The Little Mermaid | Disney | May 26, 2023 | Queen Halle will rule the summer!

[Valonqar]

I don't buy the This Ariel or That Ariel argument. both are canon in their respective media (animation, live action) so kids will have both. They won't stop making Cartoon Belle or Cartoon Maleficent merch just because they have live action versions. They'll coordinate them. Same thing with Ariel. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Valonqar

[shayhiri]

15 hours ago, expensiveho said:

This. Hollywood is realizing that minorities are bringing cash. It's not about diversity or being inclusive or "SJW". It's about what brings them more money.

 

Bingo. Nothing noble here.

 

Let's see though if they made the right decision with this movie. The BO will show.

[jedijake]

10 minutes ago, Valonqar said:

I don't buy the This Ariel or That Ariel argument. both are canon in their respective media (animation, live action) so kids will have both. They won't stop making Cartoon Belle or Cartoon Maleficent merch just because they have live action versions. They'll coordinate them. Same thing with Ariel. 

You missed my point though. It's not that there can't be both. It's that there will be some folks who feel a bit of racist guilt if they sway toward "white" Ariel instead of the new Ariel. This is not the same as cartoon/real Belle or cartoon/real Maleficent. There will be inevitable social/societal differences between whether one buys "white" or "black" Ariel merchandise. Don't kid yourself. In America at least, kids (or adults) walking around with "old" Ariel stuff will be seen as racist no matter what by some people. Merchandise from the 1989 Ariel will phase out very very quickly. They will also have no choice but to re-hire Ariel meet/greets and change their rides, shows, etc in order to not look racist (which was their intention to avoid in the first place ironically).

[UserHN]

33 minutes ago, Ororo Munroe said:

I also think who they cast as Triton and Prince Eric will factor into all of this. I'll be surprised if they don't go for a big/popular name for one or both. 

Many names are being thrown out on Twitter for Prince Eric, the most absurb being that of a member of a Kpop boy band (BTS). If they have to cast a very popular actor/singer in the role, I'd suggest Harry Styles. I think he's the current most popular singer-turned-actor worldwide. It also seems like Idris Elba is the Black Twitter favorite for Triton.

Edited July 4, 2019 by UserHN

[Valonqar]

I see what you mean now @jedijake

 

@UserHN Why is a member of Kpop an absurd choice? Kpop is huge in Asia, a market where most BOT members expect trouble for TLM. 

 

also, another white love interest for black character to pine for? I get that Hollywood thinks this is the height of wokeness but when you scratch the surface you always end up with the white character being the unattainable glorified prize that black character strives to be worthy of or some shit. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Valonqar

[TomCruiseTop]

33 minutes ago, Ororo Munroe said:

Do pale-skinned people have a monoply on ginger hair? 

In nature, yes. Although I am fully aware mermaids do not exist in nature. 

 

17 minutes ago, shayhiri said:

 

Bingo. Nothing noble here.

 

Let's see though if they made the right decision with this movie. The BO will show.

It's hardly a 'hot take'. Anyone who thinks Disney is motivated by anything other than money they're very naive. 

[imbruglia]

 

 

 

[TomCruiseTop]

2 hours ago, Valonqar said:

is Asia actually anti-black or it's a myth? cause Fast&Furious has black actors in important roles (Luda&Tyrese) and ethnically ambiguous ones (Vin. Rock, etc) and those movies do bonkers business. BP opened big but audience thought it was shit so it collapsed (I guess that in countries without 24-7 "second coming of Citizen Kane" propaganda , people measured its quality much differently). so it isn't like they were put off by the cast (big opening) but  they weren't impressed with the movie itself once they saw it.

 

 

I've never spent any serious time in China, but have some exposure of Japan in the 90s and they had such little exposure to black people that xenophobia was rather expected. Not sure if that has changed since. 

[TomCruiseTop]

1 hour ago, jedijake said:

I would really love to read thoughts on this and read ways to avoid issues either way. In my opinion, it would have been much safer to just cast someone like Ellie Bamber or Katherine Langford (young redheads who can sing) and really push and work to create great new fresh stories that feature African culture and legends such as "Sade" which is in production.

