***SPOILERS***SPOILERS***SPIDER-MAN:FAR FROM HOME SPOILER THREAD***SPOILERS ALLOWED***SPOILERS***

[justvision]

12 minutes ago, fabiopazzo2 said:

Its too early for Miles, maybe in SM 4

Yes, let finish the trilogy of Peter Parker first. Then talk about introducing other versions of Spidey for young Avengers, dark Avengers whatever.

[Ruthie]

I don't believe for a single second that Beck is dead.  He's the master of illusion and EDITH is his technology.  I think he tweaked EDITH to have it tell Parker that what he was seeing, a dead Beck, was real.  Beck will likely be phase four's, and maybe five's, Loki.  

[BK007]

This was thoroughly mediocre. If this was meant to tease the next stage of the MCU, count me out. 

 

After the reviews and Feige saying this closes the chapter and sets the next one up, I expected a lot more. 

 

Villain was amongst the worst in the canon. I mean, you just knew Mysterio would be the villain from the trailer and he is. 

 

All the reveals were cringeworthy, the twists were forced and the humour and dialogue so unnatural. It's a pity because I like Holland and the cast of kids actually has a lot of potential for interplay but not here. The teachers were beyond bad and the rest of the newly added kids added nothing. Token hijab girl for inclusivity was so forced. First, to be Muslim doesn't mean you need to wear a hijab and if you see the Iranian women jailed for protesting against wearing it, it's just forced Hollywood whitewashing without understanding. 

 

But I digress, Homecoming was also mediocre and barely kept together by the chemistry of the kids. I guess Spiderman is meant to be the light-hearted side of the MCU but it would've been more interesting to have more than just Brad (did he even exist in Homecoming?) as the sole "5 years older" person and deal more with that instead of carting off to Europe for some shit CGI action. 

 

Back in the mid 2000s, franchises that were running out of steam would change location; X-Men, Rush Hour etc. but that was just a red flag for creative bankruptcy and unfortunately FFH ends up in that same ballpark. 

 

 

[baumer]

Well I feel the complete opposite of BK007. I do agree that some of the villain stuff wasn't perfect but the strong point of far from home was the quieter moments. It was Peter Parker having feelings for MJ and not being sure how to express them. There was some really well-written scenes and when you enjoy the interpersonal relationships it just makes the action that much better in my opinion.

 

I like that Happy had a bigger role and I really liked that Nick Fury was given much more to do in this film than he normally has. The plot was kind of like Iron Man 2 But that can be forgiven. Jake Gyllenhaal was really good and I also really enjoyed Martin Starr as one of the teachers.

[justvision]

1 hour ago, Ruthie said:

I don't believe for a single second that Beck is dead.  He's the master of illusion and EDITH is his technology.  I think he tweaked EDITH to have it tell Parker that what he was seeing, a dead Beck, was real.  Beck will likely be phase four's, and maybe five's, Loki.  

EDITH is not his technology, B.A.R.F is.

[Daxtreme]

BK007 Can't say I agree with everything you said but the overall sentiment, yes.

 

This movie lacks a coherent thread gluing it together. It's a bunch of interesting stuff happening in a movie but when put together, it's kinda awkward, at least for me. Most of the characters were pure stereotypes/excessive caricatures of themselves or what type of person they represent (case in point: Ned, the teacher, Betty)

 

Also, Tony Stark chose this kid... really? What has he truly done to be deemed worthy of having the ability to choose between life and death for billions of people? He didn't choose one of his own pals whom he saved the world repeatedly with, but instead this high school kid who lacks experience... Right. It reeks of corporate decision (executives saying Spider-Man WILL be the future of the MCU -- make it happen) in place of a character-driven one, which so far, the MCU has excelled in.

 

Anyway, it was pretty decent, I'd have to rewatch it to be sure, but that's it. I really hope Spider-Man does not become the face of the MCU because I think he works best as a supporting character (like in Avengers 3 and 4)

Edited July 4, 2019 by Daxtreme

[Legion Again]

6 hours ago, captainwondyful said:

Miles is way older than 6.  In Homecoming he's old enough to talk to Aaron on the phone, and it's been at least a five year jump from that.

I mean, 50% chance that he aged 0 years in those 5 years though 😛    

 

Earliest I could see anything significant on Miles from is SM4. Let Peter have his first trilogy to himself, wrap up the high school crew, and then see where you want to take things from there.

[Pure Spirit]

I didn’t stick around for the end credits scene. Yikes... glad I didn’t... that’s some “it was all a dream”-tier bizarreness I can do without.

[Legion Again]

6 minutes ago, Pure Spirit said:

I didn’t stick around for the end credits scene. Yikes... glad I didn’t... that’s some “it was all a dream”-tier bizarreness I can do without.

