Avatar: The Way of Water | 16 DEC 2022 | Don't worry guys, critics like it

[Sheldon Cr]

On 1/29/2023 at 4:07 PM, The GOAT said:

It's absolutely incredible that one man written, produced, edited, and directed the top 3 out of 4 highest grossing films of all time. And it's all Original IP. Truly an Insane Feat.

Good post brothet goat

[Sheldon Cr]

38 minutes ago, Porthos said:

 

Um, no? The Average ticket price of $11 is quoted from an article from Oct 2022.  But even if there hasn't been a ATP rise since then and CNBC is off, 3D PLF tickets aren't gonna be anywhere close to $11.  Nor are any type of ATP for 3D tickets.

 

38 minutes ago, Porthos said:

 

 

True but im sure it's about 12-13. Still means if Avatar 2hits 700-730 mil still going to be around 55m or more tickets sold brother porthos. If no storm or pandemic scares a2 would have hit 900+m domestic and nearly 3b Os. Only Cameron's film is going to draw this kind of attendance. So let's not try to spin nums to lessen the achievement. No director has done it and no film with original ip has come close to Avatar or its sequel in worldwide attendance. All the other films including marvel are not coming close. Cameron conquers even after a 13 yr gap. Alot of 2d tickets were bought brother porthos so you can't act like everyone saw this in 3d 😂. 

Likely 54-60% 3d. Rest 2d

Edited February 9, 2023 by Sheldon Cr
Just updating

[Ozymandias]

14 hours ago, Deuce66 said:

 

Pretty much, it's symptomatic of an industry wide problem, theatre attendance across the board in the domestic market is WAY down. The latest move by AMC to jack premium seats by $2 will drive even more people to stay home and enjoy content at their leisure. Given the quality of the home experience that can be achieved these days (65-77" OLED screens, 4K/Blu + decent sound) why would anyone even bother to go to theatre except in very rare cases where the huge screen makes it worthwhile? 

 

The industry has changed substantially since 2009 and the big chains are circling the drain with this policy of constantly increasing prices to make up for lost revenue. Punish loyal customers by asking them to pay more? 

 

The avg. price of a 2009 movie ticket according to the MPAA was $7.50, even if you stick a 25% premium for 3D, Avatar 2009 sold about 80 million tickets. 

 

I firmly believe the next two years will determine the fate of this industry in North America. 

 

 

Or the movie just simply didn't generate nearly as much enthusiastic zomgwtf "must see" reactions as the first movie did.  Avatar 1 dominated the entertainment world for like 3 months and stayed in theaters for many more.  The conversation around Avatar 2 felt much much smaller and never approached anywhere near that, it just felt like any other blockbuster. 

 

I don't think you can entirely blame attendance trends when Spiderman just made 800 million in the middle of a pandemic and a sequel to a 30 year old movie just came out of nowhere and made 715m.

 

Avatar 2 is probably gonna finish somewhere around 41-43m tickets.  Thats a gigantic drop from the 75-76m tickets Avatar did when you break down the 2D, 3D, and IMAX split(if I remember correctly, 20% was in 2D, 16% in IMAX, and 64% in 3D)  using late 2009 average prices.

 

 

 

[Sheldon Cr]

26 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

 

Or the movie just simply didn't generate nearly as much enthusiastic zomgwtf "must see" reactions as the first movie did.  Avatar 1 dominated the entertainment world for like 3 months and stayed in theaters for many more.  The conversation around Avatar 2 felt much much smaller and never approached anywhere near that, it just felt like any other blockbuster. 

 

I don't think you can entirely blame attendance trends when Spiderman just made 800 million in the middle of a pandemic and a sequel to a 30 year old movie just came out of nowhere and made 715m.

 

Avatar 2 is probably gonna finish somewhere around 41-43m tickets.  Thats a gigantic drop from the 75-76m tickets Avatar did when you break down the 2D, 3D, and IMAX split(if I remember correctly, 20% was in 2D, 16% in IMAX, and 64% in 3D)  using late 2009 average prices.

