Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny | June 30 2023 | Very mixed reviews out of Cannes

[Godzilla]

3 minutes ago, FunkMiller said:

Let’s face it, the one character they should have recast is Indiana Jones.

Might've even flopped harder if they did that. 

[FunkMiller]

8 minutes ago, Godzilla said:

Might've even flopped harder if they did that. 

Depends on who it is,I guess. With Lucasfilm the way it’s being run though, I doubt it would have been a good choice, and you’re probably right.

[Godzilla]

7 minutes ago, FunkMiller said:

Depends on who it is,I guess. With Lucasfilm the way it’s being run though, I doubt it would have been a good choice, and you’re probably right.

Which again goes back why didnt they bring back Mutt. You have a direct descendant to take up the mantle of Indiana Jones for future films. I'm not saying I want future films but Disney sure seems to want more franchises they could've done it that way. I think Glenn Powell would've been a good recast. He looks like he could be Harrison Ford's son and is an up and coming star. Plus he has the physicality for an Indy film and can probably do a lot of stunts himself. 

[vale9001]

 

 

[FunkMiller]

44 minutes ago, Godzilla said:

Which again goes back why didnt they bring back Mutt. You have a direct descendant to take up the mantle of Indiana Jones for future films. I'm not saying I want future films but Disney sure seems to want more franchises they could've done it that way. I think Glenn Powell would've been a good recast. He looks like he could be Harrison Ford's son and is an up and coming star. Plus he has the physicality for an Indy film and can probably do a lot of stunts himself. 

They screwed the son angle with Skull. And Mutt Williams is such a terrible name. Marion should have called him Illinois. That would have worked. Illinois Jones And The Thingamijig of Whatsit. Sounds good.

[KC7]

Yeah, given how some people bitched about the idea of Mutt taking over the franchise back in the Crystal Skull days, it's hard to believe the idea would be considered more acceptable 15 years later just because a new actor was playing him. Lucasfilm may have made a lot of mistakes, but they were right that that was a no-go.

[MightyDargon]

The amount of gaslighting you'd need to have to come up with the idea that people actually enjoyed the Mutt character....is....hoo boy.

[Godzilla]

24 minutes ago, MightyDargon said:

The amount of gaslighting you'd need to have to come up with the idea that people actually enjoyed the Mutt character....is....hoo boy.

I didnt say people liked the character but for last adventure it'd make sense for him to come back. You can just recast the character and make him likable. 

[Human]

When 12 year old me saw CS in theaters I enjoyed Mutt.  I called him Henry III.  

[John Marston]

the first 15 minutes was genuinely good. The rest of the movie eh. 

[The Dark Alfred]

Just came back from my viewing. I enjoyed it, but felt like the whole film was on autopilot. No creativity. Third act was really bad. If they had cut this to a two hour movie, it would have been much better. The first hour was decent.

[Mr Roark]

1 hour ago, John Marston said:

the first 15 minutes was genuinely good. The rest of the movie eh. 

Too CGI heavy for me but yes the fact that it was the best part of the film speaks volumes…

[WittyUsername]

Mutt is the Jar Jar Binks of Indiana Jones. I suppose they could’ve hypothetically brought him back with a different actor to try and redeem the character, but why bother? Just to do a passing of the torch story? 

[Daf]

15 hours ago, rebelscum86 said:

 

Poignant post. the cultural conflict is more philosophical and ethical than political. We have been dealing with nihilism in the culture for decades but we went full Derida about 10 years ago. Now some are mad when people care about things and will scornfully deconstruct them to rub your face in it that nothing is worth care or respect.

Deconstruction is not impressive to many and has all the maturity and wit of teen agnst. It's like a creator being proud they found the mechanism and wants to show it off as if no one else knew the mechanisms used to build things. The deconstructivist is so impressed with the tool they ignore what can be built with it.

We have always had band wars in music, geeks have tons of brand wars b/c instinctually we do know things need to profit and if what we like gets less profit than what we dislike, we will get less of what we like and more of what we don't, but the first time I ever saw people angry at others disliking something was Ghostbusters 2016 and it never stopped.

Frankly I have no idea what you're talking about. Why do you think Dial of Destiny is a deconstruction of Indiana Jones?

[Daf]

3 hours ago, vale9001 said:

 

 

Barbie's been an icon a lot longer than Indiana Jones has, lol! 

 

But in any case, it's dumb to make artificial competitions like this.

[TomThomas]

36 minutes ago, WittyUsername said:

Mutt is the Jar Jar Binks of Indiana Jones. I suppose they could’ve hypothetically brought him back with a different actor to try and redeem the character, but why bother? Just to do a passing of the torch story? 

What's the point in doing even worse character instead then? It didn't work with son, why would it work with forced goddaughter?

[dudalb]

6 hours ago, Godzilla said:

They could've easily recasted Mutt and bring back Short Round if they wanted to. 

Myabe, the the failure of Mutt was as much an writing issue as an issue with Shia. He was a badly written charecter.

This is  a problem Ihave with many people here. when a charecter fails, they blame the actor but often what the writer off the hook when the writer might be more to blame then the actor.  Jesse Eisenberg took a lot of heat for Lex Luthor in BvS. I did not care for  Lex in BvS at all, but I blame the writers  and Snyder more then Jesse. He just gave Snyder what Snyder wanted for Lex.

Best thing to do with a failed charecter in a franchise is minimize him (The Jar Jar solution;you know Lucas inteded Jar Jar to be a major charecter in the prequels, but had the sense to realize Jar Jar was not liked, and made him into a  bit player)  or write him off completly.

Spoiler

Thought I think the way they dealt with Mutt, killing him offscreen in VIetnam, was a bit  cliched and trite.

 

[dudalb]

19 minutes ago, TomThomas said:

What's the point in doing even worse character instead then? It didn't work with son, why would it work with forced goddaughter?

Depends on how the charecter was written.

But I am not sure the torch is passable; I think the Indy franchise will not work without Indy.

Not every franchise works like a comic book franchise with easily replacable main charecters.

The only chance the franchise has is to recast Indy and go back to the 30's and 40's, but not sure  how recasting would work.

Edited July 2, 2023 by dudalb

[dudalb]

46 minutes ago, Daf said:

Frankly I have no idea what you're talking about. Why do you think Dial of Destiny is a deconstruction of Indiana Jones?

It's not.

I despise deconstruction as much as the guy we are talking about, but this was not a case of deconstruction. I think the writing for Dial had many flaws, but it was not deliberate deconstruction.

[dudalb]

1 hour ago, WittyUsername said:

Mutt is the Jar Jar Binks of Indiana Jones. I suppose they could’ve hypothetically brought him back with a different actor to try and redeem the character, but why bother? Just to do a passing of the torch story? 

Particularly when nobody like the charecter the torch is being passed to.