***SPOILERS***Captain Marvel Spoiler Thread | ***WARNING SPOILERS ALLOWED***WARNING SPOILERS ALLOWED***WARNING SPOILERS ALLOWED***

[terrestrial]

Thank you for wording it like I never could do!

Your whole post is, what I tried to say in the sum of my posts (plus some impressions about the move itself)

 

That part might be for one detail or the other the main reason for some genius dislikes of the film, as not based on the loud scrreamers about anti-whatever (other reasons to dislike still exist too, obviously):

 

11 minutes ago, DeeCee said:

 I just think we can exist in a world with regular films, hybrid film universes like the MCU and quality TV with each having equal value and merit. And when it does come to TV series I much prefer ongoing mythology type shows rather then procedurals or shows with mostly standalone episodes. This is probably what predisposes me to like the MCU style of film

B5, The Wire, Wiseguy, Farscape,....

[NamakFiskKa]

1 hour ago, DeeCee said:

For me personally, Captain Marvel works on all three levels, as an internally consistent, enjoyable and interesting film, as a payoff for previous films (Fury’s eye as an example) and as a foreshadowing of things to come. 

• Takes an intriguing look into Fury's past with that eye from Winter Soldier into a punchline
• Turns Fury into even more of a lair when Thor arrived and how he told he is our intro to space dudes 
• Fury knew all along that there's this almighty space marine and the level of threat they can be facing after 20yrs and what the best he could come up with ??  3 mortal soldeirs , guy with extra firepower , an unreliable hulk and a blonde space dude who Fury didnt knew if he's even that powerful, thats your best bet... compared to this girl (when u think about it thats some Amanda Waller SS shit)

Idk about the future but its already putting some big question marks on Fury' integrity in the past

[Lordmandeep]

2 hours ago, DeeCee said:

MCU films simply aren’t traditional standalone films and should not be treated as such.  They don’t exist in a vacuum.  They are part of a larger whole. Elements of the film payoff internally within the movie, elements will payoff in future films and elements of the film will have payoffs in previous films. 

 

This is the film makers intention. It’s not an accident. It’s not a mistake. This is what is intended. If you go into an MCU film expecting something different then the error is on you not the filmmakers. 

 

Does it always work? No. Iron Man 2 is an example of where there was to much of the greater mythology and not enough focus on the “standalone” film. 

 

For me personally, Captain Marvel works on all three levels, as an internally consistent, enjoyable and interesting film, as a payoff for previous films (Fury’s eye as an example) and as a foreshadowing of things to come. 

 

I liked that they played with the structure of an origin film. The audience discovers her origin as she herself is discovering it. At the start of the film both the audience and the character are both in the dark as to who she really is.  Basically her origin has already happened and the film is about rediscovering it. 

 

For the audience the payoff at the end is twofold when she breaks free of the Kree control and realises her true powers. There’s the internal progression within the film of her realisation of who she is and where she came from but there is also an unspoken (and unknown within the film) elephant in the room, Thanos. 

 

I’m going to go out on a limb here and assume that every single person in every single session of Captain Marvel has watched Infinity War.  They know that Thanos is unmatched and the payoff everyone gets as Captain Marvel displays almost unmatched power is that out there in the future is Thanos. 

 

This is just my opinion. You can choose to view a film anyway you wish but for me I feel you’re missing something if after 21 films and counting you continue to go into an MCU film expecting something different. 

 

[A bit of background to my thinking.  I’ve never read the comics and pretty much had no idea about the character before watching the film. I pretty much think of the MCU as a hybrid film/mythology based TV series on a big budget. I just think we can exist in a world with regular films, hybrid film universes like the MCU and quality TV with each having equal value and merit. And when it does come to TV series I much prefer ongoing mythology type shows rather then procedurals or shows with mostly standalone episodes. This is probably what predisposes me to like the MCU style of film.]

 

 

 

 

The fact a Thanos exists is what makes Captain Marvel anyway interesting to the greater MCU universe.

 

 

It seems it was best she was introduced now or else she would have not fit in the MCU in the early days. 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Lordmandeep

[justvision]

2 hours ago, DeeCee said:

You can choose to view a film anyway you wish but for me I feel you’re missing something if after 21 films and counting you continue to go into an MCU film expecting something different.  

 

I really don't need your explanation and you feeling for me missing something. You are probably missing my first paragraph:

 

Quote

This does not take away the fact that a movie should be judged on its own merit/quality. E.g for many (including me), Thor the characters has grown in acceptance, liking and popularity since Thor (2011) the movie, but Thor the movie still remains in the mid to lower tier of MCU movies for many (13th or 14th for me, around CM).

Also, there are many audience and new markets that MCU need to win over. Having this attitude that a solo movie have other movies to fall on and not mostly on its merit is an arrogant attitude that will backfire sometime down the road.

