The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power | Amazon | September 2, 2022

[Ozymandias]

 

[AN9815]

I watched the first two episodes on Friday on the biggest screen possible and I loved them. I am a huge LotR/Middle Earth fan, I have read the books including The Silmarillion and Children of Hurin so my opinion might be a little bit biased just cause I love this world.

 

I thought the production was outstanding and the characters, so far, are more likeable than I would have thought. It is true that they could have used an extra battle/action scene in these episodes. Perhaps they could have extended the battle shown in the prologue. The changes that they have made so far don't bother me and I think they still keep the Middle Earth essence, however, it could become a problem for future seasons depending on how much they adapt.  

 

I really don't understand what people who thought this was slow were expecting, IMO the pace was good and sets up rest of the season. Since people love to compare this to GoT, the first three seasons of GoT were really really slow until the last 1-2 episode of each season and I loved GoT but tv shows need to build story arcs and character development so there is a certain pay off at the end. Anyway, really great start and I hope the season finishes with a strong note. 

[Porthos]

On 9/3/2022 at 10:20 AM, Porthos said:

FWIW, the IMDB rating is seeing a slow, but steady, recovery of sorts.

 

Bottomed out at 6.1/10 and has now risen back up to 6.5/10.

 

Got to admit, I'm a bit fascinated at the recovery on this.

 

Now up to 6.7/10.  Still not back to the initial 7.3/10, but a clear and consistent rise from the bombing-led 6.1/10.

[pepsa]

I just want to note that Amazon prime has a over 200m subscription worldwide, of that 157m in the US. Over 200m could mean 270m that would still showcase how big amazon is in the US but also that the rest of the world hasn't adapted as much. So these numbers probably lean a lot more Domistic than the normal lotr cinema split.

[Kalo]

On 9/3/2022 at 9:39 PM, jedijake said:

Just finished episode 1 and quite liked it. Not taking stock in the negativity, just saying that the haters are predictable and are steering the audience reactions. But we all know that.

 

I agree that the first episode was a bit slow and could use more action, but I think that would be what knocks it down just a little. They are telling separate stories of separate characters who will come together likely as a kind of fellowship later on. If people really do honestly hate it for how slow it is, they have to realize that most shows are a bit like this. Loki was MUCH slower for much longer than this and didn't tell much of any story until Sylvie showed up. Nothing happened and nobody even spoke much for the first bit of Mandalorian. And even Obi-Wan dragged a bit to start. This is an 8-hour fest. So they spend more time getting to know the ins and outs of the characters whereas that would take up about 20 minutes in a 2-hour movie. So the ratio is the same.

 

Personally, I think much of the complaining about not enough action is an American phenomenon of wanting to be thrilled all the time.

 

I think the 84% that the critics give it fits.

 

It's odd they are complaining it is slow. when FotR was 3 hours long and took the hobbits an hour to leave the shire.

 

Anyways. I really liked the first two episodes. I agree the first episode is pretty slow. and there were a few things I didn't love. I'm not crazy about what they did with Galadriel, doesn't feel like Tolkien would have her lead armies and go that direction with her. but it is more like a nitpick and she can improve with time. I honestly feel like I'm living in an alternate reality with some of these "fan" reactions. Are they really mad that the pacing is slow or that they cast like 4 black characters in a show of 20??? 

 

or that Disa doesn't have a beard??? I love Love lord of the rings and yeah maybe I'm a bigger fan of the movies than the books. but I love the books too. but I don't know are Tolkien super fans really this petty and toxic??? 

 

Also was anyone really expecting this to be as good as the movies? I know I wasn't. I am just happy to go back to middle earth in what is so far a pretty intriguing series.

[Kalo]

On 9/3/2022 at 5:56 PM, dudalb said:

Ijust have to repeat, the inablity to draw upon the Sil is going to create huge problems with some of the plotlines they are  obviously going to do,

The main problem is the total lack, so far, of any mention of the Valar and Iluvatar...the Gods..or God..of Middle Earth, I can't for the life of me, get how they do the Numenor saga without them.