I think this is a broader cultural problem. A lot of big industry are too keen to benefit from nostalgia and so adapt old things to match new paradigms, when they should, in my view, be making new stories, and new characters to represent our changing world. 

[Minnale101]

25 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

I've never spent any serious time in China, but have some exposure of Japan in the 90s and they had such little exposure to black people that xenophobia was rather expected. Not sure if that has changed since. 

I mean spider verse.

 

japan loves Spider-Man and loves animation yet movie didn’t do well there at all box office wise 

 

I hate to say it’s because of race but I don’t know why it didn’t with good logic.

 

that was this year 

[Valonqar]

32 minutes ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

I think this is a broader cultural problem. A lot of big industry are too keen to benefit from nostalgia and so adapt old things to match new paradigms, when they should, in my view, be making new stories, and new characters to represent our changing world. 

exactly. not everyone is Cameron who put 200M in an original story from the dead genre (Titanic) and 400M in an original story best experienced via an unproven gimmick (Avatar).  Studios want to be modern and risk nothing. hence remakes, sequels, adaptations. and since most of them are made with white characters, to meet diversity demand, they change canon characters. because they already have built-in fandom that will flock to the IP and controversy is only free marketing. TLM remade with a black Ariel is more guaranteed hit than developing an original fantasy based on African folklore, for example. It's just Hollywood being lazy but they cna afford it cause woke twitter readily backs up cosmetic changes and therefore nothing essentially changes. 

 

that said, given that Under the Sea is a Caribbean waves song, the cast is finally right. 

 

@Minnale101 Spiderverse has great legs in China. it had great WOM. it only opened lower which was expected for animated Spidey but legged it out til it lost theaters. from 25M OW to 62.8M total, that's actually excellent run for that market. Mind you, major hindrance was genre (animation) since the market got used to live action Spidey.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Valonqar

[LOGAN'sLuckyRun]

Speaking of live action remakes, did you know that Miramax (a studio that was owned by Disney a while back) made one of Pinocchio with a grown ass man playing the part? There's even an English dub with Breckin Meyer voicing the famous puppet.

 

 

[Ororo Munroe]

1 hour ago, UserHN said:

Many names are being thrown out on Twitter for Prince Eric, the most absurb being that of a member of a Kpop boy band (BTS). If they have to cast a very popular actor/singer in the role, I'd suggest Harry Styles. I think he's the current most popular singer-turned-actor worldwide. It also seems like Idris Elba is the Black Twitter favorite for Triton.

Yes, I've noticed that they are the two most popular fancasts (outside of the K-Pop boys. Ha.) and I think they would both be good choices. 

1 hour ago, JamesCameronScholar said:

In nature, yes. Although I am fully aware mermaids do not exist in nature. 

No, not in nature. It may feature mostly among pale-skinned people but brown-skinned gingers do exist. Although it is an irrelevant point, given who and what we are discussing, yes. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Ororo Munroe

[SLAM!]

9 minutes ago, LOGAN'sLuckyRun said:

Speaking of live action remakes, did you know that Miramax (a studio that was owned by Disney a while back) made one of Pinocchio with a grown ass man playing the part? There's even an English dub with Breckin Meyer voicing the famous puppet.

 

 

 

Way back when, when I was very little, my family went to see that movie, and we ended up walking out early. I do not remember being upset at the notion of walking out early. My father regularly refers to this as the worst film he's ever seen.

[UserHN]

1 hour ago, Valonqar said:

@UserHN Why is a member of Kpop an absurd choice? Kpop is huge in Asia, a market where most BOT members expect trouble for TLM. 

 

also, another white love interest for black character to pine for? I get that Hollywood thinks this is the height of wokeness but when you scratch the surface you always end up with the white character being the unattainable glorified prize that black character strives to be worthy of or some shit. 

1. It is an absurd choice because that member is not an actor. No major acting role to his credit. Even in Korea, he hasn't starred in any movie or TV series. Unlike say someone like Harry Styles who is not only a singer, but also a Nolan-approved actor.

