Avatar: The Way of Water | 16 DEC 2022 | Don't worry guys, critics like it

[Darth Homer]

488 DOM/2B OS/2.5B WW

[Ozymandias]

I'm pretty adamant he said "he was paying homage"...

When Cameron genuinely pays homage to his acknowledged influences, it's called blatant rip-off. Haters don't even know that it's Cameron himself that labeled Avatar "Pocahontas/Dance With Wolves in space" as the easiest way to describe the story at its core.

That was a quick 180. You just said a few posts up that Avatar was original. I don't know if you meant to contradict yourself, but you did.

James Cameron may have created an original scifi world in space, but its story and characters, which is the heart of the film, are among the most rehashed ever. Denying that is silly. And paying homage doesn't mean flat out copying something in this context. Skyfall, for an example, pays homage to The Dark Knight, but they are still very different films.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Shpongle

[The Futurist]

District 9 and Avatar have the exact same storyOne film is cool.The other is uncool.

[Ozymandias]

District 9 and Avatar have the exact same story

Stop talking.

[The Futurist]

Stop talking.

[dashrendar44]

That was a quick 180. You just said a few posts up that Avatar was original. I don't know if you meant to contradict yourself, but you did.

James Cameron may have created an original scifi world in space, but its story and characters, which is the heart of the film, are among the most rehashed ever. Denying that is silly. And paying homage doesn't mean flat out copying something in this context. Skyfall, for an example, pays homage to The Dark Knight, but they are still very different films.

You didn't understand. I said "Paraplegic Marine that becomes a giant blue alien by mental connection that defeats his own race in epic battle in the future" is indeed quite original in an era of reboots/Sequels/prequels. The archetypes and tropes may be rehash for certain but the way it's told visually and characters like Neytiri made all the difference. So I'm stating exactly the same thing that I underlined in your message.

So because you made something quite original, you can't pay homage at all? That's what Cameron have done. A Burroughs kind of epic set in the future. No contradiction there.

I didn't know Costner went full native at the end of Dances With Wolves or Indians defeated the Yankees.

Edited December 11, 2012 by dashrendar44

[Kvikk Lunsj]

Sometimes I think James Cameron likes to wait a long time for his movies to come out so they can increase in box office.Avatar 2 2025.

[fishstick]

Sometimes I think James Cameron likes to wait a long time for his movies to come out so they can increase in box office.Avatar 2 2025.

I`d believe that about any other director but not Cameron. Cameron isn`t "forge iron while it`s hot" type. He doesn`t care about such petty little things. He`ll make those movies when he is ready to make them and when he thinks he`s bringing something new to the table. Didn`t T2 come out a decade after Terminator and was fantastic?

[Neo]

I`d believe that about any other director but not Cameron. Cameron isn`t "forge iron while it`s hot" type. He doesn`t care about such petty little things. He`ll make those movies when he is ready to make them and when he thinks he`s bringing something new to the table. Didn`t T2 come out a decade after Terminator and was fantastic?

But wasn't it a 484% increase over T1.

[fishstick]

But wasn't it a 484% increase over T1.

So? My point is that I don`t think that this particular individual is driven by agenda to have #1 movies because inflation makes it possible. It makes no sense for anyone let alone for someone who`s always been avant garde. I mean, seriously, you people actually believe he waited 12 years since Titanic so that Avatar could beat it? Jesus. I`ve heard tons of stupid Cameron hate but this one takes the cake.Nobody in this business, unless they are excentric like Cameron or Malick, takes a decade long sabatical right after their biggest success. No one. They try to capitalize on the heat by getting other projects greenlit ASAP. Because you are as hot as your last hit and by that I don`t mean that you stay hot for 12 years since. Nope.Anyway, if he isn`t in a hurry to make Avatar(s), it certainly isn`t because he`s calculating how much they would make with inflation in the year ____. Because anyone who does this type of calculation also does the "in _____ years, people will move onto other things cause competition is crazy and our sequels won`t be as profitable as they could have been because they arrived too late when interest diminished." And as the result, no one waits for inflation but they get their shit in theaters in reasonable time frame. Edited December 12, 2012 by fishnets

[Ozymandias]

You didn't understand. I said "Paraplegic Marine that becomes a giant blue alien by mental connection that defeats his own race in epic battle in the future" is indeed quite original in an era of reboots/Sequels/prequels. The archetypes and tropes may be rehash for certain but the way it's told visually and characters like Neytiri made all the difference. So I'm stating exactly the same thing that I underlined in your message.

