Arrival | Nov 11, 2016 | Villeneuve/Adams/Renner | First Reviews Have Arrived.

[4815162342]

7 hours ago, CJohn said:

Hail Villeneuve.

 

That's right

 

 

@MrPink

[The Futurist]

Vive le Québec Libre !

[Kalo]

So BOM is only predicting a $25m opening for this. That seems a little low to me.

[WrathOfHan]

Just now, Kalo said:

So BOM is only predicting a $25m opening for this. That seems a little low to me.

That's actually a bit high. Presales are weak and it isn't opening in many theaters.

[Kalo]

16 minutes ago, WrathOfHan said:

That's actually a bit high. Presales are weak and it isn't opening in many theaters.

 

Maybe. but it's been getting rave reviews forever, and it's sci-fi theme seems like it would be a little more audience friendly than most art house films.

[AniNate]

It doesn't have a huge budget and Villeneuve doesn't have mainstream cred yet

 

I'm expecting word-of-mouth will get it close to $100 mil

[Bernie]

Industry expectations earlier in the week forecasted the film would open in the low-to-mid teens, but that is beginning to look low at this point. After we've building a set of competitive titles to compare against an opening in the mid-twenties is seeming more and more likely.

An examination of pre-release IMDb page view data against titles such as Elysium ($29.8m opening) and Edge of Tomorrow ($28.7m opening) show the film carrying a similar pace at the same point in the release cycle. Additionally, online ticket seller Fandango.com says the film is currently outselling Edge of Tomorrow at the same point in the Fandango sales cycle. While Cruise and Blunt may carry a bit more box office weight than Arrival's Amy Adams and Jeremy Renner, those figures can't be ignored, which is why we're expecting an opening around $25 million this weekend.http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4240&p=.htm

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bernie]

How is this outselling Edge of Tomorrow? 

[Tyrian]

Non- spoiler part of my post:

 

I just got back from seeing Arrival. For several weeks leading up to its release it was sitting at 100% on Rotten Tomatoes (with over 80 reviews) and has now 'dropped' to 96% with 155 reviews. While we always joke about rotten tomatoes 'getting it right/wrong', seeing such strong critical acclaim definitely gets you curious to see what all the fuss is about.

 

And if you love your sci/fi, the trailers suggest a film about 12 alien ships arriving and the worldwide reactions of the aftermath, and we all all know how other films in this genre traditionally go.. right? (eg Independence Day - there will be lots of explosions, cringe worthy cliches, terrible acting, destruction-porn everywhere, big dramatic set pieces, kick some major alien ass etc)

 

And that is most certainly not what Arrival delivers, it's the complete opposite (so it's not surprisingly being referred to as "Anti-Independence Day" by viewers/reviewers... and it' so wonderfully refreshing to say and experience that for a film in this genre. We need more smart sci fi films.

 

The best way to describe the film, in non-spoiler terms, is a beautiful and poignant slowburning emotive crescendo - which will resonate with you long after leaving the cinema.

 

Since leaving the cinema i've been thinking about it nonstop, trying to make sense of it all - and the only real way to do that is simply to have a repeat viewing tomorrow. The second viewing will be in a completely different light.

 

Its definitely a film to avoid spoilers for, so if you're curious to see it and wondering whether it'll be any good - stop reading - and go see it before you taint the experience of seeing it by finding out too much.

--

 

 

 

 

Click for spoiler discussion:

 

 

 

 

Spoiler

 

Alright, who guessed the twist or saw it coming?

 

The big revelation that Louises 'memories of the past' were actually 'visions of the future', because she now sees time as non-linear just like the Heptapods. That the audience made a lot of assumptions which were basically all wrong. That, during the events of the film, shes never had a child or was married, and she never was in post-grief depression after losing her daughter to cancer. That with the single line, "Who is this child?" Louise had yet to ever give birth or meet the girl we've so convincingly seen Adam Adams acting alongside with the whole film as mother/daughter.

 

All of those scenes occur after the film! I didnt guess everything that was coming - but I definitely kept noticing 'things that were odd' but didnt put everything together neatly. Eg:

 

- The director purposely shows us in a scene Louises daughters 'hands walking on the river rocks' - like Thing from Adams Family - from an angle which looked essentially the same as the Heptapods through the glass.  I noticed that immediately, and seemed strange to display this visual cue for events that occured years before the film itself (which we find out later is completely wrong).