Edited March 12, 2019 by justvision

[justvision]

1 hour ago, NamakFiskKa said:

• Takes an intriguing look into Fury's past with that eye from Winter Soldier into a punchline
• Turns Fury into even more of a lair when Thor arrived and how he told he is our intro to space dudes 
• Fury knew all along that there's this almighty space marine and the level of threat they can be facing after 20yrs and what the best he could come up with ??  3 mortal soldeirs , guy with extra firepower , an unreliable hulk and a blonde space dude who Fury didnt knew if he's even that powerful, thats your best bet... compared to this girl (when u think about it thats some Amanda Waller SS shit)

Idk about the future but its already putting some big question marks on Fury' integrity in the past

Well, The Avengers in phase one was initiated by SHIELD and closely associated with it.

 

But by phase two, if raw power is concerned, Iron Man together with Veronica (Hulk Buster), and Iron Legion will surpass the original Avengers (san non-Earth Thor) in fighting power. Furthermore, Tony has more advanced tech than US government including SHIELD, and more advanced AI. If Spider-Man is recruited under Tony, he would govern a much formidable force than the original six (excluding non-Earth Thor).

 

On the other hand, SHIELD basically disintegrated by CA:WS. Thus the Avengers was dissociated from SHIELD even from the beginning of phase two, and come under Tony and Cap's leadership.

 

 

Edited March 12, 2019 by justvision

[MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie]

rogue watching captain marvel be like pic.twitter.com/VAAXov7EUr

— Kaiji Tang (@KaijiTang) March 12, 2019

[LaughingEvans]

1 hour ago, Lordmandeep said:

 

 

The fact a Thanos exists is what makes Captain Marvel anyway interesting to the greater MCU universe.

 

 

It seems it was best she was introduced now or else she would have not fit in the MCU in the early days. 

 

They could have made it 100% more intersting if they made Bening's character Phyla-Vell instead of Mar-Vell.
That would give a great opportunity to show Thanos' hinted past (when he talks to Gamora he says that he ignored his destiny once, and he tells Thor that he knows what it's like to lose). Mar-vell was always Thanos' arch rival, and the one of the 2 characters he really respected despite being on the opposite side.

 

On top of that, Phyla is quite popular and comic fans would welcome the cameo.

[Lordmandeep]

14 minutes ago, LaughingEvans said:

 

They could have made it 100% more intersting if they made Bening's character Phyla-Vell instead of Mar-Vell.
That would give a great opportunity to show Thanos' hinted past (when he talks to Gamora he says that he ignored his destiny once, and he tells Thor that he knows what it's like to lose). Mar-vell was always Thanos' arch rival, and the one of the 2 characters he really respected despite being on the opposite side.

 

On top of that, Phyla is quite popular and comic fans would welcome the cameo.

 

 

So the film is a Poulson, Fury, CM and now Thanos Origin story XD 

[LaughingEvans]

2 minutes ago, Lordmandeep said:

 

 

So the film is a Poulson, Fury, CM and now Thanos Origin story XD 

 

Obviously, Thanos origin could be done in a different film, about the original CM or Silver Surfer/Nova Prime/Quasar

[Valonqar]

I hope Fury de-age gets some love for SFX guild come awards time cause it's so seamless I forgot that Sam wasn't that young IRL. truly astounding and not at all distracting. really pulls you in and you believe. 

[IceFire9yt]

1 hour ago, justvision said:

I really don't need your explanation and you feeling for me missing something. You are probably missing my first paragraph:

 

Also, there are many audience and new markets that MCU need to win over. Having this attitude that a solo movie have other movies to fall on and not mostly on its merit is an arrogant attitude that will backfire sometime down the road.

I don't think every movie in the franchise needs to be geared towards winning over new people.  This is akin to complaining about Infinity War being hard to follow for someone who's never seen a marvel movie before.  I mean, duh.  I think its okay for a few movies to be 'for the fans' as long as its not every movie.

 

5 hours ago, Warhorse said:

People are just too blind to understand. It's why movies like The Hunger Games, Star Wars, Harry Potter and LOTR were so huge. The heroes were up against unbeatable odds, and their spirit and determination helped them win out, not invincible power, and it makes for a more compelling story.

 

Heck, let's look at Thor in IW. Argue with me all you want, but the Thor movies and Thor in particular has been a miss with the audience. His only saving grace was that Loki was always a part of his story, and people loved Loki and would flock to his movies for Loki, not Thor. If you doubt me, go watch a comic con when all of the Avengers come on stage, and Loki get's the louder applause and cheers over Thor. It's also why they shoehorned him in so many times, is because of the fans. Can't say I blame Marvel for doing this. But, it took Thanos defeat of Thor, the loss of his eye, his hammer, his home, his family. It took him nearly dying, for the audience to cheer like crazy when he makes his grand entrance in Wakanda. Do you think he would have gotten that if he was already super powered and strong throughout the whole franchise?

I don't think this criticism works in Captain Marvel itself, but would be something to keep in mind for its sequels.  For most of the movie she isn't overly-powerful.  Its not like for the entire movie she doesn't break a sweat.  She gets captured, stranded, mind-raped twice.  Most of the movie is with her on the backfoot, its only at the end that she curb stomps everyone in a very satisfying manner. 