Tolkien pushen this angle into the deep backgrouns in the Hobbit and LOTR so it could be ignored, you just can't do that with some of the  plotlines they are setting up.At least convincingly.

 

Are they not allowed to mention the gods at all? i'm not sure that is the case, they have already mentioned the Silmarils.

 

 

[MikeQ]

30 minutes ago, Kalo said:

I'm not crazy about what they did with Galadriel, doesn't feel like Tolkien would have her lead armies and go that direction with her. but it is more like a nitpick and she can improve with time.

For what it's worth, Tolkien had references to Galadriel as one who "fought" and one with "Amazon disposition", etc.

 

A piece of Tolkien's writing that stands out for me (from People's of Middle-Earth) :

 

“Even after the merciless assault upon the Teleri and the rape of their ships, though she fought fiercely against Feanor in defence of her mother's kin, she did not turn back. Her pride was unwilling to return, a defeated suppliant for pardon; but now she burned with desire to follow Feanor with her anger to whatever lands he might come, and to thwart him in all ways that she could."

 

The qualities we have seen so far in Galadriel in Rings of Power feels in keeping with this.

 

All this said, you're absolutely allowed to still not like the depiction of Galadriel in the show, no matter what Tolkien's writings may suggest. Totally valid. Just wanted to throw this out there.

 

Peace,

Mike

Edited September 5, 2022 by MikeQ

[Kalo]

40 minutes ago, MikeQ said:

For what it's worth, Tolkien had references to Galadriel as one who "fought" and one with "Amazon disposition", etc.

 

A piece of Tolkien's writing that stands out for me (from People's of Middle-Earth) :

 

“Even after the merciless assault upon the Teleri and the rape of their ships, though she fought fiercely against Feanor in defence of her mother's kin, she did not turn back. Her pride was unwilling to return, a defeated suppliant for pardon; but now she burned with desire to follow Feanor with her anger to whatever lands he might come, and to thwart him in all ways that she could."

 

The qualities we have seen so far in Galadriel in Rings of Power feels in keeping with this.

 

All this said, you're absolutely allowed to still not like the depiction of Galadriel in the show, no matter what Tolkien's writings may suggest. Totally valid. Just wanted to throw this out there.

 

Peace,

Mike

 

 

I actually assumed she fought some throughout her lifetime. I'm just not sure she would have lead armies for years and years as a military leader. but thanks for that tidbit, it does give me a bit more insight into her character. and makes the writers of the show  decision a bit more grounded than I thought actually.

 

aside from the the Lord of the Rings and Hobbit books I have not really delved into his works that much. I tried reading the silmarillion a few times on paper and audio and it is a chore to me. interesting at parts, but a chore. and kind of confusing. 

[Porthos]

I've thought it over, and I've given it all due consideration.  And in doing so, I've come to a conclusion.

 

 

 

Khazad-dûm fucking slaps! 👍  👍  👍 

 

This is also my way of saying an extended soundtrack for EP 1 and EP2 are out:

 

 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Porthos

[Ozymandias]

4 hours ago, Kalo said:

 

It's odd they are complaining it is slow. when FotR was 3 hours long and took the hobbits an hour to leave the shire.

 

Two hours into Fellowship of the Ring we like and understand Frodo, Sam, Bilbo, Merry, Pippin, Gandalf, Aragorn, Arwen Legolas, Gimli, Boromir and the villain Saruman.  Fellowship is also a masterclass in show don't tell.

