The Dark Knight Rises

[Phil in the Blank]

I don't need anyone pity. I am happy that I am not a blind servant ready to eat up whatever it is that Nolan has given to me.

Lol.

[JackO]

HULK, may be the smartest guy writing a movie blog today but I believe he made a fundamental mistep in his piece. There is a central through-line in this picture that ties the story together and that through-line is hope. The whole movie is based around this core them, Right up to the last frame when Alfred's hopes for his master are fulfilled.

To be honest most criticism of this work are just....odd. We have the same people who cry about the films length, complain about potholes like how Bruce got back to Gotham after escaping the prison. He is mother-fucking batman, seeing how he did this is irrelevant yet apparently you want a 3 hour 10 minute movie even though 160 mins was already too long....what?

If the movie did not connect to you then it's easy to nitpick this film to death. Hell it is easy to nitpick any film to death if it did not connect to you. There are potholes in TDK that you could literally drive a school bus into yet somehow that movie escapes criticism on here. Why do people hold films up to different standards I will never know.

Been saying the same thing over on the TDKR spoiler thread in the Bat Cave. But obviously the not-Nolainites don't want others to show the criticism in that film is similar to criticism in the TDKR.Cognitive dissonance.

[redfirebird2008]

There are potholes in TDK that you could literally drive a school bus into yet somehow that movie escapes criticism on here.

haha, indeed. I thought the school bus thing was awesome, but definitely a plot hole. Likewise with Joker rigging the hospital to blow up. How the hell did he pull off that one? Who cares. Still an awesome scene. Same with Batman's fire symbol in TDKR. How the hell did he have the time to pull that one off? Who cares. Goosebump scene regardless. "Light it up."

[pinocchio]

If the movie did not connect to you then it's easy to nitpick this film to death. Hell it is easy to nitpick any film to death if it did not connect to you. There are potholes in TDK that you could literally drive a school bus into yet somehow that movie escapes criticism on here. Why do people hold films up to different standards I will never know.

There are no different standards. You can get away with a lot of plot holes. If you have a good, tight script you can sell the audience more or less anything. If you have a lazy, bloated, underdeveloped script like the one for TDKR you are in trouble because the audience simply won't buy the shit you created.

[Adm56]

I think some folks who claim to have read the HULK piece didn't. Or didn't understand it. Especially if you are falling back on the whole nitpicking plotholes argument. He doesn't dwell on plot holes at all.Theme resonants more with some that with others. I think that Nolan pays lip service to the theme of 'hope' but doesn't quite pull it off.Similar thoughts crossed my mind while watching X-Men First Class the other day (another film that IMO disappoints). You could say the theme is racism or I suppose 'embracing who you are' but it's just too blatant and on the nose throughout:

When the CIA base is attacked....the guards making faces through the window before the Beast shuts the curtain....the whole 'leave us normal people alone!' thing before the last guard is killed off camera. All passing references to the overall theme in a tell don't show kind of way. So yeah I guess the theme is there but in a by the numbers / lipservice way.

Edited July 26, 2012 by Adm56

[JackO]

Nitpicking the TDKR nitpickers

http://blogs.indiewire.com/criticwire/nitpicking-the-dark-knight-rises-nitpickers

Are critics more willing to write nitpick posts because they can get away with more criticism that way? I don't know, although Ehrlich does posit an interesting theory why comic book fans embrace nitpicking even as they reject negative reviews. "Plot," he says "is something that can be incontrovertible." Nitpicking, he adds, "is a much easier tact than... arguing that [something] doesn't work in an artistic way."

[JackO]

There are no different standards. You can get away with a lot of plot holes. If you have a good, tight script you can sell the audience more or less anything. If you have a lazy, bloated, underdeveloped script like the one for TDKR you are in trouble because the audience simply won't buy the shit you created.

That's a lot of hyperbole for such little substance.

[redfirebird2008]

I think some folks who claim to have read the HULK piece didn't. Or didn't understand it. Especially if you are falling back on the whole nitpicking plotholes argument. He doesn't dwell on plot holes at all.Theme resonants more with some that with others. I think that Nolan pays lip service to the theme of 'hope' but doesn't quite pull it off.Similar thoughts crossed my mind while watching X-Men First Class the other day (another film that IMO disappoints). You could say the theme is racism or I suppose 'embracing who you are' but it's just too blatant and on the nose throughout:

When the CIA base is attacked....the guards making faces through the window before the Beast shuts the curtain....the whole 'leave us normal people alone!' thing before the last guard is killed off camera. All passing references to the overall theme in a tell don't show kind of way. So yeah I guess the theme is there but in a by the numbers / lipservice way.

Is that what I think it is? Yep, spoiler tag in the spoiler section.

[Adm56]

Another HULK article to read if you're just going to keep using the tired 'nitpicking' defense.http://filmcrithulk.wordpress.com/2011/06/07/hulk-essay-your-ass-tangible-details-and-the-nature-of-criticism/

[Adm56]

Is that what I think it is? Yep, spoiler tag in the spoiler section.