 

The best analogue to this in terms of story telling is The Avengers.  After the circle shot in that movie there is zero tension.  No one is concerned about the heroes and they're just bulldozing everyone before them.  The end of The Avengers is a fireworks display- as is the end of Captain Marvel.  You're not supposed to feel tension or be concerned about anyone at this point, you're just supposed to sit back and enjoy as the main character opens a can of whoop-ass on the baddies.

 

Anyway in the sequel they just need to put her up against someone of equal or greater power and show her struggle- the MCU has already portrayed several villains that would fit that bill, so I'm not concerned about them being able to pull it off.  Thor Ragnarok is a good template in some ways. (Though I do think you're underestimating how much Thor's personality played into him not being popular.)

 

[Lordmandeep]

4 minutes ago, IceFire9yt said:

I don't think every movie in the franchise needs to be geared towards winning over new people.  This is akin to complaining about Infinity War being hard to follow for someone who's never seen a marvel movie before.  I mean, duh.  I think its okay for a few movies to be 'for the fans' as long as its not every movie.

 

I don't think this criticism works in Captain Marvel itself, but would be something to keep in mind for its sequels.  For most of the movie she isn't overly-powerful.  Its not like for the entire movie she doesn't break a sweat.  She gets captured, stranded, mind-raped twice.  Most of the movie is with her on the backfoot, its only at the end that she curb stomps everyone in a very satisfying manner. 

 

The best analogue to this in terms of story telling is The Avengers.  After the circle shot in that movie there is zero tension.  No one is concerned about the heroes and they're just bulldozing everyone before them.  The end of The Avengers is a fireworks display- as is the end of Captain Marvel.  You're not supposed to feel tension or be concerned about anyone at this point, you're just supposed to sit back and enjoy as the main character opens a can of whoop-ass on the baddies.

 

Anyway in the sequel they just need to put her up against someone of equal or greater power and show her struggle- the MCU has already portrayed several villains that would fit that bill, so I'm not concerned about them being able to pull it off.  Thor Ragnarok is a good template in some ways. (Though I do think you're underestimating how much Thor's personality played into him not being popular.)

 

 

 

I think you forget there was tension as the govt wanted to Nuke NYC and Iron went through a wormhole and thought he was gonna die. 

[IceFire9yt]

1 minute ago, Lordmandeep said:

 

 

I think you forget there was tension as the govt wanted to Nuke NYC and Iron went through a wormhole and thought he was gonna die. 

Ah yes, that's true.  Still, most of the battle for New York sequence is not meant to be tension filled- its meant to be spectacle.

[Lordmandeep]

7 minutes ago, IceFire9yt said:

Ah yes, that's true.  Still, most of the battle for New York sequence is not meant to be tension filled- its meant to be spectacle.

 

 

I think the final battle in CM could have been something better. 

 

Any sort of fight or struggle really lol... 

 

This was like the most one sided climax in a MCU film. 

 

That is why I prefer WW as the final fight had sacrifice and a decent CGI battle. 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Lordmandeep

[MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie]

Avengers are actually kind of on the ropes towards the end there.  Hawkeye's out of arrows and on the run.  Cap's been shot.  Hulk is getting overwhelmed.  Iron Man just got wrecked crashing through a Chitauri ship and smashing into the ground.  Implication is they might actually lose.  And, oh, here comes a nuclear missile heading your way.

[NamakFiskKa]

6 minutes ago, MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie said:

a nuclear missile heading your way.

in the end it was the nuclear missile that won the day , only Thor could had kept up with the constant onslaught others were started getting exhausted

[Menor the Destroyer]

8 minutes ago, Lordmandeep said:

 

 

I think the final battle in CM could have been something better. 

 

Any sort of fight or struggle really lol... 

 

This was like the most one sided climax in a MCU film. 

 

That is why I prefer WW as the final fight had sacrifice and a decent CGI battle. 

I actually really liked that aspect, it was very satisfying to see her just let loose and destroy everyone

[Lordmandeep]

3 minutes ago, Menor said:

I actually really liked that aspect, it was very satisfying to see her just let loose and destroy everyone

Different strokes for different folks.

 

 

I really dont want a Superman like character in the MCU lol 

[MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie]

10 minutes ago, Menor said:

I actually really liked that aspect, it was very satisfying to see her just let loose and destroy everyone

Agreed.  And it's just great to see an MCU hero taking so much joy in their powers.  Rocket is the only other one I can think of who seems to enjoy his work this much.  Hopefully we can see those two wrecking shit up together in Endgame.

 

[terrestrial]

9 minutes ago, MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie said:

Agreed.  And it's just great to see an MCU hero taking so much joy in their powers.  Rocket is the only other one I can think of who seems to enjoy his work this much.  Hopefully we can see those two wrecking shit up together in Endgame.

Yes, that I really love too

She might be very open minded towards him I think.

She comes across very accepting IMHO, like take the beings for how they are,

I'd like to see her, Goose, Rocket, and Groot together. She has an universal translator... Groot and Goose have fighting similarities,...

like hanging out a little bit with some squibs... and fighting. A small scene maybe?