End credit scene happens equally in the world whether you see it or not. I’d actually rate the movie like a full point lower without it, because Fury acts really gullible and ineffectual, which was very out of character, but required to move the plot along. If he’s just holding an idiot ball because we want to get from point A to point B, that would be pretty sloppy/grating  — but “real Fury was out in space doing more important shit” is a solid justification.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Thanos Legion

[Menor the Destroyer]

22 minutes ago, Daxtreme said:

BK007 Can't say I agree with everything you said but the overall sentiment, yes.

 

This movie lacks a coherent thread gluing it together. It's a bunch of interesting stuff happening in a movie but when put together, it's kinda awkward, at least for me. Most of the characters were pure stereotypes/excessive caricatures of themselves or what type of person they represent (case in point: Ned, the teacher, Betty)

 

Also, Tony Stark chose this kid... really? What has he truly done to be deemed worthy of having the ability to choose between life and death for billions of people? He didn't choose one of his own pals whom he saved the world repeatedly with, but instead this high school kid who lacks experience... Right. It reeks of corporate decision (executives saying Spider-Man WILL be the future of the MCU -- make it happen) in place of a character-driven one, which so far, the MCU has excelled in.

 

Anyway, it was pretty decent, I'd have to rewatch it to be sure, but that's it. I really hope Spider-Man does not become the face of the MCU because I think he works best as a supporting character (like in Avengers 3 and 4)

The thread throughout the movie was Peter rejecting his responsibilities as Spiderman in order to have his own life (similar to Spiderman 2), and then being forced to realize that he can't shirk that responsibility. And Homecoming, IW and Endgame show that Tony has a bit of a paternal view of Peter and feels really guilty about his death so I think it makes sense that he would want to give Peter whatever help he can.

[Pure Spirit]

15 minutes ago, Thanos Legion said:

End credit scene happens equally in the world whether you see it or not. I’d actually rate the movie like a full point lower without it, because Fury acts really gullible and ineffectual, which was very out of character, but required to move the plot along. If he’s just holding an idiot ball because we want to get from point A to point B, that would be pretty sloppy/grating  — but “real Fury was out in space doing more important shit” is a solid justification.

>he was a clone the whole time that’s good writing here’s why

 

yahhh nahhhhhhhh, the movie was fun enough without that “””twist”””

[Legion Again]

IMO Stark giving EDITH to Peter is a really stupid idea, but reeks of egomania and is reasonably in-character. The best two choices would have been Steve or Natasha, and, well...

[Legion Again]

6 minutes ago, Pure Spirit said:

>he was a clone the whole time that’s good writing here’s why

 

yahhh nahhhhhhhh, the movie was fun enough without that “””twist”””

Well, a shapeshifting alien. If you’ve got a plot that doesn’t work without Fury acting like a moron, then sure maybe you should just get a new plot (and tbh this movie’s basic plot with EDITH, Shield, Mysterio did kind of rub me the wrong way).   

 

But of the two following choices:

A) It’s real Fury, and he just lost 50 IQ points this outing for plot contrivance 

B ) real Fury is elsewhere for plot contrivance, and sent a friend to cover for him for a bit   

 

B is kind of silly, but A is just awful. Without the post credits scene it would be A.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Thanos Legion

[Pure Spirit]

3 minutes ago, Thanos Legion said:

IMO Stark giving EDITH to Peter is a really stupid idea, but reeks of egomania and is reasonably in-character. The best two choices would have been Steve or Natasha, and, well...

Agree, also Peter giving it up was pretty dumb but at least made Peter feel dumb and it was paid off.

[justvision]

54 minutes ago, Daxtreme said:

Most of the characters were pure stereotypes/excessive caricatures of themselves or what type of person they represent (case in point: Ned, the teacher, Betty)

 

Also, Tony Stark chose this kid... really? What has he truly done to be deemed worthy of having the ability to choose between life and death for billions of people? He didn't choose one of his own pals whom he saved the world repeatedly with, but instead this high school kid who lacks experience... Right. It reeks of corporate decision (executives saying Spider-Man WILL be the future of the MCU -- make it happen) in place of a character-driven one, which so far, the MCU has excelled in.

I agree strongly with you on the first quoted paragraph on the caricatures thing, and I disagree strongly with you on the second quoted paragraph.

 

In Endgame, Cap and Nat (two of his world saving pals) came to talk to him about time travel time, and Tony just gave them cold shoulder, and what made him change his mind? A look at the photo he took with Peter Parker.

 

Perhaps because you are not a Spidey fan, you have not pay much attention to all the interaction Tony and Peter have gone through from

• CA: Civil War - how Tony observed for months a 15 year old kid fighting street crimes, then recruited him to fight his frenemy Cap (yes, Pete was on his side fighting Cap/Clint/Nat)
• SM:HC - so many heart to heart talk with Pete, how he expected Pete to be a better version of himself. Suffice to say that in the last scene, Tony offered Peter to be an Avenger, and he chose to be a friendly neighborhood Spider-Man. You know a person true character when he can resist the temptation of power.
• In Infinity War, they fought Thanos in outer space, yes, outer space. And the kid dusted away in his embrace.
• And in Endgame, the look at the photo as I mentioned above, the embrace Tony gave when Peter came back from decimation. Peter was one of the three persons that got close to him when he died (I'd have prefer Bruce Banner to be the fourth person though), and he was also the forefront in Tony funeral.