 

 

 

More like  55-60m tickets( and thats only because people want the best experience and thats.11-30.00!!. Repeat only Avatar gets folks.to.pay that. Any other brand it would be selling 5-10m tickets with a 60-65 percent premium split). If it were more on the ordinary side then it would be selling 75-80m. 3d tickets were cheaper in 2009. And no pandemic. Guess that point flew over your head. Lol

 

And guess whats its triple that in ticket sales OS. Seems only 2 movies super performed. And one is an original IP. It's obvious people.choose to spend the money for a superior product and movie experience.  The same audiences didn't chose the other films on this level ww.( including NWH) Avatar 2 is by far the most amazing success  story. As every one of the big.films that underperformed or Flopped have 50-80+ years of Fandom but still can't compete with a movie brand only 13 yrs old.

 

 

Lol you hated on Cameron success and bet on avatar 2 not being gigantic and lost. Simple as that. And Cameron's sequel joins the all time #3 on the list with 2.4-2.5billion.

Ozy your hate.on this movie's success has no logic to it

690-730+m domestic and 2.4b+WW didn't have an impact on audiences?? If thats the case.what.happened to Black Adam, bp2 and Dr strange 2..😄😄

Avatar 2 when all is said and done will be  on the #1 -3 all time list os in over 30 countries. Goes to show how much love is shown to Pandora even in pandemic and storms. Only film since Avatar to hit 100m in Austraila and nearly 170m in France. 

Enjoy seeing avatar in the number 1 and number 3 all time and in the top 5 domestically as well.

😉🦝👍

Edited February 9, 2023 by Sheldon Cr
Just updating

[Ozymandias]

18 minutes ago, Sheldon Cr said:

More like  55-60m tickets( and thats only because people want the best experience and thats.11-30.00. Repeat only Avatar gets folks.to.pay that. Any other brand it would be selling 5-10m tickets with a 60-65 percent premium split). And guess whats its triple that in ticket sales OS. Seems only 2 movies super performed. And one is an original IP. It's obvious people.choose to spend the money for a superior product and didn't chose the other films. Avatar 2 is by far the most amazing success  story. As every one of the big.films that underperformed or Flopped had 50-90 years of Fanwood but can't compete with a movie brand only 13 yrs old. Lol you bet on avatar 2 not being gigantic and lost. Simple as that. And Cameron's sequel joins the all time #3 on the list with 2.4-2.5billion.

Ozy your hate.on this movie's success has no logic to it

680-718m domestic and 2.4b+WW didn't have an impact on audiences?? If thats the case.what.happened to Black Adam, bp2 and Dr strange 2..😄😄

Avatar 2 when all is said and done will be  on the #1 all time list os in over 20 countries. Goes to show how much love is shown to Pandora even in pandemic and storms.

😉🦝👍

 

 

[Ozymandias]

Kal I will never read a post of yours longer than a few lines so keep it snappy

[Sheldon Cr]

9 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

Kal I will never read a post of yours longer than a few lines so keep it snappy

My luck gets better  everyday. I don't entertain sore losers. I think the points made were clear.

Your movies were nothing to Avatar and that you can take to the bank.

 

PS -Your under 573 m.domestic.A2 club and under nwh ww for Way.of the Water failed miserably as well OZy

Hee hee😉👍. How's that for snappy 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Sheldon Cr
Just updating

[ThomasNicole]

29 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

 

Or the movie just simply didn't generate nearly as much enthusiastic zomgwtf "must see" reactions as the first movie did.  Avatar 1 dominated the entertainment world for like 3 months and stayed in theaters for many more.  The conversation around Avatar 2 felt much much smaller and never approached anywhere near that, it just felt like any other blockbuster. 

 

I don't think you can entirely blame attendance trends when Spiderman just made 800 million in the middle of a pandemic and a sequel to a 30 year old movie just came out of nowhere and made 715m.

