours ago, scytheavatar said:

 

 

Indiana Jones is a damaged brand because it already had a prefect ending with Last Crusade. There never was a reason for Indy 4 to exist and now they want to make an Indy 5?

 

What do you mean there was never a reason for Indy 4 to exist? Was there a reason for Indy 1 to exist? There are countless of stories that can be told with Indiana Jones, and between the old point and click games and the books, plenty of stories have already been told, this is a character, like James Bond, that does not need a definite ending, and can continue pretty much forever once they find the balls to recast Ford.

[FunkMiller]

41 minutes ago, TomThomas said:

The whole hate against PWB is the most artifical and forced hate I've seen in a long time, most of those gamers can't even explain why they hate her. I've never watched anything with her, but Fleabag has great reception across the board and not review bombed, I've never come across any controversial quotes from her that could trigger this reaction, unlike Brie Larson, and her contributions to No Time To Die are widely considered some of the best parts of the movie even by gamer crowd. So what's the whole deal? Did I miss something? If this movie has noticeable problems, I'm pretty sure they have nothing to do with PWB.

 

Why are you referring to them as 'gamers?'

 

Billions of people play video games. Are they all basement manbabies?

[ZattMurdock]

5 hours ago, Potiki said:

Just got out of watching this with my grandfather (who is in his 80s) was pretty damn good, both of us have it easily over Crystal Skull which is a film I probably like more than most but thank god there was no monkey business in this one if you catch my drift. For me this is the best big budget adventure film in recent time, no offence intended for the Jumanji sequels and Jungle Cruise which I enjoyed but this is on another level in terms of action and story. 

 

Personal ranking would be:
 

1. Raiders 

2. Temple of Doom

3. Dial of Destiny 

4. Last Crusade

5. Crystal Skull 

 

Also I'm not going to weigh in to whatever discourse is happening above. I will say this is probably the last Indy film (even if it earns a bunch of money hard to see Harrison Ford coming back and after Solo I doubt Lucasfilm would make an Indy without Ford) and I'm happy that this is in my opinion a much more fitting ending for the character than the fourth film. 

Love this post. Thanks for sharing it.

[FunkMiller]

15 minutes ago, Last Man Standing said:

What do you mean there was never a reason for Indy 4 to exist? Was there a reason for Indy 1 to exist? There are countless of stories that can be told with Indiana Jones, and between the old point and click games and the books, plenty of stories have already been told, this is a character, like James Bond, that does not need a definite ending, and can continue pretty much forever once they find the balls to recast Ford.

 

The fact that no one's really come along who could do that is probably the main reason why we have this film and Crystal Skull. Ford is just so bloody good at 'leading adventure man' that it's proven almost impossible to find someone who can match him. 

[ZattMurdock]

1 minute ago, FunkMiller said:

 

The fact that no one's really come along who could do that is probably the main reason why we have this film and Crystal Skull. Ford is just so bloody good at 'leading adventure man' that it's proven almost impossible to find someone who can match him. 

I just feel like in a world full of Batmen, Spider-Men and James Bonds, it’s nice to have Indiana Jones across this 42 years. But maybe that’s just me.

[ZattMurdock]

1 hour ago, TomThomas said:

The whole hate against PWB is the most artifical and forced hate I've seen in a long time, most of those gamers can't even explain why they hate her. I've never watched anything with her, but Fleabag has great reception across the board and not review bombed, I've never come across any controversial quotes from her that could trigger this reaction, unlike Brie Larson, and her contributions to No Time To Die are widely considered some of the best parts of the movie even by gamer crowd. So what's the whole deal? Did I miss something? If this movie has noticeable problems, I'm pretty sure they have nothing to do with PWB.

Brie Larson hasn’t said anything that should spring the hate of anyone either. It’s just misogynistic shit repeated ad nauseam. 