Tony chose Peter Parker because the father-son like relationship, that he trusted his character, that they shared the geeky and nerdy personalities, that when Cap/Nat were against him, Peter was on his side, and he fought (and lost) his nemesis Thanos, Peter was with him, not Cap or others.

 

On the other hand, let's talk about his world saving pals. Cap, Nat and Clint were against him since Civil War, and only in second act of Endgame just before the time travel thing did Tony reconcile with Cap. Edith was likely designed and designated to Peter before that. How about Bruce Banner his good friend? Hulk is always an unstable element, Tony would be crazy to entrust Edith to Bruce. Thor is cosmic being, Edith is not for him.

Edited July 4, 2019 by justvision

[justvision]

14 minutes ago, Pure Spirit said:

>he was a clone the whole time that’s good writing here’s why

 

yahhh nahhhhhhhh, the movie was fun enough without that “””twist”””

As Thanos legion said, that end credit scene is one of the few end credit scenes in MCU that is an integral and organic part of the main movie. (Other end credit scenes either hinted at upcoming subfranchise or just being jesty). It explained why Nick Fury seemed to be a bit out of character, also those Kree Sleeper cell slips.

[Pure Spirit]

17 minutes ago, Thanos Legion said:

Well, a shapeshifting alien. If you’ve got a plot that doesn’t work without Fury acting like a moron, then sure maybe you should just get a new plot (and tbh this movie’s basic plot with EDITH, Shield, Mysterio did kind of rub me the wrong way).   

 

But of the two following choices:

A) It’s real Fury, and he just lost 50 IQ points this outing for plot contrivance 

B ) real Fury is elsewhere for plot contrivance, and sent a friend to cover for him for a bit   

 

B is kind of silly, but A is just awful. Without the post credits scene it would be A.

We’re gonna have to agree to disagree. The MCU is full of plot contrivances so that doesn’t sell me. I walked out perfectly satisfied. Fury was an alien you say? Doesn’t change the movie at all for me. More of a treat for MCU fans, I think. Then again I haven’t seen CM yet so maybe that would change things. *shrug*

[MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie]

Watched it a second time and loved it even more.

 

The action in the entire film is top-notch, IMO.  Pitting Spidey vs. hundreds of drones is just such a perfect vehicle to display his quickness and agility.  (I also love that for about 30 seconds during the battle Spidey is literally on fire.)

 

Paid closer attention to the dialogue in the post-credit scene this time (was just shocked at processing Fury and Hill as Skrulls to hear much of it the first time) and it's really just about how embarrassed Talos is that, as a shapeshifter who spends his time fooling other people, he was taken in by Mysterio, and not wanting to have to admit that to Fury. 

 

Ben Mendelsohn's Talos is without a doubt one of my top 5 favorite characters all-time in the MCU.  I hope he's around for the next decade.

 

I do think the mid-credit scene should have just been the end of the film.  I noticed a lot of general audience viewers who expect the credit scenes to be just fun little things or not that important just got up and left.  This one being the actual end of the film should probably have been placed as such, especially since it's a parallel to how the Homecoming film proper ended.

Edited July 4, 2019 by MyMovieCanBeatUpYourMovie

[BK007]

The problem is it doesn't make for a good standalone movie. Nick Fury was acting like an idiot and the explanation is? Some space shit? Not good enough. 

 

But that's just it, idiot Nick Fury fit perfectly into this movie when all the characters except Peter were wasted by borderline incompetent writing. As Daxtreme said, all of them became caricatures. Mysterio and the rejected Stark employees, Fury, Hill, MJ, Ned, Ned's GF, Brad, the teachers, Happy and May. It was excessive. Those teachers would never be employed being as imbecilic as they were. It's just awful attempts at humour.

 

And baumer, I agree with you that the relationship would be the strongest point of the movie, but it was wasted because they needed to tick off the boxes for generic villain, generic motivation and generic action scenes. I would've watched a 500 Days of Summer Spiderman but no one else would. The fallout from the snap is a much more interesting storyline that will never be told now. 

 

And keep in mind that most of the audience is casual and have no idea of all the stuff that was thrown about in the first 8 pages of this thread. That, and no one cares. I don't care about Mysterio being true to the comic book if Mysterio makes for an uninteresting, generic villain. 

[Legion Again]

8 minutes ago, Pure Spirit said:

Then again I haven’t seen CM yet so maybe that would change things. *shrug*

Well fucking lol, no wonder then    

 

It’s clearly a set up for CM2, but also plays with stuff from CM1. If you just skipped that then yeah, won’t really connect.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Thanos Legion