 

Avatar 2 is probably gonna finish somewhere around 41-43m tickets.  Thats a gigantic drop from the 75-76m tickets Avatar did when you break down the 2D, 3D, and IMAX split(if I remember correctly, 20% was in 2D, 16% in IMAX, and 64% in 3D)  using late 2009 average prices.

 

 

 

I´m pretty sure a very huge part of SM and TG money also came from premium screens, even with those two you can make a case of how the numbers aren´t so special compared to admissions from 2009 or so. And while the drop for A2 is big, not only this is usual for such huge first stallments but it´s also just a question of how the industry completely changed in 13 years and the Avatar franchise didn´t really adapted into it like Marvel, it just reappeared in pop culture 13 years later in an entirely different landscape. You can have outliers like TGM, but this is rare. 

 

The conversation around everything these days feels smaller, the world is too fast, you have new ´´content´´ everyday, and projects blow up and then fades in a span of weeks in every industry, this is the new normal, there´s nothing really unusual about A2 conversation or entusiasm, the movie generate nearly the best audience reaction it could possibly get. 

 

The most logical reason is the drop in attendance in the whole industry, we´re seeing this happening for years now, the pandemic accelerated the whole process and now we´re living it´s consequences, from smaller movies getting buried and waiting until it´s VOD release to find audience to diminished returns in admissions even for the big franchises. 

 

The only 2 outliers so far are the generational crossover with NWH [but even Marvel itself is also facing the consequences of attendancies dropping outside of NWH] and TGM which is a rarity even by pre-pandemic standards.

[Sheldon Cr]

45 minutes ago, ThomasNicole said:

I´m pretty sure a very huge part of SM and TG money also came from premium screens, even with those two you can make a case of how the numbers aren´t so special compared to admissions from 2009 or so. And while the drop for A2 is big, not only this is usual for such huge first stallments but it´s also just a question of how the industry completely changed in 13 years and the Avatar franchise didn´t really adapted into it like Marvel, it just reappeared in pop culture 13 years later in an entirely different landscape. You can have outliers like TGM, but this is rare. 

 

The conversation around everything these days feels smaller, the world is too fast, you have new ´´content´´ everyday, and projects blow up and then fades in a span of weeks in every industry, this is the new normal, there´s nothing really unusual about A2 conversation or entusiasm, the movie generate nearly the best audience reaction it could possibly get. 

 

The most logical reason is the drop in attendance in the whole industry, we´re seeing this happening for years now, the pandemic accelerated the whole process and now we´re living it´s consequences, from smaller movies getting buried and waiting until it´s VOD release to find audience to diminished returns in admissions even for the big franchises. 

 

The only 2 outliers so far are the generational crossover with NWH [but even Marvel itself is also facing the consequences of attendancies dropping outside of NWH] and TGM which is a rarity even by pre-pandemic standards.

Also 3d tickets.were much cheaper and better economy in 2009. No pandemic either. Some good points brother Thomas

.

Mr Ozy is just upset because his  statements and flop/ underperformance clubs he supported for Avatar 2  faling or underperforming for a year or more.now all fell to the wayside.😄

 

Bottomline James Cameron's Sully Family came out strong despite the downtrend of hwood business and problems faced to experience Pandora. Heck some were stating all the 4k and streaming are the.end of boxoffice and 2billion dollar heydays. Good to see the leader of the pak in Avatar 2 2022-2023 (2.4b-2.5b) and other powerhouses such as last years  NwH 2021-2022(1.9b) and Maverick 2022(1.4b) show there's still some mega  spark left.

 

" Pandorians We Got it Done!"

Edited February 9, 2023 by Sheldon Cr
Just updating

[Elessar]

If A2 is underwhelming in terms of tickets sold, so is TGM. Their difference will be minimal. You could say but A2 is the sequel to one of the biggest DOM movies ever, sure, but when has a sequel to a phenomenon outgrossed its original? A2 will come pretty close (again, with the help of higher ATP).

[Hatebox]

I've yet to see a single meme for this, which given its success seems remarkable. That's not a veiled 'it has no cultural impact!' insult either: it feels like Cameron's released a movie in a demension where the internet was never invented. God knows MCU memes are tiresome enough.