So because you made something quite original, you can't pay homage at all? That's what Cameron have done. A Burroughs kind of epic set in the future. No contradiction there.

Uh, no. The scifi elements of the film like the mind connection to the Avatar or that fact that Neytiri is a 10 foot blue CGI space indian doesn't change the fact that its the exact same story as Pocahontas and Dances with Wolves.. And again, paying homage is different than copying. I gave you an example of that.

I didn't know Costner went full native at the end of Dances With Wolves or Indians defeated the Yankees.

Did we watch the same movie? He decides to live with Indians at the end and the Yankee soldiers all lost at the end. The only difference is the scale.

[vc2002]

Sometimes I think James Cameron likes to wait a long time for his movies to come out so they can increase in box office.Avatar 2 2025.

This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

[dashrendar44]

Did we watch the same movie? He decides to live with Indians at the end and the Yankee soldiers all lost at the end. The only difference is the scale.

You must have skipped the epilogue which mentioned that thirteen years later the last remnants of Sioux were subjugated to the American government, ending the conquest of the Western frontier states and the livelihoods of the tribes in the plains. And the fact that Dunbar (and his adopted wife Dressed With Fists) decided to leave the tribe forever to protect them. Yeah, Cameron ripped off entirely that part too, didn't he?By the way, is there a law that forbid drawing inspiration based on historical or cultural events (whether real or romanced)? So Malick's The New World is a Pocahontas rip-off too, by your assessment. Edited December 12, 2012 by dashrendar44

[vc2002]

District 9 and Avatar have the exact same storyOne film is cool.The other is uncool.

Indeed District 9 had a similar overal structure to Avatar's. It was about re-location and the humans were the bad guys. The leading man ended up to be one of those aliens (of cause one chose to and the other was forced to).

[lilmac]

wtf is a shriekapoo?

[lilmac]

I'm glad James Cameron foregoed Battle Angel Alita. We're not ready for a film of that caliber. Today's special FX can't do her justice.

[Neo]

I'm glad James Cameron foregoed Battle Angel Alita. We're not ready for a film of that caliber. Today's special FX can't do her justice.

By 2020+ could be ready.

[vc2002]

I'm glad James Cameron foregoed Battle Angel Alita. We're not ready for a film of that caliber. Today's special FX can't do her justice.

Can totally do. You just need enough time and money, plus a technique-geek mind and lots of guts. Sounds exactly like Cameron.

[Cochofles]

People are still debating Avatar's originality? Seriously? People, let it go. Saying that it's a 'rehash' won't strip the film of its accomplishments, and it won't make the sequel flop. I bet that everyone who keeps bashing the film will be the first in line when Avatar 2 opens.

[fishstick]

People are still debating Avatar's originality? Seriously? People, let it go. Saying that it's a 'rehash' won't strip the film of its accomplishments, and it won't make the sequel flop. I bet that everyone who keeps bashing the film will be the first in line when Avatar 2 opens.

Amen.

For a movie that apaprently lost its appeal, nobody cares about anymore, is stupid,etc it`s still getting lots of debate.

This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

Yes, Cameron Conspiracies beat the wildest conspiracy theories. I mena, holy shit people believe he`s waiting for inflation to fudge boxoffice numbers of his new movies. The man owns an asteroid belt. he can always count tickets from collonists just like Paramount counted Puerto Rico. No need to wait for inflation to do the trick.

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Edited December 12, 2012 by fishnets