 

- Where Louise says (when questioned about whether shes ok) 'shes been having dreams', I never assumed that 'her memories ' the audience was watching were actually the dreams she explicitly referred to! And Louise herself at this point didnt realise either they werent really dreams. Great line in hindsight after watching the film to point out.

 

- The daughter making playdough shaped like the Heptapods / Hands. Again - seemed strange she apparently had made this years before the film. I thought is the director trying to imply the daughter was a psychic or something to know the future and know it'll be an image relevant for Louise in future?

 

- When Louises daughter (in another "memory" that was actually a vision) asked a question and she says something like (paraphrasing) 'if you want science ask your father'. With the audience not knowing the identify of the father had actually already been revealed. I noticed the tidbit that she must have married a scientist, but didnt assume it was Jeremy Renners character (who I obviously knew was 'a science guy')

 

I'm still a little confused regarding the scene surrounding Louise and General Shang. Can someone help clarify it? Shang tells her he will "Never forget what you told me", but she never came up with what to say on her own, it was actually General Shang himself who told-her-what-to-tell-him? General Shang effectively told himself with Louise as proxy? And Louise simply repeated the words. If so, who prompted General Shang to tell her in the first place? (Did the Heptopods tell him to tell her this seemingly random and deeply personal quote regarding his dying wifes words or say 'show her ur private phone number' or something?)

 

- What did the husband leave Louise? From that scene its implied she told him that the daughter was going to die from X on Y date, and he simply couldnt handle or accept it? And "Made the wrong choice" to leave him? I need to rewatch that scene again more carefully. Im inferring that the key juxtapose here is that Louise has accepted the life shes going to live - the good the bad and the ugly - (given she essentially knows her future/destiny) and a man of science simply cant accept that after being told (understandably) and does what a pretty normal person would do.. freak the hell out and run away.

 

- Also referencing the above scene, it gives dramatic more meaning to the line the daughter says referring to the father 'doesnt look at me in the same way'. Because the father has been told his daughter is going to die. He must be wondering if its true or not. If he thinks its true he must see sadness or guilt whenever he looks at her (you certainly would look at your child in a different way, if you knew or were told they were going to die and couldnt bring yourself to accept it or werent sure if it was 100% true etc)

 

I really need to re-watch the film (especially the shang/louise scene), so I can view it with the context of the correct timeline in place, knowing which scenes are actually present/future - and pay attention to more subtle and visual cues etc.

 

Anyone else have any thoughts on this or things they noticed / missed / picked up on etc?

 

What did you guys think of the film? I hope studios make more smart sci-fi films like this. We dont need to see the world blowing up, or kick major alian ass every single time - to have a satisfying, compelling Alien sci film experience.

 

 

Lots of little clues, both visual and spoken, which really need a second viewing to notice/appreciate.

 

 

 

.

Edited November 11, 2016 by Tyrian

[DeeCee]

Spoiler

On two points above. 

 

-What the Chinese general told her was a classic time loop. She had the memory of him telling her what to say. He told her what to say because she probably told him on the phone call. 

 

-She clearly told her husband that their daughter was going to die from a rare disease and there was nothing they could do about it. She may have even told her daughter her fate at one point. 

 

-I knew when she said ask her father about science stuff that Renner was the father.  It wouldn't have made sense for it to be anyone else.

 

Edited November 11, 2016 by DeeCee

[Tyrian]

Spoiler

"-What the Chinese general told her was a classic time loop. She had the memory of him telling her what to say. He told her what to say because she probably told him on the phone call.  "

 

Yeah im still trying to get my head around this. The events of Louise at the ball where she met General Shang - happened after the film - so during that ball scene, Louise has already experienced / has a memory of the full events of the film itself (which would include her telling the general via the phone the wifes dying words - and knowing exactly what she said). So she shouldve already known what he was about to tell her during the scene, when she implied she didnt? That bit confuses me.

 

 

Edited November 11, 2016 by Tyrian

[DeeCee]

Spoiler

I think you are supposed to think of the two moments co-existing at once.  She knows what he's going to say yet doesn't know at the same time. 

 

[Tyrian]

Spoiler

Yeah. I can accept that. Putting it down to... "some strange quirk of time occurs in that moment". 

 

I'll pay much closer attention to the scene when I watch it again tonight, because General Shang himself also implies that hes doing/saying something but doesnt know or understand why hes doing/saying it.