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Hatebox

[IronJimbo]

1 hour ago, Hatebox said:

I've yet to see a single meme for this, which given its success seems remarkable. That's not a veiled 'it has no cultural impact!' insult either: it feels like Cameron's released a movie in a demension where the internet was never invented. God knows MCU memes are tiresome enough.

Then you're looking in the wrong places. Any website with a main demographic of 21+ year old guys is not where you're going to find them.

[despooked]

2 hours ago, Hatebox said:

I've yet to see a single meme for this, which given its success seems remarkable. That's not a veiled 'it has no cultural impact!' insult either: it feels like Cameron's released a movie in a demension where the internet was never invented. God knows MCU memes are tiresome enough.

 

 

No, he released a movie that stays away from the toxic part of the internet.

Edited February 9, 2023 by despooked

[Sheldon Cr]

Hey brother  iron jimbo that 700+m domestic mark is getting closer.👍🦝 You have the love the naysayers clambering to to find something negative with A2-lol. Bottomline where other movies failed even after 13 years. James still  puts more buckets in seats no matter the climate. No wonder so many sites saying DC, Marvel ...Warner Brothers and Disney itself. Better take notes from Cameron. He has the biggest movie in history in one run in Titanic and then does the latest  biggest all time world breaker again in Avatar and now even in non ideal waters for films..his 3rd movie looks to hit 700-730+ mil domestic  and 1.7-1.8b Overseas.

Had it been 2017-2019 box office climate avatar 2 would have bested NWh by 1.5b and endgame by a billion or more. And likely would have passed 1b domestic

 

 

 

Avatar Way of Water's run is nothing less than Sensational!

Edited February 9, 2023 by Sheldon Cr
Just updating

[IronJimbo]

41 minutes ago, Sheldon Cr said:

Hey brother  iron jimbo that 700+m domestic mark is getting closer.👍🦝 You have the love the naysayers clambering to to find something negative with A2-lol. Bottomline where other movies failed even after 13 years. James still  puts more buckets in seats no matter the climate. No wonder so many sites saying DC, Marvel ...Warner Brothers and Disney itself. Better take notes from Cameron. He has the biggest movie in history in one run in Titanic and then does the latest  biggest all time world breaker again in Avatar and now even in non ideal waters for films..his 3rd movie looks to hit 700-730+ mil domestic  and 1.7-1.8b Overseas.

Had it been 2017-2019 box office climate avatar 2 would have bested NWh by 1.5b and endgame by a billion or more. And likely would have passed 1b domestic

 

 

 

Avatar Way of Water's run is nothing less than Sensational!

3 billies was robbed by covid.

The domestic market did ok but overally they're trolling, america is legit one of the worst markets in the world for avatar relative to it's size. It's quite interesting.

[Hatebox]

1 hour ago, IronJimbo said:

Then you're looking in the wrong places. Any website with a main demographic of 21+ year old guys is not where you're going to find them.

 

Well that's kind of the point. After Glass Onion was released my facebook and twitter algorithms were awash wth inane Benoit Blanc memes, but I've seen nothing for this. We can take is as read avatar memes exist somewhere, but given anything moderately popular is memeified and eventually seen by anyone terminally online, their confinement is notable.

 

Again, not an insult to the movie. I know Avatar fans are exquisitely sensitive to cultural impact discourse and see it as concern trolling, but this is not that. If anything the movie's distance from social media is enjoyably old school. I'm saying I quite like it.

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Hatebox

[IronJimbo]

5 minutes ago, Hatebox said:

Well that's kind of the point. After Glass Onion was released my facebook and twitter algorithms were awash wth inane Benoit Blanc memes, but I've seen nothing for this. We can take is as read avatar memes exist somewhere, but given anything moderately popular is memeified and eventually seen by anyone terminally online, their confinement is notable.

 

Again, not an insult to the movie. I know Avatar fans are exquisitely sensitive to cultural impact discourse and see it as concern trolling, but this is not that. If anything the movie's distance from social media is enjoyably old school. I'm saying I quite like it.

