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grey ghost

How good would TFA need to be to live up to the hype?

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I don't think a RT score will have anything to do with people being disappointed or not.

But, I am guessing for most people, it has to be better than all the prequels for it to live up to any hype.  I don't think anyone expects the best SW movie, but it has to be close to the OT for people to really take notice

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I think it isn't even about THE quality (at least as the quality is good++), I think even more important are:

- the story's world feeling, character matching to the story, a kind of ~ seamless adding (is that a term?), at best to both trilogies in feeling, but better character/actor... story and line choices than e.g. Anakin's...  - if greatly done, it can trump a bit of lessened quality

- the enjoyability, the want to 'need' to re-watch it

for drama... someone dying,... getting caught is one thing, to slaughter too many, to make the story especially in it's first part too dire might be counter-productive for re-watch wants.

Hype... depends on what the hype is about too, or? BO, quality, drama, cool 3d, action, whatever,...... , especially with Star Wars VII it seems not to be all the same.

I think especially part 3 was not aimed at 'feeling good after the 1st watching, I want to see it again soon / often', especially by non-geeks/fans (I am not sure about the correct term, friendly meant)

 

About the BO part (not hype):

If / which /... records will break on the long run might also depend on how strongly it (trilogy) gets the female audience also hooked, including bad press about merchandise ignorance might get - if hyped by certain news outlets not owned by Disney - in the way for some percentages. But I think that might gotten for the OW.... taken care of via the female lead (team of leads?)

 

 

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9 hours ago, The Stingray said:

If people are expecting ESB then they're stupid and only have themselves to blame when it fails to deliver.

Quote

"No movie sequel is better than The Empire Strikes Back." You might eat those words for Xmas dinner in 2015. Joy & Indigestion to the world!

Courtesy of this bumbling and grating golden tattletale.

TBH, I don't give a damn about TFA being better or worse than any SW, we're not in the eighties anymore and it will be forgettable fluff for manchildren clinging to their childhood plastic toys worldwide

"Move along, nothing to see here..."

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9 hours ago, dashrendar44 said:

Courtesy of this bumbling and grating golden tattletale.

TBH, I don't give a damn about TFA being better or worse than any SW, we're not in the eighties anymore and it will be forgettable fluff for manchildren clinging to their childhood plastic toys worldwide

"Move along, nothing to see here..."

Reliving the wonder and awe of a child is one of life's greatest gifts.

Everybody has their drug whether it's sex, cars, money, fame, or other shallow pursuits. Why attack some nerd's vivid and hopeful imagination which seems almost virtuous by comparison?

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9 hours ago, grey ghost said:

Reliving the wonder and awe of a child is one of life's greatest gifts.

Everybody has their drug whether it's sex, cars, money, fame, or other shallow pursuits. Why attack some nerd's vivid and hopeful imagination which seems almost virtuous by comparison?

 

It's the infantilization of society at work. Keeping people numb by maintaining them and indulging them into an artificial bubble of childhood nostalgia to never grow up and actually confront, challenge and tackle complex and real issues as an adult where things are not as black and white as their childhood fantasy. Jean Baudrillard described that phenomenon in his book "America" and SW's oral fixation by a whole generation of supposed adults is one of the culprits that crystallizes this global phenomenon. It annoys me to no end to see 30-45 grown-ups treating SW, a manichean Flash Gordon rip-off like the Alpha and Omega of moviemaking and storytelling. SW should be something you enjoy when you're young then move on to more complex material as you grow up but most never got past that phase and turn that into a religion kneeling into an arrested development. You will never relive the pure awe of being a child because you're not a child anymore, it will always be an ersatz, a taxidermist recreation, an artificial stimulus that lacked the genuine appreciation you once had but you're not exactly the same person anymore. Pursuing this "lost child awe" is a hopeless mirage like being stuck in Peter Pan syndrome longing for a Neverland that is no more.

 

It's interesting that Simon Pegg who is kind of a SW fanboy posterboy aptly described that phenomenon. What is vivid and imaginative about going back into something that was created in 1977? It's a regression to play in an old sandbox not an invitation to leap further into the unknown.

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1 hour ago, dashrendar44 said:

 

It's the infantilization of society at work. Keeping people numb by maintaining them and indulging them into an artificial bubble of childhood nostalgia to never grow up and actually confront, challenge and tackle complex and real issues as an adult where things are not as black and white as their childhood fantasy. Jean Baudrillard described that phenomenon in his book "America" and SW's oral fixation by a whole generation of supposed adults is one of the culprits that crystallizes this global phenomenon. It annoys me to no end to see 30-45 grown-ups treating SW, a manichean Flash Gordon rip-off like the Alpha and Omega of moviemaking and storytelling. SW should be something you enjoy when you're young then move on to more complex material as you grow up but most never got past that phase and turn that into a religion kneeling into an arrested development. You will never relive the pure awe of being a child because you're not a child anymore, it will always be an ersatz, a taxidermist recreation, an artificial stimulus that lacked the genuine appreciation you once had but you're not exactly the same person anymore. Pursuing this "lost child awe" is a hopeless mirage like being stuck in Peter Pan syndrome longing for a Neverland that is no more.

 

It's interesting that Simon Pegg who is kind of a SW fanboy posterboy aptly described that phenomenon. What is vivid and imaginative about going back into something that was created in 1977? It's a regression to play in an old sandbox not an invitation to leap further into the unknown.

 

I get where you're coming from but can't you do both? Face the realities, challenges and hardships of life, and still take a trip down memory lane every once in a while.

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1 hour ago, dashrendar44 said:

It's interesting that Simon Pegg who is kind of a SW fanboy posterboy aptly described that phenomenon. What is vivid and imaginative about going back into something that was created in 1977? It's a regression to play in an old sandbox not an invitation to leap further into the unknown.

