A2 WEEKEND THREAD | 134.1M DOM OW | Thurs 17m / Fri 36m / Sat 45m / Sun 36m

[LinksterAC]

4 minutes ago, ZattMurdock said:

People incredibly underplay why people go in droves for Marvel, DC and Star Wars films. It’s not to avoid spoilers alone. That plays a part, but isn’t really the true reason. It’s the same reason why people flocked to Jurassic World, or why they flocked to watch Top Gun Maverick. Connection. It’s not about OMG IT LOOKS AMAZING IN THE BIG SCREEN. The technology evolved so much that today a videogame looks as good as full blown films. Looking ‘good’ isn’t good enough anymore.

Why can't it be about both?

 

And I tend to think of the Avatar movies so far as not "OMG IT LOOKS AMAZING" as much as "I simply can't have this experience anywhere but here."

[MovieMan89]

1 minute ago, ZattMurdock said:

You say that like it’s a good thing lmao.

It certainly always has been for Cameron films. 

[Eric Prime]

31 minutes ago, stephanos13 said:

 

You either watch Avatar in theaters (once, twice, whatever times) and watch it on streaming when available or you don't watch it all.

 

There is no such thing "I will wait to watch Avatar on streaming". No you won't...!!!

I mean if a movie “needs” to be seen on the big screen to be good…then that means the movie isn’t good. Not the selling point you are making it out to be.

[Mulder]

2 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

It certainly always has been for Cameron films. 

You think people have no connection to Terminator or Titanic?

[LinksterAC]

1 minute ago, Eric The Last Airbender said:

I mean if a movie “needs” to be seen on the big screen to be good…then that means the movie isn’t good. Not the selling point you are making it out to be.

Which is why live sporting events have no spectators ever? 😁

[MovieMan89]

2 minutes ago, Eric The Last Airbender said:

I mean if a movie “needs” to be seen on the big screen to be good…then that means the movie isn’t good. Not the selling point you are making it out to be.

Titanic and A1 would not have had historical WOM if you took away the theatrical experience. They just wouldn’t. That format does make or break certain movies.

[Mulder]

Just now, LinksterAC said:

Which is why live sporting events have no spectators ever? 😁

There is a massive difference between movies and sporting events.

[Verrows]

5 films over $1,000,000.

3 films (wide releases) over $1,000 PTA.

 

Yikes. Get me to 2023 already.

[ZattMurdock]

Just now, MovieMan89 said:

It certainly always has been for Cameron films. 

We are not in Kansas anymore, Dorothy.

 

 

1 minute ago, LinksterAC said:

Why can't it be about both?

 

And I tend to think of the Avatar movies so far as not "OMG IT LOOKS AMAZING" as much as "I simply can't have this experience anywhere but here."

Competition isn’t just the movies anymore, it isn’t just streaming. It’s everything: games, social media, TikTok, YouTube, podcasts, what have you. 
 

With so much competition, there isn’t anything that compensates incredibly long windows. @TwoMisfitsis correct that Paramount likely had schedule movie theater runs that benefitted both the movie theater chains and the studio, but the game has changed radically. With this market, having people that go in droves for your film is actually your best case scenario. I’m sure that Avatar 2 will have a terrific run for today’s market, but you can’t expect that Cameron won’t be affected by the today’s market environment. There isn’t any piece of media that needs to be consumed a certain way anymore. 

[LinksterAC]

5 minutes ago, Mulder said:

There is a massive difference between movies and sporting events.

Tell me more.

 

Edit:

 

I do agree there are massive differences, but I'm not sure they're necessarily disqualifying of the comparison I made.

Edited December 19, 2022 by LinksterAC

[M37]

At 173 pages, I'm signing off of this crazy weekend thread

 

But I wish all of you well on your upcoming journey (no matter how far down the path each of you may be)

 

Pls don't ban me @XXR 5x OW or Bust

[shachi86]

6 minutes ago, LinksterAC said:

Which is why live sporting events have no spectators ever? 😁

 

This might be a hot take, but imo sporting events and concerts look better on a TV than in the audience.

[Deep Wang]

2 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

Right. So goes back to my original point that I think great legs will come. What incentive was there for the causal GA to rush out on a December OW for it? Exactly what “spoilers” did A1 set up that people HAD to know the payoff of right away? None is the very clear answer. 

 

I think you misunderstand what I was trying to say. 

 

You only get one shot at being shocked and surprised and wowed at something you've never seen before.  That happened when everyone went to the first one.  I remember telling everyone and even taking different friends with me on my other trips.  

 

By default, you are going to Avatar 2 with the express purpose to be blown away by the experience.  It's a lot easier to surpass your expectations if you have none.  