I have extremely limited exposure to memes but I believe what you're saying to be true.

 

1. We exist within the English Speaking internet, which is primarly dominated by american culture. The Domestic market relative to it's strength was easily one of the worst markets for Avatar 2, also the UK had a tremendaously slow start.

 

2. The Avatar film franchise is new. When you compare it Marvel, Star Wars, Lord of the Rings. It's seriously a baby. Those all have years and years of fandoms befrore they even had films. Top Gun Maverick was talked about loads, but I didn't see the memes for that.

 

3. glass onion was on netflix

 

I predict as the Avatar universe expands it will get meme'd more and have more social media presence. So, don't be so optomistic that it's going to live in a space outside of memes. Within the next 22 months we'll have a new film and a triple A video game. If those both do well (they will), they'll be a big push for more media, definitely another triple A video game maybe 2 before Avatar 4. We won't get tv shows and cartoons until Avatar 5 is out I think.

 

I don't particularly care how big the Avatar fandom is, I just want the movies to be incredible and also make all the money for the sake of Jim's legacy.

[Deuce66]

11 hours ago, Jiffy said:

Why does the-numbers still have average ticket price at $9.17. Do we have any update on it from a reliable source since 2020.

 

Laziness - you have to drill down in the MPAA Annual Reports to find the numbers. Going by the CNBC article regarding Avatar's box office breakdown, the numbers were.....

 

Premium (IMAX/Dolby/Screen X 2D/3D) : 14% of ticket sales : $15.76/ticket avg.

3D: 3.7% of ticket sales : $16.30/ticket avg.

2D: 82.3% of ticket sales: $12.12/ticket avg. 

 

One can work out the math and see that the avg. ticket price for 2022 is far above $9.17 used by The Numbers. 

 

 

from the CNBC article. 

 

When people go to the movies they have several choices for how to watch a movie. Film formats include traditional 2D viewing, 3D shows and 70 millimeter movies, said Steve Buck of movie data firm EntTelligence. Auditorium formats are digital, often called standard, and then premium, which includes screens like IMAX, Dolby Cinema and ScreenX.

 

Throughout its run, “The Way of Water” has generated nearly 30% of its domestic ticket sales from premium format showings, averaging $17.80 per ticket, according to data from EntTelligence. For comparison, all other movies released in 2022 — not including “The Way of Water” — saw less than 14% of ticket sales from premium showings, averaging $15.76 a ticket.

 

Bolstering box office numbers for the film is the push from Disney and Cameron for 3D showings. This format, which can be found at standard theaters and in premium auditoriums, also carries a higher price tag. Since its release, the “Avatar” sequel has seen more than 56% of its tickets sold for 3D showings. These tickets averaged $16.30 a piece, while traditional 2D tickets sold for around $12.12 each.

 

In 2022, 3D showings accounted for 7.7% of all ticket sales. Removing “The Way of Water,” these tickets were only 3.7% of total sales.
 

[Deuce66]

4 hours ago, Elessar said:

If A2 is underwhelming in terms of tickets sold, so is TGM. Their difference will be minimal. You could say but A2 is the sequel to one of the biggest DOM movies ever, sure, but when has a sequel to a phenomenon outgrossed its original? A2 will come pretty close (again, with the help of higher ATP).

 

I agree with most of this, TGM along with Avatar pushed sales for the premium screens HARD. The only difference between the two is 3D whether on premium screens or regular (Avatar). Both movies benefitted tremendously from the premium formats esp. IMAX. 

[SchumacherFTW]

24 minutes ago, Deuce66 said:

 

I agree with most of this, TGM along with Avatar pushed sales for the premium screens HARD. The only difference between the two is 3D whether on premium screens or regular (Avatar). Both movies benefitted tremendously from the premium formats esp. IMAX. 

The main difference on that front is Top Gun only gained those screens sporadically after the first 2 weeks, so the majority of its earnings were in standard shows, while Avatar has had an almost unimpeded 7 weeks in all PLFs thus far.