 

2. For your second point, you don't seem to think that a Korean choice is absurd. Might I remind that he is uhm, white. So if you don't approve of whites as Prince Eric, you also shouldn't approve of Koreans. Am I correct in my conclusion that you also want a POC for Prince Eric?

Edited July 4, 2019 by UserHN

[LOGAN'sLuckyRun]

12 minutes ago, Slambros said:

 

Way back when, when I was very little, my family went to see that movie, and we ended up walking out early. I do not remember being upset at the notion of walking out early. My father regularly refers to this as the worst film he's ever seen.

I don't think I've seen it in full either but I remember my cousin having it on VHS. I might have seen the first 10 minutes of it as a kid. 

Edited July 4, 2019 by LOGAN'sLuckyRun

[filmlover]

1 hour ago, jedijake said:

You missed my point though. It's not that there can't be both. It's that there will be some folks who feel a bit of racist guilt if they sway toward "white" Ariel instead of the new Ariel. This is not the same as cartoon/real Belle or cartoon/real Maleficent. There will be inevitable social/societal differences between whether one buys "white" or "black" Ariel merchandise. Don't kid yourself. In America at least, kids (or adults) walking around with "old" Ariel stuff will be seen as racist no matter what by some people. Merchandise from the 1989 Ariel will phase out very very quickly. They will also have no choice but to re-hire Ariel meet/greets and change their rides, shows, etc in order to not look racist (which was their intention to avoid in the first place ironically).

The 1989 The Little Mermaid is such an important figure in Disney's history by basically saving them after a rough decade (as well as in pop culture in general) that it'll never be "phased out." Mentioned this a few pages ago but they'll likely incorporate the remake in either the parks or at the hotels like they are with Beauty and the Beast '17 at the Grand Floridian.

[Minnale101]

49 minutes ago, Valonqar said:

exactly. not everyone is Cameron who put 200M in an original story from the dead genre (Titanic) and 400M in an original story best experienced via an unproven gimmick (Avatar).  Studios want to be modern and risk nothing. hence remakes, sequels, adaptations. and since most of them are made with white characters, to meet diversity demand, they change canon characters. because they already have built-in fandom that will flock to the IP and controversy is only free marketing. TLM remade with a black Ariel is more guaranteed hit than developing an original fantasy based on African folklore, for example. It's just Hollywood being lazy but they cna afford it cause woke twitter readily backs up cosmetic changes and therefore nothing essentially changes. 

 

that said, given that Under the Sea is a Caribbean waves song, the cast is finally right. 

 

@Minnale101 Spiderverse has great legs in China. it had great WOM. it only opened lower which was expected for animated Spidey but legged it out til it lost theaters. from 25M OW to 62.8M total, that's actually excellent run for that market. Mind you, major hindrance was genre (animation) since the market got used to live action Spidey.

I was talking about japan 

[Eric Lasagna]

33 minutes ago, LOGAN'sLuckyRun said:

Speaking of live action remakes, did you know that Miramax (a studio that was owned by Disney a while back) made one of Pinocchio with a grown ass man playing the part? There's even an English dub with Breckin Meyer voicing the famous puppet.

 

 

It's a pretty interesting film in the sense that it basically killed off Roberto Benigini's, the actor playing Pinocchio, career. It was his first big project after Life is Beautiful was a smash box office hit and nabbed him two Oscars, including Best Actor, but Pinocchio bombed in both Italy and America so hard that his career basically stalled, minus one or two more directing jobs, and a cameo in a Woody Allen movie.

 

Shame too really. Life is Beautiful is still one of my favorite movies ever.

[LOGAN'sLuckyRun]

4 minutes ago, CoolEric258 said:

It's a pretty interesting film in the sense that it basically killed off Roberto Benigini's, the actor playing Pinocchio, career. It was his first big project after Life is Beautiful was a smash box office hit and nabbed him two Oscars, including Best Actor, but Pinocchio bombed in both Italy and America so hard that his career basically stalled, minus one or two more directing jobs, and a cameo in a Woody Allen movie.

 

He's actually playing Geppetto in a newer adaptation

The puppet has become the puppeteer.