 

I know Jimbo and plenty of others will argue that is has more than enough wow factor, but well, we will never agree on anything regarding this movie lol.  

 

[Mulder]

Just now, LinksterAC said:

Tell me more.

 

Edit:

 

I do agree there are massive differences, but I'm not sure they're necessarily disqualifying of the comparison I made.

While I do think the experience is a big part of seeing a movie, I think with sports a lot of it is being able to see your favorite players up close and being a part of history. I don't think a lot of movies have that same appeal in terms of being a part of history/seeing history unfold before your eyes and there is no appeal like seeing your favorite players play.

[ThomasNicole]

I think is extremelly reductive thinking the success of Avatar 1 (and 2) is mainly about the VFX quality. 

 

I mean, yes, i'm sure A2 won't shock everyone with it's VFX like A1 manage to do it, but it have to?

 

Good VFX alone isn't the reason for repeat viewings and emotional connection people had with this movies. Is the amazing experience itself, which sure depends of the VFX but also passes through the unstopabble Cameron direction, the mesmerizing design works, the masterful worldbuilding of it all. 

 

This is what made A1 have insane legs, not the pure technical fact that people looked on screen and think "oh that looks great", this doesn't sustain a movie for 3 hours, not in 2009, even less in 2022. 

 

A2 won't have the same technical jump the previous movie had, but it mantain all the other way more important aspects that made A1 turn into a huge success. 

 

The proof is that despite having "less shocking CGI", A2 audience reception is great, so yeah, there's certainly more than impressive VFX there to grab the audience. 

Edited December 19, 2022 by ThomasNicole

[Mr Roark]

TWOW is a very good film even on an iPad, but on a huge big screen in 3D is an immersive collective cinematic experience like no other director can even dare to imagine. Simple as that.

[Mulder]

Just now, ThomasNicole said:

I think is extremelly reductive thinking the success of Avatar 1 (and 2) is mainly about the VFX quality. 

 

I mean, yes, i'm sure A2 won't shock everyone with it's VFX like A1 manage to do it, but it have to?

 

Good VFX alone isn't the reason for repeat viewings and emotional connection people had with this movies. Is the amazing experience itself, which sure depends of the VFX but also passes through the unstopabble Cameron direction, the mesmerizing design works, the masterful worldbuilding of it all. 

 

This is what made A1 have insane legs, not the pure technical fact that people looked on screen and think "oh that looks great", this doesn't sustain a movie for 3 hours, not in 2009, even less in 2022. 

 

A2 won't have the same technical jump the previous movie had, but it mantain all the other way more important aspects that made A1 turn into a huge success. 

 

The proof is that despite all that, A2 audience reception is great, so yeah, there's certainly more than impressive VFX to grab the audience. 

People are bringing up the VFX because that's what a lot of the defenders are bringing up as a counterpoint to why its OW wasn't high.

[LinksterAC]

1 minute ago, shachi86 said:

 

This might be a hot take, but imo sporting events and concerts look better on a TV than in the audience.

I agree with you. But I still like going to live events because it's a qualitatively *different* (as opposed to superior/inferior) experience.

[Dale Cooper]

2 minutes ago, Eric The Last Airbender said:

I mean if a movie “needs” to be seen on the big screen to be good…then that means the movie isn’t good. Not the selling point you are making it out to be.

I don't think this is true at all. The qualities that Avatar brings to the table is absolutely real qualities, it's just that they are highlighted when it's seen on the big screen. After all, movies are a visual medium, it's absolutely relevant in what kind of setting you see it in. It doesn't really make it less of a good movie (although, that is up to everyone to determine).

 

But it kind of is like this with music as well, when the music is very prouction heavy. Take Loveless as an example, one of the very best albums ever made - listen to that on a set of mediocre speakers and it's probably not gonna sound that good because they won't be able to bring forth the layers and textures in the music. Does that make it any less good? No, rather the contrary actually, it just makes you even more impressed with how they actually did what they did. And before anyone jumps on me: I'm not comparing Loveless to Avatar - Loveless is one of the very best pieces of rock music ever created, Avatar is nowhere near that level, it's just serves as an example.

[Eric Prime]

10 minutes ago, MovieMan89 said:

Titanic and A1 would not have had historical WOM if you took away the theatrical experience. They just wouldn’t. That format does make or break certain movies.

I mean I only ever saw Titanic at home and it’s one of my favorite movies ever. I also saw Avatar for the first time at home and fell in love with it. And seeing it in IMAX 3D didn’t change my emotions either. Don’t think I’m alone in saying this stuff, but whatever.