 

So it's like they both were swept up together by an unseen, conspiring force we dont understand. (and dont really need to)

 

Edited November 11, 2016 by Tyrian

[La Binoche]

Just posted my thoughts in the reviews thread: 

 

ARRIVAL is a beautiful film, at once cerebral and deeply emotional. It's somber and deliberately paced, like a movie from the '70s. It takes its time as it slowly, confidently builds toward unlocking the big mystery of what the aliens want and the intimate mystery of who Amy Adams is. But above all it is a movie about ideas, grand ideas that I won't spoil but which are delivered through a very human lens. The twist ending makes you look at the entire movie in a different light and takes your breath away. Dennis Villeneuve is 3 for 3 with his foray into studio filmmaking and the great Amy Adams carries the movie with what may be her best performance yet. 

 

I have a few gripes (not crazy about the alien designs, the scene where Adams goes up alone to talk to the lone alien, or how the reveal of what the aliens want is quickly glossed over) about an otherwise sad, thought-provoking, intelligent and moving film. 

 

Not sure how the general audience will respond to what can best be described as CONTACT meets CLOSE ENCOUNTERS meets THE TREE OF LIFE. 

 

A-

 

 

[La Binoche]

Oh and I thought the score was gorgeous but WHY is it literally a copy of this music??? 

 

 

 

[Tyrian]

13 minutes ago, La Binoche said:

Just posted my thoughts in the reviews thread: 

 

ARRIVAL is a beautiful film, at once cerebral and deeply emotional. It's somber and deliberately paced, like a movie from the '70s. It takes its time as it slowly, confidently builds toward unlocking the big mystery of what the aliens want and the intimate mystery of who Amy Adams is. But above all it is a movie about ideas, grand ideas that I won't spoil but which are delivered through a very human lens. The twist ending makes you look at the entire movie in a different light and takes your breath away. Dennis Villeneuve is 3 for 3 with his foray into studio filmmaking and the great Amy Adams carries the movie with what may be her best performance yet. 

 

I have a few gripes (not crazy about the alien designs, the scene where Adams goes up alone to talk to the lone alien, or how the reveal of what the aliens want is quickly glossed over) about an otherwise sad, thought-provoking, intelligent and moving film. 

 

Not sure how the general audience will respond to what can best be described as CONTACT meets CLOSE ENCOUNTERS meets THE TREE OF LIFE. 

 

A-

 

 

 

 

Close Encounters of the Linguistics Kind.

 

Edited November 11, 2016 by Tyrian

[antovolk]

1 hour ago, La Binoche said:

Oh and I thought the score was gorgeous but WHY is it literally a copy of this music??? 

 

 

 

It's not a copy - it is this music. Max Richter's On The Nature of Daylight

[JohnnyGossamer]

2 hours ago, La Binoche said:

Just posted my thoughts in the reviews thread: 

 

ARRIVAL is a beautiful film, at once cerebral and deeply emotional. It's somber and deliberately paced, like a movie from the '70s. It takes its time as it slowly, confidently builds toward unlocking the big mystery of what the aliens want and the intimate mystery of who Amy Adams is. But above all it is a movie about ideas, grand ideas that I won't spoil but which are delivered through a very human lens. The twist ending makes you look at the entire movie in a different light and takes your breath away. Dennis Villeneuve is 3 for 3 with his foray into studio filmmaking and the great Amy Adams carries the movie with what may be her best performance yet. 

 

I have a few gripes (not crazy about the alien designs, the scene where Adams goes up alone to talk to the lone alien, or how the reveal of what the aliens want is quickly glossed over) about an otherwise sad, thought-provoking, intelligent and moving film. 

 

Not sure how the general audience will respond to what can best be described as CONTACT meets CLOSE ENCOUNTERS meets THE TREE OF LIFE. 

 

A-

 

 

Essentially wholeheartedly fall in line with your thoughts.

 

Oh, I think it will over perform somewhat OW and then drop harshly. This is not a movie for the GA. Honestly, it's even less a movie for the GA than Sicario and Prisoners in my view.

 

It's a bizarre concoction that's more in line with the provocative, bittersweet Midnight Special  and Contact than stuff like Interstellar and even Close Encounters for that matter.

 

Anecdotal but the audience I was with had more than a handful of walk outs and audiences complaints as I left. I noticed a very similar reaction to Midnight Special. People thought they were getting something much different than what was marketed and, such being, were disappointed.