[Celedhring]

I have seen the movie. I didn't love it, didn't hate it either. Some of the criticism is wide off the mark though - PWB for example is a great foil to Indy, and livened up a middle act that otherwise was pretty bland.

Also, the movie has a good approach to Indiana Jones as a character - he's treated with maturity. It's probably the one movie among the recent crop of nostalgia bait that does the aging hero the best. Indy is vulnerable - the world has moved on, and he's lonely.  I found that part of the movie fresh (and in the right dose, it doesn't overdo the drama). In that regard, I found the ending quite satisfying.

 

Again, the main sin of the movie is that the action scenes are bland and unimaginative. There are all the required bits of an Indy movie (tombs! puzzles! creepy crawlies! chases in exotic locales!), but there's little creativity and imagination, particulary compared to how wickedly fun and inventive the old ones were. The best one is the opening 1945 scene - although it's marred a bit by the ocasional drifts into uncanny valley and the accompanying darkness to cover all the SFX. But it's fun, perfectly paced, and feels very Indy-ish.

 

All in all, the problem is that there's very little memorable stuff in this film. Exception is the ending which I thought was clever, but I think many people will dislike it for being "too much". Myself, I felt they could have milked the idea even more. 

 

EDIT: As a side note the Temple of Doom poster that my parents got me when the movie came out in the 1980s is framed and hanging in my living room - it has followed me to every place I've lived. I'm certainly the target demographic, which makes it weird that I'm so tepid on it.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Celedhring

[vale9001]

30 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

I just feel like in a world full of Batmen, Spider-Men and James Bonds, it’s nice to have Indiana Jones across this 42 years. But maybe that’s just me.

 

This. The indiana Jones nostalgia movie was already made in 2008.

They neeeded to make already a reboot with a new indiana made by a new young actor. 

Cool actor + ij brand and you could have It young people and still the old audience.

 

This thing indiana Jones is only Harrison Ford Is boring.

People Always say the same and then as you said you got new loved Batman, spidermans, bonds etc..

And don't tell me Sean connery as bond wasn't a living legend. 

 

Between Ford here and Keaton Batman on the flash seems like the nostlagia effect Is becaming inoffensive. Let's hope this means Hollywood will try new things.

Edited June 29, 2023 by vale9001

[DAJK]

Really wanted to love this but I’m pretty tepid on it. The prologue sequence is great, Harrison/PWB both do great jobs and I actually enjoyed both of their characters and what the script did with each of them. It was very fitting for a “final” Indy movie, and for these characters and their relationships. Action was fun, if slightly overlong and repetitive, and for a good hour and a half it felt really good to be watching a movie that really “felt” like Indiana Jones. It was never Raiders/Crusade level, but I had a fun time.

 

But the final 30 minutes (give or take), which I won’t mention any details for, really brought this movie down from a screenplay perspective. Thematically the “final shots” didn’t feel earned, nor did the plot bring the characters/story to the “natural conclusion” the writers seemed to want it to go. Some weird choices made here (one in particular that I’m sure a lot of people will know what I’m talking about). And what frustrated me more about the ending was that the rest of the script actually sets itself up for a thematically-rich, emotional, and action-combined-with-stakes ending, that the film then seemed to ignore. Really weird choices, and I wasn’t a fan at all.

 

Overall, it’s almost the reverse Rogue One for me. That movie had a decent first two acts, followed by an absolutely amazing third act that left audiences on a high. This movie has a decent first two acts, followed by an occasionally-baffling finale, and I’m not sure how audiences will respond to it. Maybe they’ll love it and I’m just out of touch, but I could think of 3-4 different “finales” to this movie that would have worked better.

[FunkMiller]

18 minutes ago, vale9001 said:

 

This. The indiana Jones nostalgia movie was already made in 2008.

They neeeded to make already a reboot with a new indiana made by a new young actor. 

Cool actor + ij brand and you could have It young people and still the old audience.

 

 

You just described why Sony made such a huge mistake with Uncharted and Tom Holland.