What's with fans who were already working... at the time of their releaase?

You seem to start out with your ... formulation of your theory based on all older fans were children / teens at the then.

Me, female, first anti-cliche according to some posters here an in the net, am a fan. Was one of the people already working too btw.

 

What I can tell you is this:

there were quite some non-mother women in the audience then too and a lot of adult men also.

You might want to check some pictures out, even in a lot of the ones posted in the Star Wars thread there were lots of older (incl. female) people waiting in line, without their children. I speak of people then ~ 35y up, not YA.

 

Beside that:

remember, not all counts for all, It's a regression... sounds rather finite/absolute to me (term? Not allowing the possibility of other versions / reasons)

 

Simon Pegg is able to behave immature and seemingly also able to react out of a rather narrow POV as far as his reactions reached my awareness (if analyzing his reactions really closley), he would be not a person I'd quote for 'maturity insight' (haven't read what he said as I won't add clicks on 'him')

Beside that:

What an actor / writer / director / filmmaker (meant as: not only for Pegg counting) has to say in connection to movies might be right out of his/her experience, too many people seem to forget that there are also other experiences, interpretations at least as valid as theirs. And not all good filmmakers are good with understanding / interpretating people in general, even if able to do good movies about them. Example: might have experiences with e.g. artists,.. but maybe not with workers or,...

Hence the reason I don't like absolute declarations / judgements... counting for all people

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1 hour ago, terrestrial said:

What's with fans who were already working... at the time of their releaase?

You seem to start out with your ... formulation of your theory based on all older fans were children / teens at the then.

Me, female, first anti-cliche according to some posters here an in the net, am a fan. Was one of the people already working too btw.

 

What I can tell you is this:

there were quite some non-mother women in the audience then too and a lot of adult men also.

You might want to check some pictures out, even in a lot of the ones posted in the Star Wars thread there were lots of older (incl. female) people waiting in line, without their children. I speak of people then ~ 35y up, not YA.

 

 

 

Pegg examines the impact of SW craze and infantilization on his generation because it's prevalent in the generation X  but baby boomers actually started it (Lucas generation), what is called "nerdy pop culture" that is now Hollywood formulaic cash cow so saying "I'm a baby boomer and a SW fan so Pegg is wrong" is actually proving his point. Those pre-sales datas proves his point. Majority of people who felt the urge to scrap every advanced SW7 tickets are 34+.

 

 

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3 hours ago, dashrendar44 said:

 

It's the infantilization of society at work. Keeping people numb by maintaining them and indulging them into an artificial bubble of childhood nostalgia to never grow up and actually confront, challenge and tackle complex and real issues as an adult where things are not as black and white as their childhood fantasy. Jean Baudrillard described that phenomenon in his book "America" and SW's oral fixation by a whole generation of supposed adults is one of the culprits that crystallizes this global phenomenon. It annoys me to no end to see 30-45 grown-ups treating SW, a manichean Flash Gordon rip-off like the Alpha and Omega of moviemaking and storytelling. SW should be something you enjoy when you're young then move on to more complex material as you grow up but most never got past that phase and turn that into a religion kneeling into an arrested development. You will never relive the pure awe of being a child because you're not a child anymore, it will always be an ersatz, a taxidermist recreation, an artificial stimulus that lacked the genuine appreciation you once had but you're not exactly the same person anymore. Pursuing this "lost child awe" is a hopeless mirage like being stuck in Peter Pan syndrome longing for a Neverland that is no more.

 

It's interesting that Simon Pegg who is kind of a SW fanboy posterboy aptly described that phenomenon. What is vivid and imaginative about going back into something that was created in 1977? It's a regression to play in an old sandbox not an invitation to leap further into the unknown.

 

You'd have a point if most older Star Wars fans were hermit virgins who don't pay bills but many of them support and raise a family and take care of their responsibilities.

 

It seems pretty harmless if they appreciate Star Wars mythos in addition to other things.

 

How is Star Wars more harmful to people and society than sports, video games or any other entertainment?

 

What adult matters are so incredibly neglected by most Star Wars fans that it's harmful to society?

 

Do you hate all fandom or just Star Wars for some weird reason?

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11 minutes ago, dashrendar44 said:

 

Pegg examines the impact of SW craze and infantilization on his generation because it's prevalent in the generation X  but baby boomers actually started it (Lucas generation), what is called "nerdy pop culture" that is now Hollywood formulaic cash cow so saying "I'm a baby boomer and a SW fan so Pegg is wrong" is actually proving his point. Those pre-sales datas proves his point. Majority of people who felt the urge to scrap every advanced SW7 tickets are 34+.

 

 

 

How did Generation X fail? The problems of the world can be attributed to greedy bankers and Muslim extremists, not fanboys, gamers, etc.

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Fanboy culture is sociologically responsible for amplifying the infantilization of adults and keeping us numb in a state of arrested development in the face of real and complex issues that movies that are not "geek-friendly" tackle. But they're "boring" because fanboys approach things in a child-like manner where spectacle, shallow entertainment and instant gratification rule more than reflection and grounded stories. Hollow Escapism for the sake of it without meaning, without point, without POV, being the popular norm. Have you ever see a fanboy protest for economical and societal issues, no he's too busy conforming to society by being a cog in the machine (so that means working and complying for the system without questioning it as long as it churns out the cuddly toys of his childhood) and consuming his fanboy properties while waiting eagerly for the next CBM popcorn movie like the second coming. The inherent pettiness when dealing with argumented criticism leveled at their favourite properties throwing childish tantrums online is symptomatic too.

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