 

Two hours into this show and I don't care about anyone and thats 25% of the show already done. Its a meandering slog with often dull and stilted scenes played in a sequence with no forward momentum due to like 15 minutes of actual plot and no particularly interesting characters, personalities, or motivations.  This is especially bad in comparison to the LOTR movies because this format is long form storytelling where you have more time to do all that.  And I don't buy the "its setup" excuse in a post-GOT world.  The first 2 episodes of GOT beautifully set up many different characters and plot lines with narrative drive, even House of the Dragon is doing it that really well though with a bit of a smaller canvas .  Here its just boring cliched tropes and 1 note characters.  The performances and especially some of the dialogue in parts are especially bad. Like that stuff in the beginning about the rock and the ship was so weird and clunky and when they brought it back at the end of the first episode like it was some profound moment, uh wow.

 

And much of the stuff in this aesthetic of Middle Earth I just don't really like at all.  For example, there seems to be a degree of intentional uniformity among elves and men for whatever reason.  To me the only person in the show that kinda looks like an elf is Galadriel.

 

And some of the armor designs were so jarringly bad that it immediately took me out of the scene.  I mean look at this shit.

 

 

 

 

[Valonqar]

what @Ozymandias said. This was so uninteresting I couldn't even muster a critique. If it was a trainwreck, ripping it apart would be fun. But ROP is just bland,  whatever, shrug, neither here nor there. So it's nice to see a write-up that matches my thoughts. Won't continue to watch. Two episodes should be more than enough to decide whether a show is for me and it's not. 

[Torontofan]

I think the final pay off of the show may be epic.

 

LIke I assume the show ends at the prologue of Lord of the Rings? 

[Kalo]

3 hours ago, Ozymandias said:

 

Two hours into Fellowship of the Ring we like and understand Frodo, Sam, Bilbo, Merry, Pippin, Gandalf, Aragorn, Arwen Legolas, Gimli, Boromir and the villain Saruman.  Fellowship is also a masterclass in show don't tell.

 

Two hours into this show and I don't care about anyone and thats 25% of the show already done. Its a meandering slog with often dull and stilted scenes played in a sequence with no forward momentum due to like 15 minutes of actual plot and no particularly interesting characters, personalities, or motivations.  This is especially bad in comparison to the LOTR movies because this format is long form storytelling where you have more time to do all that.  And I don't buy the "its setup" excuse in a post-GOT world.  The first 2 episodes of GOT beautifully set up many different characters and plot lines with narrative drive, even House of the Dragon is doing it that really well though with a bit of a smaller canvas .  Here its just boring cliched tropes and 1 note characters.  The performances and especially some of the dialogue in parts are especially bad. Like that stuff in the beginning about the rock and the ship was so weird and clunky and when they brought it back at the end of the first episode like it was some profound moment, uh wow.

 

And much of the stuff in this aesthetic of Middle Earth I just don't really like at all.  For example, there seems to be a degree of intentional uniformity among elves and men for whatever reason.  To me the only person in the show that kinda looks like an elf is Galadriel.

 

And some of the armor designs were so jarringly bad that it immediately took me out of the scene.  I mean look at this shit.

 

 

 

 

I honestly don't remember that armor, thought it had way more detail.

 

So I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. it's a 8 hour long season. and so far I like it. it's not a masterpiece but I am already invested and do like several characters alot, (Durin, Eldrond and Nori so far are my favorites).

 

I'm getting really tired of the "absolute garbage or total masterpiece crowd" just because something isn't a 10/10 doesn't mean it's garbage. 

 

I mean it's fine you have that opinion, apparently a lot of people do. I really can't say how much I will love this show by the end. it's a solid 8 right now though and I hope it only improves. that armor is bad though. 

 

 

[filmlover]

Watched the first episodes tonight. Can't say it truly won me over or anything but it's reasonably entertaining and you can definitely see where that gargantuan budget went. I'll continue watching, at least for now.

[Torontofan]

I think maybe there to many plot points going on and some are very interesting and some not.

 

[EarlyDeadlinePredictions]

Enjoyed the first 2 episodes. Not every character and plot point is interesting yet but still ways to go. Also scale and budget are noticeable compared to other streaming shows. It definitely helps elevate it.  