 

Again, I pretty much adored this one. Imperfect but more harrowing for me than Midnight Special. Actually, impacted me much like The Witch earlier this year. Simple but beautifully communicated.

[Tyrian]

Spoilers from my second viewing + Notes I made

 

I just got back from my second viewing of Arrival  and made some notes during key scenes of things I either missed / misunderstood / was confused by during the first:

 

Spoiler

 

The "Louise meets with General Shang" scene is pivotal and I couldnt remember the exact wording after my first viewing, so I wrote it down during my second. This is how it went

 

General Shang comments how Louise reached out and called him on his private number.

Louise: "I dont know your private number"

General Shang leans over and shows Louise her phone with his private number displayed.

Shang: "Now you know. I do not claim to know how your mind works, but I believe it was important for you to see that."

Louise: "I called you, didnt I?"

Shang: "Yes, you did".

Shang: "I will never forget what you said".

Louise looks at him seemingly confused/unaware what hes referring to. Shang leans in to whisper in her ear.

Shang: "You told me my wifes dying words".

 

So this is a paradox in the film. Louise, during the events of the film, is dialling a phone number and saying something that she doesnt actually know until some time later in the future. And later in the future: Shang, for and unknown and unexplained reasons - even to him - feels that its important to show Louise his private number and repeat to her something she had (apparently unknown even to her) told him in the past.

 

From his POV during the ball scene: He was telling her something she already knew, because she'd already repeated it back to him in the past (during the phonecall / events of the film)

From her POV during the ball scene: He was telling her something that she didnt apparently know.

 

So she already knew (his pov) yet she didnt  know (her pov) what the General told her.  Enough to make your head explode!

 

Anyone else want to try and give their take to succinctly explain what is happening in this scene?

 

---

 

Other notes I made:

 

The scene regarding Louise and her daughter having a show called, "Mummy and Daddy talk to animals" and the daughter presents a picture of what I assumed was just their family on the first viewing. Maybe with a pet or something, I didnt notice the bottom half of the image on first viewing. But looking more carefully on the second, its actually a picture of mum/dad and.... a bird in a cage.

 

So midway through the film the audience has basically already been told the ending. 'Mummy and daddy talking to animals' - then a picture of mum/dad/bird in a cage. Obviously afterwards we know that mum and dad is louise and ian, and they werent talking to animals but rather the heptapods. And the canary in the cage wasnt what they were talking to, but rather what they brought along with them during their visits. On first viewing this wouldnt make sense because the audience will assume that its a 'memory of the past' of her dead daughter - but its actually in the future and her dauguhter doing a presentation at school essentially of events that are transpiring during the film itself.

 

 

-----

 

 

Another key scene I had to make notes to understand:

 

Daughter: (referring to father) "He doesnt look at me the same way you do"

Louise: "Its my fault. I told him something he wasnt ready to hear."

Daughter: "What?"

Louise: "Believe it or not, I know something thats going to happen. I cant explain how I know, I just do. And when I told your daddy he got really mad and said I made the wrong choice.

Daughter: "What is going to happen?"
Louise: "It has to do with a really rare disease and its unstoppable."

 

During my first viewing I didnt know what Louise meant when she said the daddy thought she 'made the wrong choice'. What choice?

 

Well that makes more sense after second viewing. The 'choice' Louise made was highlighted at the end of the film when she basically asks him if he knew how his life was going to turn out, would he do it anyway/change anything etc. Louise chose to live her life anyway, with the good the bad and the ugly. She may have lost her daughter and endured alot of hardship and saddess, but she clearly still had good and positive experiences and memories along the way she cherished, and decided that that life was still a life worth living.

 

The husband, being a man of science, understandably had a pretty normal reaction. Freaked out. 'The choice' referenced basically explains his angry reaction thought procees, which is essentially , 'why would you allow this to happen if you knew in advance - knowing how much sadness / pain / hardship it would bring to both of us?". And he got angry. Again - very understandable reaction.

 

Ultimately, the 'wrong choice' the father thinks Louise made is the answer to the literal last line of the film, "Do you want to make a baby?" to which she said "yes". Thats the wrong choice he was referring to.

 

 

 

 

A good spoiler-filled explanation for denofgeek interpreted the film can be found here: http://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies/arrival/259944/explaining-the-arrival-ending

Edited November 11, 2016 by Tyrian

[James]

Seeing this in about 2 hours.