Now you are just being difficult. I figured it was polite since I was spoiling a movie that wasn't the subject of this thread.

[redfirebird2008]

Now you are just being difficult. I figured it was polite since I was spoiling a movie that wasn't the subject of this thread.

I'm just saying pretty much all of us have seen XFC. And for those of you that haven't, shame on you people! Go rent it now.

[cremino]

There are no different standards. You can get away with a lot of plot holes. If you have a good, tight script you can sell the audience more or less anything. If you have a lazy, bloated, underdeveloped script like the one for TDKR you are in trouble because the audience simply won't buy the shit you created.

But the majority of the audience seems to like it.........

[The Dark Rock]

This looked to me the most ambitious Batman movie from Nolan on epic scale. However the coherence seems to be lacking compared to the other two. At times the pace was uneven which was bit surprising given how Nolan commands it. It still though is an excellent movie overall. The trilogy comes to full circle with The Dark Knight Rises. Nolan weaves TDKR like bridge between Batman Begins and TDK but the heart is closer to the more emotional and atmospheric Batman Begins (was great to see the focus on Wayne again which I felt was missing in TDK). And oh the climax was stupendous with all the chaos, twists, action till the very artistic including the last scene with Michael Caine :)The acting was great overall and unfortunately poor Bane seems to be fallen for being compared with Ledger/Joker. May be if this came before TDK people would have liked him more.I need to see it again to judge where TDKR stands in the trilogy. But as of now I will say TDK (9/10)>TDKR(8/10) while BB (10/10) still remains my favorite.Some movies are liked even more on second viewing. "Sometimes movie deserves more...sometimes movie deserves to have their faith rewarded" (TDK..changed "people" to "movie" here)

Edited July 26, 2012 by The Dark Rock

[baumer]

That's a lot of hyperbole for such little substance.

There's nothing hyperbolic at all about his statement. Just truth.

[JackO]

There's nothing hyperbolic at all about his statement. Just truth.

Truth is usually backed up with facts. Like examples of scenes in the movie that could back up the opinion. Like he said he thought it was bloated, but I felt that each character that had an arc, got it completed in the runtime, even with the smaller characters like Matthew Modine.Then he called it lazy which can't be true since Nolan supposedly worked on the script for 3 years. Same with underdeveloped. 3 years is a lot of time to incubate ideas. Maybe if he showed what he was talking about I would be more receptive to it.

[Dementeleus]

All three Nolan films -- for me -- have been somewhat blocky and awkward from a structural perspective, but with several standout action and emotional sequences that drive each movie. The connective tissue between each sequence is a bit haphazard occasionally, but as a whole each movie is highly impressive in their own right.

[ddddeeee]

I saw the movie again today, consciously trying to ignore many of the issues I had before and enjoyed it quite a bit more. Hathaway completely owns it and I'm embarrassed for doubting her.But I just cannot get over Blake's first scene with Bruce and how he knows he's Batman, just because... Really horrible stuff there.

[Crusader]

Kept the expectations in check and came out pleased as hell First off ... all the little plot holes and some trouble with pacing prevent this from being the perfect movie TDK was ... but its still a notch above BB I'm mostly nitpicky about stuff like Bane being blown up by Catwoman so easily ... I mean come on he deserved a better send off after being the main villain for 150 minutes ... but those are small things In the end 9/10 TDK was a 10 and BB was an 8

[Gopher]

If the movie did not connect to you then it's easy to nitpick this film to death. Hell it is easy to nitpick any film to death if it did not connect to you. There are potholes in TDK that you could literally drive a school bus into yet somehow that movie escapes criticism on here. Why do people hold films up to different standards I will never know.

This is what I've been saying all along. I've honestly prefered reading reviews like Hulk's that address the film head-on than these nonconstructive lists of gripes that every movie blog seems to be posting. There's a reason everyone nitpicked Prometheus to death because the film itself is a house of cards in terms of storytelling and thematic resonance. I'm not doubting these plotholes in TDKR (though more than a few of them can be logically assumed) but I resonated with the themes, characters and tone of the film and I'm not ashamed of it. Edited July 27, 2012 by Gopher

[The Dark Alfred]

I think it was much more ambitious than BB and TDK together. TDKR had its flaws, but it's in incredibly human story, you won't realize you're watching a SH film until Bruce's return to Gotham. It's working perfectly at emotional levels, Bruce and Alfred's relationship, Bruce vs Bruce, Bruce and Blake, Batman and Gordon - all tied up perfectly.I can understand why some people dislike it and call it a mess, because there's a lot going on with plenty of chatracters, but trust me it gets clearer with multiple viewing. I can also see why for some it's better than TDK, because the human element of the story is powerful. Actually the negative voice is much quiter than I thought, Inception got the same level of criticism and that film was flawless for me. Nolan's best work and it just grows on me after each viewing. BB is ageing well as well, whereas TDK was an instant classic.For me it's then perfect trilogy, none of the films are perfect alone, but each has strenghs at different areas.BB first act, TDK second act, TDKR third act = PERFECT FILM

Edited July 27, 2012 by The Dark Alfred