[dudalb]

On 9/4/2022 at 3:15 PM, pepsa said:

I just want to note that Amazon prime has a over 200m subscription worldwide, of that 157m in the US. Over 200m could mean 270m that would still showcase how big amazon is in the US but also that the rest of the world hasn't adapted as much. So these numbers probably lean a lot more Domistic than the normal lotr cinema split.

Amazon Prime is not just a streaming service though, many subscribe for the other benefits  it offters, such as free shipping for Amazon orders.

Prime existed a long before streaming did.

This makes Amazon Prime differen then say, Netfix or DIsney + which pretty much are exclusively streaming services.

 

[dudalb]

On 9/5/2022 at 8:15 AM, Kalo said:

 

Are they not allowed to mention the gods at all? i'm not sure that is the case, they have already mentioned the Silmarils.

 

 

Technically there are no gods in Tolkien universe..there is a God yes, but not a whole bunch of Gods; Tolkien universe is clearly monothiestic. He was careful, as a devout Catholic to make the "religious" strucxture of Middle Earth compatible with the Catholic idea of G0dm

Tolkien says that some men mistakenly worship the Valar as gods, but they are not gods, They are created beings who Tolkien has given great power to to be the guaardians of the world but they are not divine. beings.

 

[Porthos]

3 minutes ago, dudalb said:

Amazon Prime is not just a streaming service though, many subscribe for the other benefits  it offters, such as free shipping for Amazon orders.

Prime existed a long before streaming did.

This makes Amazon Prime differen then say, Netfix or DIsney + which pretty much are exclusively streaming services.

 

 

I agree with this.  I would also add that many folks get Prime via family deals and thus wouldn't be able to watch on those accounts (though they obviously could on whoever's account they're linked to).  No idea just how solid the number of Prime members are when that is taken into account.  Maybe @Potiki knows.

 

On the other hand, Amazon was pushing this release HARD on its Amazon Home Page.  Countdown banners on every single Amazon page I saw (at least on the store side) and so on.

 

Amazon put a lot of muscle in making sure people on its platform knew about it, and that might have boosted its number beyond what it might have been without such an all-out blitz.

[Potiki]

No idea how many family accounts there are for Amazon, Amazon also offers a Prime Video only option but I imagine that is a fairly small percentage of total viewers. 

 

I will say whilst Amazon Prime is more than just streaming it does get decent overall viewership below only Netflix and Hulu in the US. 

 

 

Source: https://www.nielsen.com/insights/2022/streaming-claims-largest-piece-of-tv-viewing-pie-in-july/

 

I would guess they have around as many active users as Hulu (46m) or Disney+ (44m US and Canada, probably 39m US only) so around 40-50m monthly viewers as a wide range. 

 

Internationally Amazon is biggest in terms of market share in Japan (which also accounts for majority viewership) with Canada, Western Europe and Australia also pretty sizeable but viewership lower than Disney+ even though Disney are smaller in these markets in terms of subs. India is sizeable by amount of subscribers, less so market share, but viewership I don't know how they do there. 

 

Don't know how much this all helps, I would say wait for Nielsen data in a months time then it will be easier to compare to other services shows at least in the US.

 

Internationally/globally we don't get a lot of viewership stats but as I said the other day the 25m number seems good to great, Kasey Moore who runs What's on Netflix did a comp to some Netflix numbers they used to give out when they did views rather than hours but should be noted that the language used by Netflix was accounts vs. Amazon saying viewers which may have boosted Rings of Power numbers some but also none of Netflix's numbers are from first day only either. 

 

 

 

For people who can't see the tweet for whatever reason comparing ROP 25m views:

 

"To my knowledge Netflix never released single day figures.

Murder Mystery got 31 million in first weekend. (45 full week)

Stranger Things 3 got 40.7 million accounts in first 4 days.

Red Notice most watched on day 1 with ???"

Edited September 7, 2022 by Potiki